Interviewee: William W War: South Korea and Vietnam Branch: Army Unit: He just said he was in the infantry.

Service Location: South Korea - Enlisted by choice but didnt really want to go. Vietnam - Enlisted and choose to go. Rank: DOB:!"#"$#!%&! Place of birth: 'ew (rleans) *ouisiana Interviewers: +eta ,harernsu-) .olly /unnion) and Alicia Valade0 Date: !"#!1#!2 Location: Veterans Village of San /iego Transcribed by3 +eta ,harernsu-) .olly /unnion) and Alicia Valade0 Date: !"#!$#!2 +,3 +eta ,harernsu./3 .olly /unnion AV3 Alicia Valade0 WW3 William W

WW3 Seniors4 5s this too noisy out here 5 just dont li-e) you -now) its hot in there. So uhhh) which one of ya is leading ./3 Whoe6ers the least shy. 5s it recording +,3 5ts been recording for li-e a minute all ready. WW3 (-ay) Alicia +eta 7sna8s his fingers9 .olly: 5 gotta ;uestion for yall. Any of you got anyone in the ser6ice right now ./3 'ot right now AV3 'o +,3 'o WW3 (-ay. .ay 5 see the list of ;uestions +han- you. +,3 Would you li-e to state the date for us AV3 +oday is4 ./3 5s it the !1
th

WW3 5ts the !1

th

AV3 +oday is the !1 of4 /ecember "<!2 and we are at4

th

WW3 VVS/ ./3 Veterans Village in San /iego AV3 Veterans Village San /iego AV3 K) you want to as- the ne=t ;uestion-first ;uestion +,3 So) uhhh) What war did you - were you in) uhhh right) ya4 WW3 Well) 5 enlisted in !%1> and on my first tour of duty 5 went to ----? in @ort Aol-) *ouisiana. So 5 was going into the infantry and they sent me to @ort Aol-. +he marines do it a little different) but in the army your .(S) your military occu8ation) if you sent to a curtain 8ost) they would 8retty much tell you what you are going to do. 5n my case) going to @ort Aol-) 5 was going to be in the infantry. @ort Benning3 the infantry. Cuys going into artillery would be sent to @ort Sill. @ort Sill) (-lahoma. @ellas going into tan-s went to) uhhh) @ort Kno=) Kentuc-y. So on and so forth. After 5 got through my training) they sent me D 5 had no choice- but they sent me to South Korea. And 54 5 was in South Korea and what 5 did there was to 8atrol around the border between 'orth and South Korea. A lot of 8eo8le here) in this country) are not

aware of it) but e6en though the Korean was su88osedly ended in !%&2) its- there was ne6er a 8eace or a surrender or anything else) oh no D its a cease fire) so a state of war still e=ists. And e6ery once in a green while the 'orth Koreans will D theyll get funny# do something funny. So we ne6er actually sto88ed) right now. After !2 months of that) 5 came bac- to the Enited States and they sent me to @ort Benning- @ort Benning) Ceorgia. And 5 was there for) 5 guess) about a month D month and a half. And 5 reenlisted) 5 tried to 6olunteer) but they wouldnt let me do it D its cause 5m an only son. So 5 6olunteered - 5 reenlisted to go to Vietnam. And 5 went there for !" months. 5 started out with second field force down in) uhhh) in 6-) uhhh) ya ----Vung +au----+ree *og +ri Vinh----? for about three and a half months.And then 5 transferred u8 'orth to) uhhh) second core - !%1 light infantry. We o8erated out of----,huli) dung hi) gung mi----. And we were transferred u8 to ----denang---- and we were wor-ing alongside the third marines) in the a shau 6alley ---- 5 finished my tour with them. 5 returned to the states. 5 still had !> months in the army left) so 5 had to go to @ort Worth) +e=as. Second army di6ision. And after my second tour in the ser6ice) second tour o6erseas) 5 decided that this was not the career for me D its a little ris-y. So D 7laughs9 D 5m gonna go do something else. And 5 got out. And 5 fut0ed around uhhh D here and there. 5 miss doing that. 5m from 'ew (rleans originally D thats) thats my home 'ew (rleans. So 5 want to go to seaand 5) 5m a retired merchant marine seaman also. 5 did stay "< years in Scri88s ----? So thats uhhh4 78ause9 Anything else 7Aause9 ./3 /o you ha6e something that would be a good luc- charm WW3 Hummm ./3 /o you ha6e a good luc- charm or something you do4 7cut off9 WW3 (h: We had a -id named Foscoe4 5 forget what his last name is. And we use to ma-e fun of him because he had the Buddha) he had about a half a do0en different saints) he had the Star of /a6id) and he had some other jun- around his nec-. And we use to) we use to tease him D we said D ya -now) youre clin-en and clan-en out there) ----? going to hear you. He said- 'o 5m co6ering all my bases. Ga hes4 ya4 7Aause9 ./3 So did you ha6e any good luc- charms4 7interru8ted9 WW3 .e ./3 4 yourself WW3 'o. 'o4 5 didnt ha6e anything47Aause94 Ga see) its -inda li-e uhhh4 7Aause94 +rying to thin- about this4 ./3 5s it hard to tal- about WW3 Huh ./3 5s it hard to tal- about something

