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Al Azif: Is The Necronomicon Real?

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Topic started on 3-9-2012 @ 08:32 PM by Xoanon

Hello again ATS, For some of you, this thread is going to be immediately interesting, but I am afraid that many of you will be left scratching your head wondering, What is a Necronomicon, and why do I care?. Well, there is the strong possibilty that someone you know, maybe one of your children or grandchildren, will someday come waltzing in to the room, all smug with their goth little selves, and slap down a copy of this hoary old grimoire, declaring, Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn!. And you are going to want to know what to do. I hope to give you the ammo here on this thread to Deny Ignorance, should you ever encounter The Necronomicon. For those that do not know and are unaware that there is a problem in the first place: I would suggest that you merely Google (Google spellcheck will, of course, correct your spelling of Necronomicon, if you don't get it right ),
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Is the Necronomicon real?, or something thereabouts, and see what happens. Now, what is it?... The Necronomicon was simply a literary device that H.P. Lovecraft used to enrich his stories, give them depth and gravitas, and to link them together in a meaningful way. H.P.L. Attributed the writing of The Necronomicon to 'Abdul Alhazred', who was a childhood persona developed when Lovecraft was a boy.

Lovecraft actually mentions the tome very few times, and briefly, at that, in his works of fiction. Which is important to know for keeping things in perspective. Lovecraft attracted the admiration of many other writers in his brief stay on Earth, and what became known as "Lovecraft's Circle", quickly developed around him once his stuff started getting published. The circle included Robert E. Howard, Clark Ashton Smith and others.
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And it was this intense fan base, made up greatly of other writers, that propelled the Necronomicon to the level of a literary hoax. And still fuels the preponderance of the legend to this day. Is it real? No. I am going to keep this part short and I am going to draw from two sources: one for Lovecraft's invention, and another for the modern publication that seems to persist in being controversial. As I said, The Necronomicon is entirely the invention of Lovecraft. Abdul Alhazred was a boyhood alter-ego. And I am going to let Howard speak for himself here. These are actual letters written between Robert E. Howard (the creator of the Conan novels) and H.P. Lovecraft...

August 14th, 1930 The Necronomicon of the mad Arab Abdul Alhazred is likewise something which must yet be written in order to possess objective reality. Abdul is a favourite dream-character of mine indeed that is what I used to call myself when I was five years old and a transported devotee of Andrew Langs version of the Arabian Nights. A few years ago I prepared a mock-erudite synopsis of Abduls life, and of the posthumous vicissitudes and translations of his hideous and unmentionable work Al Azif...a synopsis which I shall follow in future references to the dark and accursed thing. Long has alluded to the Necronomicon in some things of hisin fact, I think it is rather good fun to have this artificial mythology given an air of verisimilitude by wide citation." May 7th, 1932 "As for writing the NecronomiconI wish I had the energy and ingenuity to do it! I fear it would be quite a job in view of the very diverse passages and intimations which I have in the course of time attributed to it! I might, though, issue an abridged Necronomiconcontaining such parts as are considered at least reasonably safe for the perusal of mankind!When von Juntzs Black Book and the poems of Justin Geoffrey are on the market, I shall certainly have to think about the immortalisation of old Abdul!" www.hplovecraft.com...

I think that is pretty funny that H.P.L. Seems to have invented the 'Mythos' sense of humor, as well.
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Anyhow, you can all see there plain as dirt that Lovecraft himself had the time and the wherewithal to make it clear that the Necronomicon is purely his own invention and not some ancient text with spells that might protect humanity from the impending onslaught of Cosmic forces and entities that want to make us dinner and steal our planet (which was never ours in the first place). Now, on to the modern version, which is the tougher nut to crack. The Simon Necronomicon.

This is the one that causes problems. It was published in 1977 and is commonly referred to as The Simon Necronomicon. Inside, one discovers that the book is merely introduced by Simon, and Simon denies authorship. This is the one that you may find being carried around by a friend or loved one. Let's take an axe to it, shall we? In short, although he will swear up and down it is not him, the author of the Simon Necronomicon is Peter levenda; yes, the same guy that wrote Sinister Forces. I like him, he is a great guy, and he wrote the book in question. There were a lot of people hanging around a particular book store in the mid to late 70's that was called the Magickal Childe. Peter Levenda was one of them and it was at the magickal Childe bookstore that the Simon Necronomicon was developed. Like I said, there were lots of folks hanging
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around, how do I know? Because one of them was Alan Cabal, who wrote a very good article called The Doom That Came To Chelsea, and in that article, Cabal drops the dime on Simon/Levenda.
edit on 3-9-2012 by Xoanon because: .

reply posted on 3-9-2012 @ 08:40 PM by Xoanon

Ultimately, ATS, the best I can do is to is to hand you the axe and point to the tree, you will have to do the chopping. That is because Simon/Levenda is masterful at damage control and has actually been rather forthcoming, on radio and in print, about his involvement in the Simon Necronomicon. In the end he will say that he was 'involved but did not write the book'. So I am going to let Simon/Levenda go first followed by Alan Cabal. Here is Peter levenda being interviewed by Tracy Twyman at Dagobert's Revenge magazine...

Peter Levenda The story is told, I think, in other places and I have been asked this before -- also on the Internet -- so to summarize: in the 1970s a couple of Eastern Orthodox monks pulled off the biggest rare book heist in the history of the United States. It was a continuing crime, the books being taken from libraries and private collections all over the country (and, it was said, Canada and Mexico). They were finally busted, and did federal time, but most of the books were never recovered. The Necronomicon was part of this swag as were a lot of occult books. It was in Greek, handwritten, but the problem was that much of the Greek was unintelligible. My modest contribution to this was recognizing that some of the Greek was an attempt to phoneticize Babylonian and Sumerian words. I am not one of the people arguing that this Necronomicon is THE Necronomicon, or that Lovecraft was even aware that it existed. I think Lovecraft heard the name through one of his friends in the Golden Dawn, and used it creatively. quintessentialpublications.com...

Well, Simon/Levenda, Alan Cabal tells a different story...

Alan Cabal In 1977, the book made its debut in the window of Hermans little shop of horrors in Chelsea (ed. Magickal Childe books). It generated a scene of its own, a scene bursting with mad, unfocused creativity and slapstick mayhem. Robert Anton Wilson and Robert Shea had just published their Illuminatus trilogy, and interest in secret societies and occult lore was sweeping through counterculture circuits. Into this bubbling swamp of spiritual fecundity stepped Peter Levenda, aka "Simon." Charming, soft-spoken and aloof, well-versed in all aspects of occult theory and practice, he eased his way to the center of the scene. The Necronomicon was a team effort. Herman provided the sponsorship, while the design and layout were the work of Jim Wasserman of the OTO, a raving cokehead from Jersey named Larry Barnes whose daddy had the production facilities and a fellow who called himself Khem Set Rising (who also designed the sigils). The text itself was Levenda's creation, a synthesis of Sumerian and later Babylonian myths and texts peppered with names of entities from H.P. Lovecraft's notorious and enormously popular Cthulhu stories. Levenda seems to have drawn heavily on the works of Samuel Noah Kramer for the Sumerian, and almost certainly spent a great deal of time at the University of Pennsylvania library researching the thing. Structurally, the text was modeled on the wiccan Book of Shadows and the Goetia, a grimoire of doubtful authenticity itself dating from the late Middle Ages." Simon" was also Levenda's creation. He cultivated an elusive, secretive persona,giving him a fantastic and blatantly implausible line of bull# to cover the books origins. He had no telephone. He always wore business suits, in stark contrast to the flamboyant Renaissance fair, proto-goth costuming that dominated the scene. www.scribd.com...