WW3 5ts been a long time4 7Aause94 Well lets see 7loo-s at 8a8er9. What was the food li-e4 Gou -now the guys use to4 @ood wasnt really all that bad. , rations. +he thing about , rations is there hea6y as hell. 5ts li-e D you want to go cam8 D you can go to ---- or FE5 er some 8lace and 8ic- u8 all this wonderful) modern) free0edried chowH 8ut it in your 8ac- and it weighs hardly anything. (r you can go down for @ood-I-*ess and start throwing in cans of beans and cans of 8eaches and cans of this and cans of that. +hats why toting , rations is li-e D because you got to carry4 +hey wanted you to carry# it was 8rescribed to carry enough for three meals a day. 'eedless to say) after a cou8le of days youd wise u8 real ;uic- and youd only carry enough to -ee8 you going. .e 5d got it down to a science where 5d carry with me one can of beans) can of beef stew) can a 8eaches) some crac-ers) some coffee) some sugar) and4 maybe a bag of rice. Be li-e the Vietnamese3 eat rice. Ga -now) carry bag of rice. 5n the V' thats what you do3 you carry a bag of rice. +hey li6e off the land3 why cant we do the same Because) rule of thumb is) what weighs one 8ound in the morning when you set out will weigh about !<< 8ounds in the e6ening. +hen you learn something4 +he main thing you want to worry about carrying is ammunition) e=8losi6es) and water. Because4 you get in a fire fight you can throw all the cans of beans you want really going to do any good3 you got to throw bullets. Gou with me on that 7Aause9 +he food D 5 use to D When 5 was in South Korea4 +hat) that tour of duty was 6ery interesting because4 5 was able to really4 get close to the 8eo8le. Gou -now) 5 D in my time off 5 would get amongst the South Koreans. +ry to learn about these 8eo8le) study them) try to get to -now them. +ry to figure out why they are where they are) why they do what they do. .ost of the time they were 8retty friendly) because they understood we were in their country to try to hel8 them. @or the South Vietnamese this was not easy to do because uhhh4 these 8oor 8eo8le are4 li-e) 5 dont -now) ya -now. When you go into someones country and youre not really in6ited) you cant really e=8ect them to ta-e a ----?by you. +hats D thats the way it wor-s there) ya see. Su88osedly we were there to hel8 them defeat the communists) thats the reason 5 went there D 5 6olunteered for thatH 5 didnt get drafted. 5 didnt ha6e to go to that 8lace. But when 5 got there 5 disco6ered that things were a little bit4 not4 e=actly li-e they say it is4 78ause9 well4 ummm4 A lot of times 5 felt4 5 was intruding4 7sniff94 were su88osed to hel8ing them but4 you -now4 you -now) you dro8 the bombs on these 8eo8le4 And they) you -now) they4 they hold you res8onsible. +hey hold you res8onsible4 78ause94 7sniff94 So4 AV3 Hummmm4 What was your job WW3 Hummm AV3 What was your assignment or job WW3 Well 5 had se6eral4 When 5 first got there 7sniff9 5 was just regular infantry. WW3 And 5 did that for oh) about " and a half months) and one of the fellas from the 8ic- team was a big gunner) had a machine gun .-1<. We called it a 8ig because the son of uh4 the thing weighed as much as that roc- o6er there. 5t was hard to

mo6e around and when you start 8o88ing away and ate u8 the ammunition just li-e a 8ig eats4 li-e a 8ig. So 5 did that) did that for a while) then after 2 months) they switched me o6er to Crenadier And thats when this new wea8on came out) called a two-o-three Eh its an .-!1 with a little tube underneath the uh) the barrel and thats where the grenade goes in) its li-e a big fat bullet) thats what it is) let me see your thing 5ll draw it for ya. Jdrawing bulletJ Kust li-e a bullet) only its li-e) its li-e that) and when it fired it would bloomp) they used to call them bloo8ers) and 5 was a Crenadier +hese are 8eo8le who 8ut su88ressing fire down. And in my last 5 guess two months 5 wound u8 in a job that was really) really4 +hey has me uh) what they call the mi-e al8ha guy uh mi-e al8ha mechanical ambush) you ta-e a claim war and a claim war has about a 8ound of ---- in it) its li-e +'+ and its fired with electrical blasting ca8s) blasting ca8s ----? then the cord goes to a battery and thats connected to a cloc- li-e this) and when it goes off it throws off all these ball bearings. 5ts a mine) but you dont stic- it in the ground) you dont bury it) and its a mine. Gou dont stic- it in the groundH you dont bury it in the ground. ----Gou just stic- it u8. Gou can tie it against the wall) or anything. And my job was to ta-e one or two of these things and 5d ta-e them out there and instead of setting it u8 right---- 5 would 8o8 it off this way. 5d use a rattra8 and ---- battery. And 5 had one in such a way that the wires from the mine were going to4 rat tra8) with a little steel 8late o6er here and a little steel 8late under here. +hese wires are going through the ----of the battery. What -ee8s the circuit from going off is to ha6e tri8 wire going across there) so if somebody would wal-4 and at the end of the tri8 wire its tied u8 to a bush or a treeLsomething li-e that. And the other end is tied u8 to a little 8lastic s8oon. 5ts li-e what you eat your cereal withLa s8oon. And wed set that inside in between jars and tra8) that -ee8s the electrical current from running through) and when somebody wal-s through there) then it4 then it goes off) and thats what 5 did. 5 would loo- around) uh throughout the day as were 8atrolling around) mo6ing around) 5m loo-ing for 8laces) that 5 -now they would be coming) or 5 sus8ect that they would be coming) or 5 see a sign) uh) you -now- 5 thin- this would be a 8robable 8lace) and 5 would set this thing off and 5 would sit there all night long and wait for it to go off. 5f it didnt go off 5 would go bac-) and disarm this thing and go bac- on my site and wait for the ne=t guy. ./3 /id you bring anything bac- with you WW3 /id 5 bring anything bac./3 Geah) either 8hysical or good memory WW3 .ementos) things li-e that We you -now) the guys4 5 brought bac- a few things) 5 had a lighter) it had the unit slogan on it and all that but 5 didnt bring much bac-) being in the infantry. +he guys bac- in the rear you -now 8laces li-e long Van ,ameron Bay) /on wah uh) Wong +ao these big bases) they li6ed in buildings) they li6ed well) they did alright) but those of us in the field we didnt li6e li-e that. And when we come bac- in for a stand down they just throw you in and say there) thats