There you go ATS, there is more to come, but that should suffice, for the moment, to help us get some perspective on the background of the Necronomicon, and maybe assuage our eldritch horror a bit.

X.
edit on 3-9-2012 by Xoanon because: .

reply posted on 3-9-2012 @ 08:40 PM by phroziac

So its not real.

reply posted on 3-9-2012 @ 08:42 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by phroziac

Nay, my fine friend, it existeth not. I think. X.

reply posted on 3-9-2012 @ 09:00 PM by Druscilla

I thought The Necronomicon was the work of H.P. Lovecraft. The Phraseology and style of writing would seem to indicate such. Okay, nevermind, my speed skim read different. Necronomicon = H.P.Lovecraft. Then, there's always the Bruce Campbell contribution
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reply posted on 3-9-2012 @ 09:02 PM by JValhalla

When I here Necronomicon I automatically think. "This is my boom stick" Great thread and research I have always wondered if there was a real book. All my investigation led to a dead end. Thanks for this. S/F

reply posted on 3-9-2012 @ 09:08 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by Druscilla

I thought The Necronomicon was the work of H.P. Lovecraft.

"As for writing the NecronomiconI wish I had the energy and ingenuity to do it! I fear it would be quite a job in view of the very diverse passages and intimations which I have in the course of time attributed to it! I might, though, issue an abridged Necronomiconcontaining such parts as are considered at least reasonably safe for the perusal of mankind! When von Juntzs Black Book and the poems of Justin Geoffrey are on the market, I shall certainly have to think about the immortalisation of old Abdul!" H.P.L. in correspondence to Robert E. Howard. www.hplovecraft.com...

No. He only ever referred to it as though it were an existing text in his own fiction writing. So since it does not exist, I have to ask...

The Phraseology and style of writing would seem to indicate such.

What phraseology and writing style? Have you got a copy of The Necronomicon?

X.
edit on 3-9-2012 by Xoanon because: .

reply posted on 3-9-2012 @ 09:09 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by JValhalla

"This is my boom stick"

These days, me too. I am glad you found something that you were looking for in the thread. Thanks for coming by. X.

reply posted on 3-9-2012 @ 09:27 PM by Druscilla

Originally posted by Xoanon

What phraseology and writing style? Have you got a copy of The Necronomicon?

X.

I read it once back in Highschool back to back with some H.P. Lovecraft along with some Clive Barker stories when I was on a horror kick. The style of writing, in such close conjunction with reading H.P. Lovecraft gave me the impression that the work was indeed his.

reply posted on 3-9-2012 @ 10:45 PM by Puck 22

A small appendix to the story of the Necronomicon I'm fairly sure Lovecraft's fans will enjoy because despite the fact it is true it sounds like something Lovecraft himself might have written. A little over twenty years ago a paperback came out called something like 'Bizarre Murders'. One of the murders it described was that of a cult leader and his family, a wife and two daughters. The nature of the cult was never discovered as after the murder all the members disappeared and none were ever found. It has been over twenty years so forgive an old memory but either the husbands

arms had been removed and the arms of his family hacked in an unsuccessful attempt to remove them or the other way around. The wife and daughter had their arms removed and an attempt was made to remove his. I really don't remember. What makes this murder relevant to this thread is that the leader of the cult claimed to be writing a 'true history of the world' as it was dictated to him at two or three every morning by a demon. Although the accounts of the story spell the name several different ways it is referred to at least twice as 'The Necronomicon'. This, by the way, all occurred when H.P.L. was only 11-years-old and so it is doubtful anyone drew any inspiration from him. The Necronomicon? The Starry Wisdom Sect? An attempt to remove evidence of webbed digits? Of course not. Let's not get silly. Just coincidences. Nothing to see here. Let's all move along now. For what it's worth.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 02:29 PM by reficul

what do you mean its not real?!!!! i even bought the necronomicon spell book so i would have a complete set!!!! i too purchased this book when i was getting heavy into h.p.l. i actually still have my original copy,along with the really cheesy spell book that came along later. (you too can accumulate wealth and power and love!!! ) my favorite necronomicon will always be the one from 'evil dead'! "the book was inked in human blood,and bound in human flesh" cool thread!!!! just to recap the back cover: "this is the testimony of all that i have seen,and all that i have learned... for this is the book of the dead,the book of the black earth,that i have writ down at the peril of my life" wow! scary stuff eh!

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 02:38 PM by Ophiuchus 13

OP I wonder if its related to the Codex Gigas

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or the Devils bible?


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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 03:01 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by Ophiuchus 13

Hi Ophiuchus13 I am going to say no, the Codex Gigas is not the Necronomicon...

According to one version of a legend that is already recorded in the Middle Ages the scribe was a monk who broke his monastic vows and was sentenced to be walled up alive. In order to forbear this harsh penalty he promised to create in one single night a book to glorify the monastery forever, including all human knowledge. Near midnight he became sure that he could not complete this task alone, so he made a special prayer, not addressed to God but to the fallen angel Lucifer, asking him to help him finish the book in exchange for his soul. The devil completed the manuscript and the monk added the devil's picture out of gratitude for his aid. In tests to recreate the work, it is estimated that reproducing only the calligraphy, without the illustrations or embellishments, would have taken 5 years of non-stop writing

This whole story is suspect as I happen to have it on good report that the monk was not walled up alive. No, the Codex Gigas appears to be purely a hoax related to medieval Europe, while the Necronomicon is full of Mesopotamian mythology and spells in what scholars seem to think is Sumerian. Totally nothing to worry about in either case. Thanks for coming by.

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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 03:04 PM by Ophiuchus 13

reply to post by Xoanon

Thanks I always wondered if there was a relation

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 03:23 PM by Wookiep

Klaatu, verata, n....necktie....ni*cough* One of the best movies ever.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 03:28 PM by Xoanon

Yes, it's true, Necronomicon is nearly a household word since it has been taken up by popular culture and satirized in movies. One of the things that I hope to express on this thread is that there are folks out there that take it very, very seriously. I am going to add some posts to the thread soon that will highlight this for you all. In the meantime, here is the actual interview that I cited above where Tracy Twyman interviews Peter Levenda, who is Simon, the author of the Simon Necronomicon, even though he denies it. He begins to speak of the book at 44 seconds. Enjoy...

YouTube Link edit on 4-9-2012 by Xoanon because:

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 04:18 PM by something wicked

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Originally posted by Xoanon reply to post by phroziac

Nay, my fine friend, it existeth not. I think. X.

Well..... it doesn't, Lovecraft uses it as part of his folklore. Does the ring exist that Tolkein spoke of? You can debate about where Lovecraft stands in modern literature, but he introduced a mythos, that's all. Having said that, on ATS people will deny Atlantis is Plato's invention even though there is no mention of it before him so - this I guess is the place where such things can be debated without regard to fact.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 04:29 PM by BIHOTZ

Yeah its fiction. But.... Like all good fiction it draws from truth for inspiration. Love craft was a good writer that told a good story. He used all sorts of sources and people for inspiration. But yeah. Fiction.

He probably knew a real Arab that practiced jinn magic (which i still done) for inspiration for his mad Arab character.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 04:56 PM by CallYourBluff

Manson thinks otherwise.