where you stay for a cou8le of days) two three days whate6er. +hen you go) you ha6e no 8lace to -ee8 things in) you -ee8 things in your bag) but ;uite often youd lea6e and your ----bag is su88ose to be loc-ed u8 and secure) and then those bastards would go in and steal things) and there would be li-e nice cameras) stereos) this and that. Gou ha6e 8ut it in storage then you come bac- and its stolen4 stolen you -now Why e6en bother. So no 5 didnt bring much bac-. 5 didnt bring much bac-) 5 brought bac- my ---- and my boots) and 5 had a rice -nife. we call it a rice -nife) uh) it was a Vietnamese tool) it loo-ed -ind of li-e machete but it was thinner. +he reason 5 8ic-ed that thing out was because) we had machetes for cutting our way through) but they werent worth anything you -now +his Vietnamese rice tool was efficient) it was a much more efficient tool) 5 brought that bac-. +hats about it. 5 didnt bring anything bac- from South Korea either. But 5 had some 6ery 6ery good memories thereH 5 had 6ery good times there. ./3 What were they WW3 Huh ./3 What were they WW3 Well you -now 5m from 'ew (rleansH its flat) as flat as a 8anca-e) and some if it was on sea le6el. We dont ha6e mountains) we dont ha6e hills. All my life) e6er since 5 was a little -id 56e been fascinated by mountains) hills) climbing) and all that -ind of stuff. +hen 5 got to Korea and 5 was surrounded by mountains) and the guys said 5 was nuts because what do we do when were on duty Were hum8ing u8 and down these mountains) and what do 5 do when we get off of duty 5 got out and 5 hum8 u8 and down the mountains) cause 5) 5 thought it was a blast. 5 learned how) 5 learned mountaineering) 5 e6en got in6ol6ed in a little club it was) it was s8onsored by the s8ecial ser6ices) they try to get you -now C5s and Koreans to interact with each other) it was a mountaineering club. And 5 go out and climb with these 8eo8le) and 5 had a good time) 5 thought it was a blast. 5t was. .emories li-e that were 6ery 6ery good. 5 uh) that was the first time 5 e=8erienced hea6y snow and bli00ards and all this you -now 5 was) Kesus man you -now this is a ball 5 li-e this) and they thought 5 was nuts cause 5 was out 8laying in the snow) but that was an e=8erience for me) it was a good e=8erience. E6en in you -now. +he thing about South Vietnam was) 5) once 5 went to a 8lace called Wong ,hau 'wee /am) two little towns right along the coast) and 5 thought they were some of the 8rettiest 8laces 5 ha6e e6er seen) and later 5 found out that when the @rench were there bac- in the I<s and &<s these were resorts. *i-e thier little) uh what do you call it Eh) thier little Fi6iera. Gou -now beautiful) beautiful beaches A lot of terrain 5 saw there 5 thought was stunning) absolutely stunning) 6ery 6ery rugged 6ery harsh but unbelie6able) just) you -now) tro8ical or something. Stuff li-e what you would see in King Kong mo6ies) just unbelie6able) incredible. 5 li-e hi-ing) cam8ing) uh ad6enture things li-e this) so that a88ealed to me. 5 thought that it was real 8ity that this terrible fighting was going on. 5 mean you -now 5 tried to get close to the South Vietnamese 8eo8le) it was 6ery

difficult. 5 do remember a guy named +ran) he was a -it carson scout we had. -it carson) bac- in 11) 1$ they started this 8rogram called ,hu Hua) ,hu Hua is Vietnamese it roughly means 5 surrender) 5 gi6e u8) you -now that -ind of thing. And what it was) it was ta-ing guys who were Viet ,ong militia) hard core 'VA) and they had been ca8tured or they had just surrendered on their own. So li-e we had enough) we dont belie6e in communism) we dont. We) we dont you -now want to) we dont) we dont subscribe to that anymore. And they would indoctrinate them and gi6e them American outfits as -it carson scouts. So they would come out with us and theyre in the front leading us through areas that they would -now. 5 used to wonder about that because 5 became real close to a guy named +ran. Eh) a cou8le of years later when Vietnam fell bac- in $&) 5 often wondered about what ha88ened to +ran. ,ause you -now hes a mar-ed man) hes a trader) hes a trader to the communist. And now that South Vietnam has fallen theyre going to hunt him down li-e a dog) and Cod -nows what theyre going to do to him) thats that. +ran taught me ;uite a bit4 Anything else you want to -now about me) 5 dont -now what to tell you. 5) 5 dont want to get into combat and all that because its not going to do you any good) its not going to do you any good. 5t uh4 some 8eo8le li-e that cra8. Some 8eo8le they flourish in that sort of thing) they enjoy that -ind of thing. .ost @ellas 5 thinthey) once they find out how ugly it is) well you -now) you do what you do and you get out of there) you get the hell out of there) you get it done. Gou do things that are not nice) you just feel guilty. Gou just want to get it o6er with. 5 dont glorify that cra8) 5 dont) and 5 dont do that. Eh) 5 dont wear anything that denotes that 5 was in6ol6ed in that) 5 rarely rarely e6er go to any -ind of uh) function. 5 tal- to my friends because were there) we understand you -now) but being around ci6ilians its uh) its aw-ward. +al-ing to you -ids) well youre not -ids) um) well youre going to be out of high school soon. 5n my day you guys would be) well youMre ready to hit the bric-s) youre off and running) youre out seeing the world. And in these 8laces 5 was in) -ids who were oh) !!) !<) !") !2 years old) theyre already adults. +hey6e seen things) they6e done things) and they6e e=8erienced things that are just mind-boggling. Kust on an e6eryday basis4 5ts hard to4 to relate to you. 5t wasnt always terribleH 5 mean you see a lot of stu8idity in situations li-e that. A lot of stu8idity) a lot of foolishness) a lot of silliness. Em it ma-es you wonder just who the hell is leading this gang of idiots /o these 8eo8le -now what the hell theyre doing Em4 you -now for) for a young ---- now theres so many women in the ser6ice. A lot of times going into the ser6ice is) it was -ind of li-e this. +o me it was a combination of 5 also -new 5 was going to go in because e6eryone one else had been in) and in my 8art of the country) those idiots down there they thin- e6ery time this country gets into a war we got to run in there) uh from the south) their nuts li-e that. So it was a 8atriotic thing) but 8art of it too was uh) 8eo8le coming from a bac-ground where theyre 8oor or um) they donMt -now what to do with themsel6es) or they dont ;uite fit in) ordinary li-e so to s8ea-. +hey go into the ser6ice and they find their niche) they find) they find a way to bring themsel6es u8 uh) they find a way to tra6el. +ra6el you -now) 5 tra6eled ;uite a bit) and 5 enjoyed that. But its such a harsh) its a 6ery harsh) uh its 6ery harsh. 5 thin- a lot of times) uh well) they dont ha6e the draft anymore) when 5 was in the draft) we were getting guys who were from the ghettos) guys who were jer-ed out of their second year of college) we were getting guys who had just gotten married and had one -id on the way) they were ta-ing e6erybody) so you were getting a 8retty broad mi=. But uh) its such a harsh) harsh) harsh en6ironment its