YouTube Link

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 04:56 PM by abeverage

You have forgotten The Book of Eibon, De Vermis Mysteriis, The G'harne Fragments, The Parchments of Pnom, and many more! Having attended Miskatonic University

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(GO C'POD's!!!) you do not have to be a Goth to browse the restricted section of the Library. Being there are genuine copies of the aforementioned works, you must be a graduate student working on a thesis, a professor or a wealthy alumni/benefactor of the University to be allowed access, due to the nature of the material and the age of the manuscripts. Living in Arkham or its surrounding arears may also get you access. If you are granted access your research must state that any of the reference materials will not be uttered, thought, or otherwise incantated in any sort of way. If you are a translator that you will not dwell too long on the text your translating Again...If you are a translator it is asked that you will not dwell too long on the text youre translating and best to believe any visions or apparitions you may see are only illusion or hallucinations. If you do happen to summon something, open a portal or bring about the end of your sanity you will most likely be left to your own devices as the University has a strict non-involvement policy after a few events in the 1920s-30's Now as for the text being real, well there are some private collectors that would have you believe they are fantasy so they will keep making millions or Billions. There is a reasons there are Gates to the other realms and Gates is one of the richest men here. But do not bother yourself with such nonsense, keep thinking they are make-believe made up writings of a silly author(s) and stay in the shallow end of the pool otherwise you might drown. YesKeep your research to the interwebs and word of mouth, and stay on that path, best not to dig to deep unless you are prepared to lose all you have ever known uncovering the horrid truth
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2 3 4 >> ^^TOP^^ reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 05:08 PM by Maroboduus


Are there seriously people who believe the Necronomicon is real??? If so, those people are complete and utter morons. It takes about 2 seconds of research to find out it was invented by Lovecraft. Good lord....
edit on 4-9-2012 by Maroboduus because: (no reason given)

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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 05:11 PM by Maroboduus

reply to post by abeverage

What are you, 12 years old? It must be nice to live in a complete fantasy land. Tell me, how was Miskatonic University? It must be interesting, attending a fictitious college in a fictitious town....
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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 05:21 PM by ainsley

reply to post by Xoanon

Interesting post! I dug my tome out a few days ago, I have only read a few stories from it. Here's some pics;

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I have a lot of reading and research to do, I wasn't aware it was so "esoteric" ! Renewed my interest op ty. ains,
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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 05:24 PM by abeverage

Originally posted by Maroboduus reply to post by abeverage

What are you, 12 years old? It must be nice to live in a complete fantasy land. Tell me, how was Miskatonic University? It must be interesting, attending a fictitious college in a fictitious town....

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edit on 4-9-2012 by Maroboduus because: (no reason given) edit on 4-9-2012 by Maroboduus because: (no reason given)

Nope I am not 12, but I have been told I age well and look the same after 20 or so years Oh The tuition is very easy on the ole pocket book!

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 05:33 PM by Maroboduus

Originally posted by JValhalla Great thread and research I have always wondered if there was a real book. All my investigation led to a dead end. Thanks for this. S/F

What??? If you google Necronomicon, the first thing that pops up is the Wikipedia entry. And the VERY FIRST SENTENCE of that article states:

The Necronomicon is a fictional grimoire

How hard was that? Man alive....

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 05:40 PM by thomasblackraven

Any thoughts on the presentation put forth in Dead Names: The Dark History of the Necronomicon? Some of the police reports are quite interesting regarding the connections of the individuals involved...

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 05:43 PM by reject

reply to post by Xoanon

I had a paperback copy which I burned after bad luck seemed to start to hound me. Then my sister got one which she also asked me to throw away for her. I don't know why but the nature and intentions of those that created it may have imbued it with something negative.

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It doesn't matter if it was written in modern times. Stay away from it.
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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 05:43 PM by hotbread

reply to post by Xoanon

I think none of those witchcraft books are real.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 05:49 PM by Xoanon

Hello all, I must apologize. Tracy Twyman must really like interviewing Peter Levenda because the YouTube interview I posted is not the same as I have cited in the OP. No big though, he is going over essentially the same story and I think that he goes into better detail and lets himself hang out a little more in the interview from the video that I posted. I have gone ahead and pulled out some of Peter/Simon's story so we can read it here...

Peter Levenda, very, very likely author of The Simon Necronomicon, being interviewed by Tracy Twyman regarding Peter's involvement in the production of The Simon Necronomicon in the 1970's... Referring here to the 'monks' that supposedly were heisting books from public and private libraries, I hope you remember that part from the OP... "Andrew knew about this, he knew what they were up to all along as they were kicking stuff back to him. he really didn't mind it too much as long as he wasn't involved in the actual theft." "Andrew's interest was always in books of an occult nature, so he had a small growing collection of old tomes of various kinds and as it turns out he had stacks of things in boxes, old manuscripts and that sort of thing".

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"And I was over one day and the rest is history... ...opened up the box and saw, um, a manuscript with a Greek name,Necronomicon, ya know, we thought it had something to do with death" "You have to understand that we did not read H.P. Lovecraft, we had no knowledge of it in the 1970's, it just wasn't part of our lifestyle to read occult fiction and gothic horror and stuff. It just wasn't there, we didn't know. So for us it meant nothing. Just that it had something to do with the dead, and there were some strange sigils and stuff in it; it looked pretty cool, you know, and that was really the discovery of it, you know, it was just right there so we said, "Let's do something with this".

So there we go. You can see how slippery Levenda/Simon is when it comes to all of this. In this interview he is claiming now to be the person that discovered the manuscript by accident, even though he was aware enough to know that 'Andrew' had a collection of old occult tomes. My question is, why didn't 'they' 'do something' with any of the other ancient, stolen, tomes of great antiquity in 'Andrew's' collection? Also, people that don't know anything about the occult, as Levenda/Simon claims, do not throw around specialized jargon like 'occult tomes' and especially 'sigil'. Geez.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Xoanon because:

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 05:53 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by reject

I had a paperback copy which I burned after bad luck seemed to start to hound me. Then my sister got one which she also asked me to throw away for her. I don't know why but the nature and intentions of those that created it may have imbued it with something negative.

Was it the Simon version? The one in the second picture near the bottom of the OP?

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That one is notorious for generating stories like your own and that is part of the reason that I started this thread. I was not really kidding when I suggested in the OP that a friend or loved one might bring one of these home. I am going to see if I can gather other anecdotes about the Simon Necronomicon from the web and post them here if I am able to. I hope that others will share their stories of the Simon version, if they have them and are willing. Thanks for sharing. X.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 05:54 PM by Snippy23

I notice that the 'Simon' Necronomicon is priced at 0.32p (50c) on Amazon UK. Probably not worth the money.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 06:12 PM by old_god

Originally posted by JValhalla When I here Necronomicon I automatically think. "This is my boom stick" Great thread and research I have always wondered if there was a real book. All my investigation led to a dead end. Thanks for this. S/F

Boom

Stick

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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 06:12 PM by old_god

Originally posted by hotbread reply to post by Xoanon

I think none of those witchcraft books are real.

The real ones will exist in some collectors vault somewhere

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 06:13 PM by reject

reply to post by Xoanon

I don't know. The sigil looks the same though. I read the whole damn thing; a lot of it doesn't have continuity and a lot of it are symbols...its the one that says somewhere "don't stare into the abyss because it stares back.." and about "the ancient ones who are dead BUT DREAMING." Its supposed to be Sumerian but I got the impression it was somehow linked to native American mythology as well. My bad luck continues to this day. Curiosity kills the cat. So, stay away. Nothing good comes of it.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 06:14 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by thomasblackraven

Any thoughts on the presentation put forth in Dead Names: The Dark History of the Necronomicon?

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Some of the police reports are quite interesting regarding the connections of the individuals involved...

Thanks for asking TBR, I have just become aware of 'Simon's' book. It looks a lot more like something that Levenda would write, right? So in 'Dead Names' we now have 'Simon' telling the story of Levenda as told by Cabal in my OP. No kidding, it's as simple as that. Weird, huh? I don't know why Levenda persists in the subterfuge; I imagine he must have the same concerns as Fred Gettings who goes around writing books as 'David Ovason'. Too funny. Do you keep up with all this occult stuff,. yourself, TBR? As far as murders and occult crimes that have involved the Necronomicon, there are the heinous murders of Naomi Ruth Queen and Richard Wendorf at the hands ofRod Ferrell and his cult. When authorities caught up to them, they found a copy of the Simon Necronomicon in his possessions, and later it was claimed that Ferrell used the Necronomicon in cult rituals. But it should be kept in mind that investigators found a copy of Anne Rice's Interview With The Vampire right there along with it.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 06:25 PM by Maroboduus

Originally posted by hotbread reply to post by Xoanon

I think none of those witchcraft books are real.

There are many authentic grimoires (Key of Solomon, Book of Sacred Magic of Abramelin the Mage, etc), but the Necronomicon is assuredly not one of them. As to the Simon Necronomicon, it is widely known to be a hoax. Any perceived ill effects linked to it are ONLY that: perception. You are reading too much into things and linking them to that book when no causality actually exists. It is a hoax, through and through. It can't cause anything bad to happen to you or

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anybody else. Trying to link it to murders and such because perpetrators happened to own it is bad logic, at best. They weren't evil/didn't commit evil acts because they owned it; they owned it because they were actively trying to play up their view of themselves as being evil.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Maroboduus because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 06:30 PM by connorromanow

reply to post by Xoanon

maybe one of your children or grandchildren, will someday come waltzing in to the room, all smug with their goth little selves, and slap down a copy of this hoary old grimoire, declaring, Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn!.

if i ever meet anyone that can properly pronounce that whole phrase ill be impressed and scared but im glad there is a thread like this because ive seen around three different copies of the necronomicon at one book store,

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 06:32 PM by Xoanon

I hope that the core folks that are reading this go over those Lovecraft letters very carefully, much is revealed in them...

"Long has alluded to the Necronomicon in some things of hisin fact, I think it is rather good fun to have this artificial mythology given an air of verisimilitude by wide citation."

"Long" is...

Frank Belknap Long (April 27, 1901 - January 3, 1994) was a prolific American writer of horror fiction, fantasy, science fiction, poetry, gothic romance, comic books, and non-fiction.

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Though his writing career spanned seven decades, he is best known for his horror and science fiction short stories, including early contributions to the Cthulhu Mythos. During his life, Long received the World Fantasy Award for Life Achievement (at the 1978 World Fantasy Convention), the Bram Stoker Award for Lifetime Achievement (in 1987, from the Horror Writers Association), and the First Fandom Hall of Fame Award (1977). en.wikipedia.org...

I truly hope that devotees of American fiction, like myself, are enjoying this as much as I am. If so, the link that is attached to Lovecraft's letters in the OP will take you to an entire collection of H.P.L.'s correspondence. The man was an incredible writer, before anything else.

X.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 06:34 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by connorromanow

but im glad there is a thread like this because ive seen around three different copies of the necronomicon at one book store,

Thank you, connorronamow, I appreciate the validation, I would not want people to take my offer of help too lightly.

X.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 06:35 PM by silent thunder

Interesting thread OP. I've long been fascinated b grimores, but like you and most people, I am convinced the Necro is a clever hoax.

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A few years ago I bought a book called Dead Names that preports to tell the story of the Orthodox book thieves and the whole Magikal Chylde scene, but it sits neglected on my bookshelf, yet to be read - in a large part due to the fact I think this book-about-a-book is also a hoax and designed as apologetica to shore up the "Simon" myth. Still, it might make a good fiction read some dark and stormy eve.

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reply to post by Xoanon

I honestly thought about buying one as joke, but i dont know anyone else who reads lovecraft

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 06:49 PM by Maroboduus

reply to post by Xoanon

Yes, there are whole books of letters that Lovecraft wrote. You can buy them on Amazon, or any bookstore. He never claimed the Necronomicon to be real. There is no debate about whether it is a hoax; it is KNOWN to be a hoax. He admittedly created it to use in his fiction. Writers such as August Derleth took it and ran with it to create the entire Cthulu mythos. Why are people questioning whether or not it is a hoax when it is a proven fact that it was a figment of Lovecraft's imagination? This thread is flabbergasting me. If only there was some sort of vast information network where people could look this sort of thing up....if there was such a thing (let's call it the "internet"), i bet it would take a grand total of 2 seconds to find this information....

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 07:12 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by CallYourBluff

Manson thinks otherwise.

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YouTube Link

Hi CallYourBluff, I watched the video, mainly because I just can't get enough of the lore surrounding The Necronomicon, so I wanted to get Marilyn's story too. The Simon Necronomicon was released for public consumption in 1977 (same year Star Wars came out). It was released as a paperback, keep that in mind, it's important in a moment. So, Marilyn Manson was born in 1969, he went to an Episcopalian school until tenth grade, that puts him at about 13 or 14 when the events in the story he tells happened. So, that would have been 1983 or 1984, plenty of time for a kid to get ahold of even a second hand copy of the Simon Necronomicon which sold like evil little hot cakes. I was thinking that we might have something here if the experience that Manson describes had happened before the publication of Levenda/Simon's book. But it does not look like it. Also, at 7:38 you see Manson pantomime a bit with his hands the way he was holding the book when the 'thing' happened to him. It looks like it was a small paperback that he was holding, to me, and not a giant tome as shown in the T.V. dramatization. Just to be thorough.

X.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 07:22 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by silent thunder

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in a large part due to the fact I think this book-about-a-book is also a hoax and designed as apologetica to shore up the "Simon" myth. Still, it might make a good fiction read some dark and stormy eve.

Yep, that is exactly it. The book you have was 'written' by Simon, who is Peter Levenda. And I agree, the books, and Simon/Levenda's back story make for really entertaining reading. There is not much I have ever read by Peter Levenda that I haven't liked. Glad you found something that you liked on the thread, thanks for being here. X.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 07:24 PM by Q33323

reply to post by Druscilla

Lol... I'll swallow your soul!

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 07:29 PM by Phenomium

All I know is that I read off some of this stuff when I was about 18. That night lights cut off in my house by themselves when I was in the house alone and I heard someone whisper my name through an inside window of my house, when all the doors were locked and windows were shut. I was experimenting that night because my parents had left. I am 40 now and I have had demons haunting me ever since. They still do to this day. They are terrible looking. I really did nothing else to bring this on myself, no Ouija, nothing. That was the only occult thing I ever messed with..so it has to be that.
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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 07:31 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by Maroboduus

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Yes, there are whole books of letters that Lovecraft wrote. You can buy them on Amazon, or any bookstore. He never claimed the Necronomicon to be real. There is no debate about whether it is a hoax; Why are people questioning whether or not it is a hoax when it is a proven fact that it was a figment of Lovecraft's imagination? This thread is flabbergasting me.