basically when you do battle 72<3"&9 +hats when you really find out) and its a 6ery cruel) thats the thing) uh4 it has to be done sometimes) li-e what ha88ened with the Cermans and the 'a0is) what ha88ened in Korea bac- in !%&!) we jum8ed across) we ste88ed in to re8el them sometimes it has to be done) its an ugly) ugly thing) and it -ind of whac-s you out a little bit) it gets you a little screw. 5 was actually 8retty luc-y when 5 got out of the ser6ice) 5 got out with an honorable and all that cra8 you -now) went to college for a little while) didnt -now what the hell 5 was doing) roaming around) bouncing around) and when 5 starting going to sea) you -now) on the shi8s 5) 5 found a 8lace where 5 can decom8ress. ,ause 5 hadnt decom8ressed yet) when 5 came bac- from o6erseas) it was on air8lane tri8 5 was in the field until " days 8rior to lea6ing) and boom 5m bac- here. And these 8eo8le here they had no conce8tion) done) done and the Vietnamese thing was also an un8o8ular war so we were not well recei6ed. 5 dont hold it against them) 5 did) 5 did for a long time 5 did. We couldnMt hel8 it) they cant hel8 it) they dont -now. 5m glad the fellas4 5m glad the 8eo8le was warmer to the 8eo8le coming bac- now are much better recei6ed li-e this little grou8 you got going on right here) youre trying to find out what) what ma-es us clicand all thatL5 a88reciate that. But youll actually donMt really -now until you go) you understand what 5 mean. Eh) you -now) 5 was tal-ing to someone4 its li-e saying you -now telling a 8regnant woman) oh gee wi0) 5 -now how you feel) no you dont) no you damned sure dont until you carry this thing around for nine months and 8oo8 out a bas-etball then youll -now JlaughingJ Gou see what 5m saying Gou understand what 5 mean +hats) thats what its li-e) you just dont -now. 5ts uh) there was this) this) 5 had a lot of funny times that ha88ened to me but the 8roblem is) 5 cant tal- about it because its not the -ind of stuff you can tal- about with mi=ed com8any. Gou -now what 5 meanH you -now what 5m tal-ing about) that -ind of thing) you with me Gou dont say stuff li-e this in front of your grandma. AV3 (h) yeah JgigglesJ WW3 Stories li-e that. Gou) you understand right But uh4 5m glad 5 did it) and so far its funny how) how its really li-e. And 5m glad 5 made an effort to try to defeat the communist. 5 still feel li-e the communist are there e6en though the only communist we ha6e left are those idiots in ,uba and the ,hinese) the ,hinese 8eo8le) WW3 and thats not really truly communism... its ... its something really different 5... 5 dont belie6e in dictatorshi8s. 5 dont belie6e in them. 5 dont uhh... 5 dont su88ort dictatorshi8 of any fashion or form. Whether its 'a0is) ,ommunists) or uhh... Saddam Hussein) or those cra0y 8eo8le in Africa that uh) butcher their own 6illagers and all that-- 5 dont su88ort any of that. And if you do ha6e to get nasty with them to sto8 it) then so be it ) you shouldnt let it go on and on and on and on. Gou better -now what youre doing before you go in there. WW3 Am 5 ma-ing any sense to you

AV3 Geah WW3 Anything else ./3 Emm) when did you come to San /iego WW3 +he first time 5 came to San /iego was -ind of funny. 5t was in 1>. And 5 just got in tune with my training. 5 went homeH 5 stayed with my grandmother for about4 5 had a 2<-day lea6e and 5 only too- about !& because 56e ne6er been west of +e=as4 56e ne6er been west. And 5 wanted to see the western 8art of +he Enited States because 56e been fascinated with whats ----?. So 5 left home early4 and came out here on the tour4 and 5 was touring through the western states. Gou -now) 5 8assed through San /iego) *os Angeles) all through ,alifornia. Because 5 went o6erseas through ----) Washington which is way u8 by Seattle. Bac- in those days when youd tra6el) you would ha6e to wear a uniform of the day) you -now) a class A uniform. ,lass A is youre your dress uniform4 And it changes. Gou -now) for us) in the wintertime it was the dar- green suit with a tie4 and a little ca8 li-e this. Silly brass things on the collar) blac- shoes. +he 'a6y boys would ha6e that little Cracker Jack outfit) the one with the blue jum8er and white hats. +he .arines with their oli6e ----. Well) this is a 'a6y town) and its a .arine town. Bac- then) in front of Broadway Street) all that area) well now its high rise buildings) and nice sho8s) and this and that and e6erything. Well) it wasnt li-e that bac- then. 5t was a bunch of stri8 joints) and bar rooms) greasy s8oons) and tattoo 8arlors) and cli8 jointsLall this jun-. And they wouldnt let me go into any of these 8laces cause 5 was only !$ years old. So all 5 could do while waiting for the bus) was wal- u8 and down and u8 and down... And while 5 was doing that) 5 was the only soldier around4 So the .arines and 'a6y guys were ma-ing fun of meL5 couldnt wait to get bacon the bus. And thats) that was my first dose of San /iegoLyou -now. And when my second wife brought me out hereL5 met her in 'ew (rleansLshe ----'a6y housing. We came out here in !%><4 >&. And 5 wor-ed for a tugboat com8any for about a year and then our last time with Scri88s institute of (ceanogra8hy. And 5 wor-ed there from !%>& until "<<& when 5 retired. And thats how 5 wound u8 here. 5 didnt really want to come hereLSouthern ,alifornia. 5 li-e 'orthern ,alifornia) 5 li-e (regon) 5 li-e Washington State) and 5 li-e it u8 in .ontana) 5daho. But down here) its) you -now) its too many 8eo8le) its too e=8ensi6e) its tooLjust the "< years 56e been here in San /iego) 56e seen this 8lace Jma-es e=8losi6e soundJLe=8lode: 5ts e=8loded) and its4 +he 8lace 5 used to go hi-eLyou -now) .ission +rails) o6er by .ission CorgeL Gou familiar with that AV3 Geah WW3 Gou been out there AV3 Geah

WW3 5 used to go out there when 5 first found it. 5d ta-e my dogs) and 5d be out there all day longLall by myself. Hardly see anybody. +hey still got deer going through there. 5 saw bobcats twice. Gou -now) nobody went out there. +hey had their roadH it was a two-lane road. Gou can s8end a day out there and no one would bother you. 5d ta-e the dogsH let them off their leash. Gou could go out there at night. And now) well they ha6e rangers and its not the same. 5ts getting too ci6ili0ed4 and its getting 6ery e=8ensi6e. AV3 Ha6e you been to any of the areas li-e 7Gos-mitty9. +,3 7Go-sem-it-E9: WW3 Gosemite Ges. Whatd you say 7Koes-metty9 AV3 7Gos-mitty9. JlaughsJ WW3 Geah) Gosemite. Geah) its 8retty u8 there. But at Gosemite) you cant get in unless you go through +ic-et master) and you get a tic-et. AV3 Feally WW3 Geah AV3 Whoa) 56e ne6er been. WW3 +hats the way it is now... Geah. WW3 +hese other 8laces out here) you might not be aware of this) but if you want to go out into the ,le6eland 'ational @orest) and just 8ar- and go roam around. 5f you dont ha6e a wilderness 8ass on your 6ehicle) youll get tic-eted. AV3 Feally WW3 5 used to buy it by the year. 2& buc-s a year. Geah) just to go out into the wilderness. +hats uh4 AV3 +hats wrong. WW3 Geah) you -now) thats -ind of sad. WW3 What other ;uestions do you want to -now Gou want to -now what... 5 mean) 5ts45 could tell you about the uniforms4 5 could... 54 ./3 Well we also ha6e to do li-e an art 8roject) li-e a little drawing for you.