Well Maroboduus King of Marcomanni, Folks on ATS just like to share stuff that they know about for the entertainment of other members. Sometimes its about stuff they don't know about and would like to learn more of. And some folks like to be entertained by being presented with questions about things that they know a lot about, by people that have the same interests that they do, so that they can suspend their disbelief for a while and bask in a favorite subject as a lion basks in the sunshine, belching and farting after a meal of gazelle. That is often what we do at ATS, serve up hot media drenched UGC for the delectation of our brothers and sisters. Now, what's up my friend? What can I do for you?

X.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 07:39 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by Phenomium

Do you remember what the cover looked like? Did it look like the color picture at the bottom of the first post of the OP, on the first page? Thanks in advance. X.

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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 07:40 PM by Maroboduus

reply to post by Xoanon

Sorry to be so negative, but it's dumb-founding to me when people say stuff like "i tried to find out if it was real, but everything was a dead end." Like i said, it literally takes 2 seconds of research to find multiple sources showing it is fake. The first sentence on the first website that pops up says it is fake. It's not like its lack of validity is obscure information or something. Basically, i just find it absurd when people claim to have an interest in something, and yet somehow don't know anything about it whatsoever. I honestly can't relate to claiming interest in something and willingly remaining ignorant about it. If you truly have an interest in something, then shouldn't you actually try to be informed about it? Doesn't that seem reasonable? Deny ignorance, right? So take some time to freaking learn about stuff!

And like i've said numerous times before....i'm just a bitter old jerk. So don't mind me.

(My annoyance wasn't aimed at you, by the way. Like i said: i just hate it when people claim to be interested in something, yet make no effort whatsoever to actually learn about it. I honestly can't understand that mindset.)
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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 07:52 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by Maroboduus

Hello My Friend,

Basically, i just find it absurd when people claim to have an interest in something, and yet somehow don't know anything about it whatsoever. I honestly can't relate to claiming interest in something and

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willingly remaining ignorant about it. If you truly have an interest in something, then shouldn't you actually try to be informed about it? Doesn't that seem reasonable? Deny ignorance, right? So take some time to freaking learn about stuff!

Listen, I am a little dumbfounded as to why this thread is so popular myself but... I think that part of the attraction here might be that people do know that the Necronomicon is a literary hoax but they don't know what exactly makes it so. The problem is that Simon Necronomicon, as you can see, there are all sorts of horrible anecdotes about it. It is the one that is involved in many occult crimes and the one that outcast teenagers keep under their bed or in a drawer. And pulling apart the morass that Levenda has made of the situation has been no cake walk. But now with all the resources spread so thin on the web it is easy to nail him. You'll notice in the OP that I spend little time on Lovecraft's obvious creation and move on to the tougher nut to crack, which is The Simon Necronomicon. For years stubborn people have pointed to it as being real because its origins could not be nailed down. Well, they can and we did that here in this thread. Levenda wrote it.

And like i've said numerous times before....i'm just a bitter old jerk. So don't mind me.

I think you are just fine. Thanks for posting. Have a good one. X.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Xoanon because: .

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 07:57 PM by rebelv

I first read the book back in 1992 or so and at that time never heard of H.P. Lovecraft, except that I knew he had been a writer. Nothing ever bad happened to me from reading the book, and the symbols in the book seem to coincide with little that I've studied in the occult since, except for the "pentagrammy" thing.

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However, in the years since, (and I still have the pocket book copy), a lot of the Sumerian texts have since been translated, and I am amazed at how much the stories and "gods" in this book, co-insides with Sumerian texts supposedly not translated until after it was published. I have tried to do spells and incantations with the book and never got any results which I guess is good for me, since I am still alive and not crazy (although, some will probably try to argue that point) However, I will point out, that it does say in the book that you must not engage in any sexual activity (even with yourself) I think for at least 30 days, and I never believed in the book enough to actually go 30 days celibate from all sexual activity, so maybe that's why the spells didn't work and in this case, if the book be a true book of summoning very bad demons then I guess my lack of self control regarding masturbation, saved my life and sanity (how ironic, since they used to say that masturbation lead to insanity) REBEL V

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 08:13 PM by EarthCitizen23

Levenda is brilliant and it would not surprise me to see that the Necronomicon as a Tulpa, thoughtform that did exactly what a Tulpa does,, gains a life of its own by the sheer power of thought put into it. I find myself in his description of those of us who look behind the Curtain. So no matter what you have to enjoy the Brilliance of mind that creates such things. (From Sinister Forces)

. The people we trust are those who can measure the measurable. The people we distrust are those who point to the invisible and shout to get our attention. Our world is marching calmly to an obscure and unknowable end because we, the people, hear the drum, feel the beat, know our place in line. Thats better, somehow, than jumping off the path into the dark forest where God dwells like a hungry tiger. There is too much personal responsibility in jumping out of line, and if you then try to jump back in, you will nd you have lost your place and your fellow marchers no longer want you to join them. You are dirty; you are crazed; you have seen what they are afraid to see.
edit on 9/4/2012 by EarthCitizen23 because: source of quote added

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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 08:13 PM by Maroboduus

reply to post by Xoanon

Sorry dude...i wasn't trying to criticize the thread itself, or imply that it shouldn't be popular. Just flabbergasted that people who take an interest in these things haven't bothered to learn anything about them. This was just the culmination of feeling the same way about numerous threads today. I just tend to get a little worked up sometimes. Trust me, my grumpiness is much more endearing once you get to know me, haha. Picture a cranky yet endearing old man, then make him 28 years old. I mean well enough, i just (admittedly) get annoyed too easily. It IS an interesting subject, though. I'm going to go ahead with a S & F, because i feel bad now....

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 08:31 PM by mike dangerously

Ah,The Necronomicon! I have a copy myself and have heard accounts that the thing actually works.As for me the jury is still out on that.Still an interesting read and good thread. S&F

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 08:43 PM by Maroboduus

Originally posted by rebelv However, in the years since, (and I still have the pocket book copy), a lot of the Sumerian texts have

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since been translated, and I am amazed at how much the stories and "gods" in this book, co-insides with Sumerian texts supposedly not translated until after it was published.

The Simon Necronomicon was released in the mid-70's. They started translating the Sumerian texts, with varying success, in the mid1800's. I believe most of the mythology had been translated by the 1940's....

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 08:44 PM by ipsedixit

Things like the Necronomicon start to work when people start to believe in them. Some people venerate Elvis Presley so much that they have had "experiences" related to Elvis, interventions on the spiritual or mental plane by him. Religion is activated by belief. If one venerated fire hydrants, set up a shrine to them, prayed to them, always acknowledged them and looked to them for guidance, it wouldn't be too long before they started providing guidance. A fire hydrant religion wouldnt necessarily be a bad thing. They are generally solid and dependable.

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 08:57 PM by Phenomium

Originally posted by Xoanon reply to post by Phenomium

Do you remember what the cover looked like? Did it look like the color picture at the bottom of the first post of the OP, on the first page? Thanks in advance. X.