WW3 /rawing ./3 Geah. And li-e it there anything that sort of symboli0es you (r li-e something4 WW3 Something that symboli0es me ./3 (r li-e something that has s8ecial meaning to you. ./3 /oes it ha6e to do with li-e the military) or4 anything +,3 Kust anything s8ecial. WW3 Anything s8ecial ./3 *i-e 5 -now you tal-ed a lot about hi-ing and hills and all that stuff. ----? WW3 +hatd be a good one4Gu8. Gou dont ha6e to do anything s8ecial for me4 no. Enless) uh4 is it an assignment ./3 .mm) were li-e the three 8eo8le and one other 8erson are the art grou8. ---WW3 (hh) o-ay. Gou 8oor things) you ga6e to me . 5m a4 5m a 6ery sim8le 8erson. 54 5 dont uh4 AV3 Gou say you li-e hi-ing WW3 (h yes) absolutely4 absolutely) yes. 5m an a6id hi-er. 5 used to huntL5 dont hunt anymore. ,anoe) -aya-) all those -inds of things. AV3 So4 /o you recall the day your ser6ice ended WW3 Ges:LAugust "2) !%$2. At4 'ow heres a funny story4 Gou got all -inds of goofy stuff in the ser6ice) you -now) goofy cra8. 5ts li-e in the /5s when you go through basic4 uh boot cam8) as these -nuc-leheads o6er here call it. Gou -now the /5s do all -ind of horrible things to you just to ma-e you miserable. And then they ma-e you do all -inds of bullshitL8ardon my @rench. But there are things we do to irritate them too. And one of them wasH the Nduffle bag drag.O And the only reason 5 did it wasLmy two buddies were bringing me to the gate) when 5 left) when 5 got out... +hey bet me &< buc-s a 8iece that 5 wouldnt do it. &< buc-s bac- in P$2 was a lot of money. So yeah) 5d do it. And what that meant was) you -now) 5m lea6ing) 5m going out) 5m lea6ing the army) 5m done. Cot my 8a8ers) 5 got a discharge) 5 got e6erything. But 5 had to go out the gate in uniform4 5 had to wear my4 uniform. And this is in the summer) so 5m wearing -ha-is. Kha-i shirt) -ha-i trousers) a little garrison ca8. And that meant 5d turn my garrison ca8 li-e real stu8id loo-ing) and just too- the bagLinstead of ha6ing it on my shoulderL5d just dragged the thing and wal-Lli-e 5m a hobo. And 5m going out the gate. And there was two

.As at the gate. (ne of them was a young guy) a A@,) and he got all shoo- u8) and he wanted to sto8 me and arrest me and all this. And the other guy was a sergeant. He was a sergeant) he was a buc- sergeant) he was a blac- guy) and when he saw all this stuff in my4 he says) he says) NWhat are you that guy 5 ----let him do his duffle bag drag.O And that was just a way of sayingH 5m done) finished) 5m done with you 8eo8le. ---AV3 So after4 WW3 Am 5 ma-ing yall ner6ous /id 5 ma-e yall ner6ous AV3 'o) 'o WW3 'o 5 dont want to do that. AV3 So after you ended the ser6ice) or you sto88ed the ser6ice or4 5 dont -now how to say that. Em4 WW3 Gou discharge. AV3 (h o-ay. Em4 did you wor- or go bac- to school WW3 5 did both4 5 did both. Geah 54 and 5 shouldnt ha6e did that because4 54 5 hadnt decom8ressed) 5 hadnt decom8ressed) 5 hadnt. 5 really didnt -now what the hell to do with myself. But in those days) you -now) it was No-ay youre doneO Jsna8sJ) all thats behind youLyou -now) Ngo to school and go to wor-O) because you had the C5 bill) and Nits time to rebuild your life.O +hey didnt understand about how 8eo8le could be a little) you -now) screwy4 A+S/) and all that -ind of uh4 So thats what 5 did) 5 went) 5 was wor-ing full-time at ---- de8artment store) which is4 uh) whats the big shot store here4 Nordstroms AV3 Geah WW3 Where) you -now) all the rich 8eo8le go to waste their money. 'ordstroms. 5 was wor-ing there as a warehousemen4 and at night 5 was ta-ing a full !" credits at junior college) and my major was art. And 5 had these 6isions4 uh) oh: 5m going to disco6er myself4 by drawing. 5ts not that easy) 5 found out its a damn) its a hard ass way to earn a li6ing. And 5 did that for about4 5 guessed one semester) 5 said) o-ay) 5m doneH 5 had enough) 5 just) 5 just too- off. And for about a year) a year and a half) two years) 5 literally) 5 used the e=cuse of loo-ing u8 old army buddies. Actually what 5 was doing is) 5 was just roaming4 5 went all o6er the Enited States. 5 came bac- to ,alifornia) did all -inds of cra0y stuff. Entil 5 went bac- to *ouisiana and started shi88ing off. 5 went on shrim8 boats) and then went on tugboats) su88ly boats. ----?... uh4 coastal touring and freight. And when 5 met my second wife) 5 went into land sur6ey) it was a land sur6eyor. 'ot a sur6eyor) 5 was in6ol6ed in a chainmen) you -now) 8eo8le who mar- out where youre going to 8ut a road) where youMre going to build a house4uh4 where your 8ro8erty corners) where your 8ro8erty line is) how high is this mountain) how wide is it What is the contour in the

mountain) ma-ing ma8s) things li-e that. 5 did that for about almost I years) and then) then when we mo6ed bac- out here) 5 went bac- to sea. And finished u8 by---AV3 /id your military e=8erience enhance of influence your thin-ing of war or about the military in general WW3 5m an old guy) 5ll be 1" on the "$+h of this month) so 5 was born in !%&!. +hats only about 1 years or $ years after WW55 ended. +he neighborhood 5 grew u8 in is full of guys who would4 you -now youd see these mo6ies4 Saving Private Ryan) Bandit Brothers) and all that cra8. 5 was growing u8 with guys who did that. 5 was growing u8 around fellas who would just come bac- from Korea. +he ----) the bad ones. @rom P&< through &2. Gou got these mo6ies out) and they got good comic boo-s) and they got this) and they got that. And then in school and history boo-s) and e6erything is glorious and4 Goure not getting the full story. 5 was getting the full story) not by tal-ing to these fellasL5d as- them a ;uestion and theyd say Nget outta here)O Nget away from me)O Nlea6e me alone)O Ndont be bugging me.O And when 5d listen to them tal- to themsel6es4 when theyre sitting on the bac- 8orch ha6ing a cou8le of beers) or4 5n those daysL'ew (rleans is a funny townH were about 2< or I< years behind the rest of the Enited States. And growing u8 in that time was a lot4 5ll gi6e you an e=am8le) alright. Heres ,lancys Saloon) ,lancys bar roomL 5ts a bar room) its a saloon. And theyd sell ,oca-,ola) theyd sell Se6en-E8) theyd sell candy. And my mom wants some ,o-e. She said) Ngo across the street and go into ,lancysOL5d go in there. 5d go u8 to the bar and say Nmay 5 ha6e a ,oca-,ola) and Nsure.O Gou see what 5 mean AV3 Geah. WW3 And so youre hearing guys4 tal- about their e=8eriences that you dont get in the history boo-s. Goure hearing the real deal4 the real deal. E6en in training) when 5 went through training) all three 5+) all three 5+. +heyre ma-ing us do this and ma-ing us do that and ma-ing us do this and ma-ing us do that. And towards the end of it) theyd say Nyou -now what) all this training has been 8retty nifty) but4 youre going to ha6e to relearn e6erything that you get in the bush) when you get older) because thisLyoure not really ready. Goull learn when you get older) you learn right there. Am 5 ma-ing any sense to you AV3 Geah) yeah. +han- you. +,3 +han- you. ./3 +han- you. 'ot recorded) but wanted to add this in. WW3 Kust remember -ee8 going forward dont listen to the boneheads who will -ee8 trying to steer you in the wrong direction. Wor- hard and try to achie6e something because only you can hel8 yourself