As I recall, it was a black paperback book with that weird star thing on the front. I thought it was fascinating, it was also a bit of peer pressure that caused me to buy the book. I tried to summon some demon of the death out of curiosity. Don't know if I pronounced the words right, but something happened and I have been paying for it ever since. I am used to the demons, but somehow I can't seem to get "really" used to them because they keep me awake at night and it costs me my effectiveness in life and my vocational insurance. I have some serious bags under my eyes. It's not the paper or ink that is read from, rather the words that are spoken, that are the danger. The only way I can truly sleep is to be knocked out by alcohol or sedated by some kind of pill. Otherwise, sober...I am game. I went 8 years without alcohol and

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they schooled me. I don't know if the creator, whomever he was, was a legitimate occultist, I know what is. I don't care about the source or how credible he is, we all wear masks in society and show people who we want them to believe we are. Who make this book, I have no clue. The results...no doubt. Don't mess with this stuff unless you want the rest of your life to be sleepless nights of terror..Hell in the sheets and some outside of the sheets. Mostly while you sleep though, think that's when they are strongest. At night. 3:00 am and forward..Hell even 2:30 they make an appearance. I hate this. I really do. It isn't about lying or being cool or a hoax or anything of the nature...it is about, don't do this crap..it isn't cool, it will F*k up your life, it will make you tired on a daily basis, either the alcohol will get you or the demons will, either way you are tired at work the next day.....your wife will question your sanity, your kids will think you are cool and start drifting into a "Gothic" lifestyle, horror is normal to you and there is no empathy....except fo those who truly deserve it. Call me a sociopath....but it all started when I read a few passages of this book. The demons have made it quite clear since.....they are going nowhere.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Phenomium because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 09:03 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by EarthCitizen23

Levenda is brilliant and it would not surprise me to see that the Necronomicon as a Tulpa, thoughtform that did exactly what a Tulpa does,, gains a life of its own by the sheer power of thought put into it.

Yes indeed, a Tulpa, you have a very well informed imagination, EarthCitizen23. I would like to use your post as an example of how far folks will go to legitimize the Necronomicon. Which, of course, does not exist. At all. No way. Honest. As I said earlier, I would like to get in to discussing some of the people behind the cults that swear by the validity of The Necronomicon. British occultist and head of a renegade version of the O.T.O, Kenneth Grant, believed that Lovecraft's Necronomicon could be accessed on the astral plain; yes, that's right, an Astral Necronomicom. Please bear with me here, I want to illustrate as best I can how all these authors

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have been tying one another in to a matrix that has been fomenting this Necronomicon hoax since the letters started with H.P.L. in the late 20's. They are very dodgy and as slippery as a worshipper of Dagon. When you are the head of an organization that claims to have secret knowledge regarding something people are interested in and want (Grant was the head of the O.T.O. in Britain) people listen to you. And this is what Grant was saying... That there was a secret powerful connection between Crowley and Lovecraft in that they both made contact with the 'Elder Gods' (*scoff*), Crowley through his magick and Lovecraft through dreaming his stories. Grant claimed to have the connection as well, and claimed that it was given to him directly from Crowley. Grant told people that they could make the connection too, and wrote some books about it that sell quite well to this day. So you see how that allows Grant to tap both Lovecraft and Crowley simultaneously as he tries to create some validity for himself. This was all pre-1977 which was when Simon/Levenda released his Necronomicon. still with me? Now! To complicate the issue, Levenda uses Grant's allusions to an Astral Necronomicon in the introduction to the Simon Necronomicon, tying the whole thing together. And then others did the same, Like Donald Tyson. See? the Necronomicon is so real that it doesn't even exist. It is in 'The Astral' So no, EarthCitizen23, I think that we can safely strike Tulpa off the list of candidates for The Necronomicon, regardless of how refreshing and quasi-brilliant your idea may be. Go on back to the books now, nothing to see here.

X.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Xoanon because: .

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 09:23 PM by Phenomium

Originally posted by Xoanon reply to post by EarthCitizen23

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Levenda is brilliant and it would not surprise me to see that the Necronomicon as a Tulpa, thoughtform that did exactly what a Tulpa does,, gains a life of its own by the sheer power of thought put into it.

Yes indeed, a Tulpa, you have a very informed imagination, EarthCitizen23. I would like to use your post as an example of how far folks will go to legitimize the Necronomicon. Which, of course, does not exist. At all. No way. Honest. As I said earlier, I would like to get in to discussing some of the people behind the cults that swear by the validity of The Necronomicon. British occultist and head of a renegade version of the O.T.O, Kenneth Grant, believed that Lovecraft's Necronomicon could be accessed on the astral plain; yes, that's right, an Astral Necronomicom. Please bear with me here, I want to illustrate as best I can how all these authors have been tying one another in to a matrix that has been fomenting this Necronomicon hoax since the letters started with H.P.L. in the late 20's. They are very dodgy and as slippery as a worshipper of Dagon. When you are the head of an organization that claims to have secret knowledge regarding something people are interested in and want (Grant was the head of the O.T.O. in Britain) people listen to you. And this is what Grant was saying... That there was a secret powerful connection between Crowley and Lovecraft in that they both made contact with the 'Elder Gods' (*scoff*), Crowley through his magick and Lovecraft through dreaming his stories. Grant claimed to have the connection as well, and claimed that it was given to him directly from Crowley. Grant told people that they could make the connection too, and wrote some books about it that sell quite well to this day. So you see how that allows Grant to tap both Lovecraft and Crowley simultaneously as he tries to create some validity for himself. This was all pre-1977 which was when Simon/Levenda released his Necronomicon. still with me? Now! To complicate the issue, Levenda uses Grant's allusions to an Astral Necronomicon in the introduction to the Simon Necronomicon, tying the whole thing together. And then others did the same, Like Donald Tyson. See? the Necronomicon is so real that it doesn't even exist. It is in 'The Astral' So no, EarthCitizen23, I think that we can safely strike Tulpa off the list of candidates for The Necronomicon, regardless of how refreshing and quasi-brilliant your idea may be. Go on back to the books now, nothing to see here.

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X.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Xoanon because: .

I'm not in the occult. I dabbled with it one time. I couldn't care less about the intricacies of who did what, when, where or how....I make my claim that this crap screwed my life up to this day and demons do not stop, as I speak. HG Wells, Crowley, Levanda (whoever that is)...doesn't matter. I have a personal account of this crap haunting me from the age of 18-40. It doesn't get easier either. I would say do it yourself, just to make a point...but I wouldn't wish this on an enemy. Don't do it. If you say it doesn't happen though, and you don't know for a fact,...the problem is that it breaks down the walls of doubt to where people will try for themselves, to find out, and then.....it's too late. Just don't say either. These demons want to just destroy you...nothing more. You might be curious...but they know EXACTLY what they want to do.
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reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 09:44 PM by toltecnightmare

Originally posted by ipsedixit Things like the Necronomicon start to work when people start to believe in them. Some people venerate Elvis Presley so much that they have had "experiences" related to Elvis, interventions on the spiritual or mental plane by him. Religion is activated by belief. If one venerated fire hydrants, set up a shrine to them, prayed to them, always acknowledged them and looked to them for guidance, it wouldn't be too long before they started providing guidance. A fire hydrant religion wouldnt necessarily be a bad thing. They are generally solid and dependable.

you literally said exactly what I was thinking... except the part about the mighty fire hydrant... fire hydrant IS everywhere!

Al Azif: Is The Necronomicon Real?, page 4

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ATS Members have flagged this thread 25 times


reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 09:51 PM by Phenomium

Originally posted by phroziac So its not real.

I'll have to say, I like you man. You just look like "Big Bang Theory Type"....and I am more of a jock type but with YOUR principles...it is indeed real. To dabble in this is to betray the rest of your life. It is one of those instances where you have to make a decision,...to do or ...not to do....and the rest of your life will be a testament to your decision. I tell you this is real and I have not doctorate in HG wells or Levante or whoever the hell wrote or pitched this book or title, but I have been haunted for 22 years for reading off just one of these passages.
edit on 4-9-2012 by Phenomium because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 10:16 PM by ipsedixit

There are a lot of people like Phenomium who have had their lives changed by "spirit stuff", whether they wanted the changes or not. Necromancy has been practiced for thousands of years on this planet in a very large number of forms. This is a huge subject. Paradoxically one could almost say that it is a subject the less said about the better. There are too many egotistical dabblers (speaking from first hand experience now) who blunder into more than they can handle in this area. I could talk a lot about this but discretion is the wiser course. I know what suffering can be experienced as a result of mistakes made in this area of inquiry.
edit on 4-9-2012 by ipsedixit because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 4-9-2012 @ 10:41 PM by HomerinNC

I've been to the Magickal Childe back in the late 80's when I was into the occult and Paganism, used to buy all my incense there. Cool store.

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reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 04:35 AM by Taupin Desciple

reply to post by Xoanon

This response is from a literary standpoint only. I'm not debating whether the book is fiction or not. It is. And it's a very good piece of fiction as well. The problem is, IMO, it's too good. Even while he was alive, people would ask Lovecraft where they could get their hands on the original. That's the mark of a good fiction writer; leaving people wondering. One way fiction writers do that is to pepper their stories with real names, places, dates, etc.....All of these historical facts though are not presented in an accurate timeline. For instance, he can drop the name of a monk and say that monk did something in 500 AD when in fact that monk didn't do anything until 1,200 AD. The monk existed, there's proof of it, just not in the time frame that Lovecraft suggested. So if you don't know your history, it's going to come across as real. This book is reality based fiction. There were too many real occultists, like Waite, involved with it for it not to be. Besides, all you have to do is look at the history of certain points in that book to see that certain places and people actually did exist and you'll see that. Maybe that was Simon's doing. Fiction writers for years have done this. Rice does it, King, Koontz and every other fiction writer worth their salt does it. But the most important aspect of that book is fact that Necromancy does exist. It existed back before religion was even thought of. Back then, this practice wasn't seen as either good or evil. It simply was what it is. Religion is what put those labels on it. www.newadvent.org... Let me put this in a different perspective. You have a fiction writer like King and then a science fiction writer like Asimov. King will make the fiction look realistic because everything written is placed on earth and, roughly, in this day and age. Asimov couldn't do that with a book about, say, populating Saturn. Kings premise was realistic to begin with while Asimov's was not. Therein lies the uniqueness of The Necronomican. The premise is somewhere between realistic and not. Lovecraft however was somehow able to bridge that gap and turn that gray area into a very believable work of fiction. Now, let me backtrack a little. Necromancy is real. Has been for a very long time now and everyone knows it. Who are you, or anyone else for that matter, to say that the sigils and incantations are not real? This is where this book gets real sticky and I for one don't recommend it for that reason alone.

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I'm not saying that the sigils and incantations are real and I'm not saying they're not. I'm not qualified to make that call. But the fact that this is a reality based piece of fiction makes it to where I'm not about to go taking the directions of the book and finding out for myself. And that's another thing you have to keep in mind here OP. This book is not your typical piece of fiction. And being a Lovecraft fan, I think you know it. If anything, it reads like a how-to manual with a history of the ingredients. How many fiction books do you know of that are written in that format? Of those, how many are questioned as being real or not? The fact is, I don't think Lovecraft realized just how good that book was going to be when he wrote it. (On top of everything else I mentioned, people say that book was written in the vein of The Book Of Shadows. Even a literary novice will tell you there is no "one" Book Of Shadows. If you don't know what it is, look this one up yourself, this post is getting long winded as it is.) He took a style of writing with a subject matter that is controversial to begin with, and put it in a format to make it look even more realistic. Sometimes I think that "book" was the ultimate inside joke between him and a buddy The only one's, by the way, who will ever know just how real that book actually is. Lovecraft went on record as saying the book was a figment of his imagination. ( Maybe what Simon did was take Lovecraft's' collection of writings and correspondences and put them in a book format?) Fair enough, but what he didn't say was that no book of fiction is ever 100% fake. At least not the type of fiction we're talking about here. Even Asimov can put in one of his books the density of gravity on Saturn and have it factual. The question is, which parts of The Necronomican are real and which aren't. Again, it was the ultimate inside joke I think. On one hand you want to get to the bottom of it all, but on the other hand................you don't. lovecraftbookclub.wordpress.com...

reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 05:11 AM by Suspiria

Through nameless aeons and inconceivable dimensions I used to own the Simon one. Think one of my younger friends swiped it though hoping to become some uber leet necromancer or something. He's now a security guard. As for the Evil dead one, yes you can get some fabulous replicas, and yes I want one.

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reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 07:26 AM by mardukiscoming

reply to post by Xoanon

Great thread.As a teenager I was into alot of wierd,dark stuff.I borrowed a few books from an acquaintance and one of them was the "Necronomicon".Don't know which one.I can't remember.Probably the Simon one.I,personally,could not make any sense of it.

reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 12:51 PM by Xoanon

Hello everyone, I am scouring the web at the moment, looking for personal anecdotes of the Simon Necronomicon for our entertainment. But I want to take a moment to share something with you all. You will remember that I mentioned British occultist Kenneth Grant and his mighty contributions to the lore and madness surrounding the Simon Necronomicon. Essentially, it was Kenneth Grant's story of the Astral Necronomicon, and the magickal connection between Lovecraft and Crowley, that gave Simon/Peter levenda the literary traction that he needed for his tremendous spoof. I would like to copy the obituary from Starfire Publications linked by Dan Harms, foremost researcher in to the Necronomicon to our thread here...

Kenneth Grant died on 15th January 2011 after a period of illness. Our condolences go first and foremost to his family, whose privacy is something which we all wish to respect at this difficult time. Kenneth Grant is best knownto Papers readers for his influential role in bringing together occult practice with the fiction of H. P. Lovecraft, thus inspiring the Simon Necronomicon (yes, yes, two monks and so on) and a great deal of modern magical practice. Kenneth Grant, in our few interactions, was always a gentleman, even when I was being youthful and brash. He will be missed. danharms.wordpress.com...

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And I would like to dedicate this song to all three of them, H.P. Lovecraft, Aleister Crowley, Kenneth Grant... and yes, I believe that Peter Levenda should be included with them from here on out and forever more. I am very grateful to all of these writers for making life here in our temporary home tolerable and for pointing the way to being eaten first when our Cosmic Overlords return. I am especially thankful to Mr. Levenda for working so hard to keep it all alive. Sorry I had to smash up your literary hoax. But that has to be done to make room for mine, and all those to come. Let's get writing.

YouTube Link

Iaaaa! X.

reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 01:05 PM by Maroboduus

So, does anybody who is familiar with authentic grimoires and occult practices have a copy of the Necronomicon? I'm now curious as to whether they copied any real sigils from other grimoires to make it seem authentic. I would, if i was planning on writing a fake grimoire and claiming it to be real....
edit on 5-9-2012 by Maroboduus because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 01:28 PM by Suspiria

reply to post by Maroboduus

This little site might help you along on your quest. warlockasylum.wordpress.com...

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reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 01:33 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by Maroboduus

Heya,

The text itself was Levenda's creation, a synthesis of Sumerian and later Babylonian myths and texts peppered with names of entities from H.P. Lovecraft's notorious and enormously popular Cthulhu stories. Levenda seems to have drawn heavily on the works of Samuel Noah Kramer for the Sumerian, and almost certainly spent a great deal of time at the University of Pennsylvania library researching the thing. Structurally, the text was modeled on the wiccan Book of Shadows and the Goetia, -Alan Cabal. The Doom That Came to Chelsea

www.scribd.com...

Now, without consulting Levenda it is anyones best guess. But Levenda is no slouch, in fact he is as meticulous as a man can be while hoaxing a volume that is supposed to reside on the Astral No, seriously, the man is a machine, just read Unhloy Alliances (Nazi Occultism) and you will see what I mean. he makes Jimm Marrs look like .59 cent pulp fiction (writing-wise). So yeah, there is likely a smorgasbord of all kind of 'real' stuff in there that he carefully cobbled together from other places. But I would like to also take the opportunity to address something that Taupin Disciple has brought up. You will notice that Cabal claims that the Wiccan Book of Shadows was used as structural inspiration for Simon's Necronomicon. Listen guys, follow me now, this is how thick the literary/occult hoaxes get with these guys... There is no Wiccan Book of Shadows before or beyond Gerald Gardner, the 'father' of modern wicca. Gardner started publishing books in about 1954 and this Book of Shadows is a feature and device of the movement that he created, not an historical book with any lineage.

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And it is widely believed that Gardner at least had help from Crowley. After Crowley 'restored' magick, his next project was witchcraft but he never got it off the ground. It is believed that Gardner was in correspondence with Crowley before Gardner moved back to Britain in 1945. All one has to do is read Gardner and do the hermeneutics, I know that it only stands as my opinion, (which is shared by others that, of course, cannot be present on this thread) but all of the structure that Gardner uses for his 'Wiccan' covens was lifted from the writings of A. Crowley and have been modified. So when Cabal says Book of Shadows? He is guessing or drawing from his own limited experience with these 'special' types of books. Levenda was and is way too slick to have fallen for that, he would not have used such an obvious hoax as a template, he probably just went right for the Crowley, and crowley based much on the Greek Magical Papyri.. In fact I would not be surprised if he just went straight for the papyri. Hope that made sense. X.
edit on 5-9-2012 by Xoanon because: .

reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 01:37 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by Suspiria

The Underworld in ancient Sumer was known by many names, among them ABSU or Abyss, sometimes as Nar Mattaru, the great Underworld Ocean, and also as Cutha or KUTU as it is called in the Enuma Elish (the Creation Epic of the Sumerians). The phonetic similarity between Cutha and KUTU and Chthonic, as well as Cthulhu, is striking. Judging by a Sumerian grammar at hand, the word KUTULU or Cuthalu (Lovecrafts's Cthulhu Sumerianised) would mean The Man of KUTU (Cutha); the Man of the Underworld; Satan or Shaitan, as he is known to the Yezidis (whom Crowley considered to be the remnants of the Sumerian Tradition). The list of similarities, both between Lovecrafts creations and the Sumerian gods, as well as between Lovecrafts mythos and Crowleys magick, can go on nearly indefinitely, and in depth, for which there is no space here at present.

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warlockasylum.wordpress.com...

That is an awesome link, Suspiria, but you are undoing all of my hard work.

reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 01:52 PM by Xoanon

...Yezidis (whom Crowley considered to be the remnants of the Sumerian Tradition). warlockasylum.wordpress.com...

Oh boy, I am going to let this slide but not without making the error very apparent to all of you that have been following along. Crowley never spoke of the Yezidi, ever. The Yezidi thing was introduced by Kenneth Grant, whom I mentioned earlier. Do you see how folks get confused? Fortunately I have been riding herd on this whole publishing circus from my late teens, so it is really hard to pull one over on me. Yes, I was once interested in the subject matter, but now I am mostly interested in the writing and the personalities. Anyhow, I thought that you would all find that little discrepancy interesting. X.

reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 01:57 PM by Suspiria

reply to post by Xoanon

Hehe I'm sorry it's not my intention. I use it purely to show just how clever and "deep" this whole thing has become. If it's helpful to future writers then more power to their elbow. I just hope I'm

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hovering at the bookshelf in Another World when the baby bat spotty chaos lords and ladies got nuts over it.

reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 02:10 PM by Titen-Sxull

reply to post by Xoanon

I love Lovecraft. One of the most interesting things about him is that his ideas and the motifs and style he used went on to inspire so much of our modern horror, sci-fi and fantasy today. I can hardly see a horror movie without interjecting Lovecraft somewhere or other. ALIEN is a great example, as is the movie The Thing (which was based on a short story called Who Goes There that has Lovecraft's stink all over it). The theme of human curiosity leading to calamity and the rising of some dark unknown truth is a fantastic theme and one that Lovecraft used very effectively. As for the Necronomicon it's one of those great devices that can be anything the author or writer needs at the time. In the Evil Dead films it raises demons and spirits while in Lovecraft's own works it seems to relate more to the "Old Ones" of the Cthulhu mythos (decidedly aliens, not demons). The book doesn't really exist though many books by the name Necronomicon have been written since Lovecraft invented it.

reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 03:59 PM by Maroboduus

Originally posted by Suspiria reply to post by Maroboduus

This little site might help you along on your quest.

warlockasylum.wordpress.com... They use the fact that the Simon Necronomicon has a resemblance to Lovecraft, which in turn resembles Sumerian mythology, as proof that the Simon Necronomicon has actual links to Sumeria. That is beyond stupid. The obvious conclusion (and truth of the matter) would be that it resembles Lovecraft because it was copied from his writings, and Lovecraft's fiction resembles mythology because it was directly influenced by it. But i do find it amusing that one of the sources they are using to attempt to prove

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the validity of the Simon Necronomicon is....the Simon Necronomicon.... Also, it keeps talking about Kutulu being a real ancient Sumerian god. There is no Sumerian god named Kutulu, outside of the author's imagination. Kutulu is not a Sumerian word at all. Mayhaps they should actually bother reading Sumerian mythology instead of taking the author's word for it, and using his own book to prove itself as being real. Or something like that. (No offense, Suspiria. Not criticizing you for posting it.)
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reply posted on 5-9-2012 @ 05:53 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by Phenomium

phroziac

I'll have to say, I like you man. You just look like "Big Bang Theory Type"....and I am more of a jock type but with YOUR principles...it is indeed real. To dabble in this is to betray the rest of your life. It is one of those instances where you have to make a decision,...to do or ...not to do....and the rest of your life will be a testament to your decision.

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Phenomium, I agree with you; he can write too. I am also a 'jock' type outwardly, but inside, I am a boiling, gurgling mass of extreme geekiness. There is something Irresistible about phroziac. I say we start a cult and call ourselves 'Phrozians' for a while, at least till we get board, then maybe we can turn on him and eat him. Just a suggestion.

X.

reply posted on 6-9-2012 @ 12:20 AM by Xoanon

Welllllll, That was fun. Thank you all for coming by and contributing, it is always nice to meet, in some small way , the others that will be around us when we are all eaten reasonably firstish this December So I wanted to conclude by re-posting the Peter Levenda quote that EarthCitizen23 shared with us.

The people we trust are those who can measure the measurable. The people we distrust are those who point to the invisible and shout to get our attention. Our world is marching calmly to an obscure and unknowable end because we, the people, hear the drum, feel the beat, know our place in line. Thats better, somehow, than jumping off the path into the dark forest where God dwells like a hungry tiger. There is too much personal responsibility in jumping out of line, and if you then try to jump back in, you will nd you have lost your place and your fellow marchers no longer want you to join them. You are dirty; you are crazed; you have seen what they are afraid to see. -Peter Levenda. Sinister Forces: A Grimoire of American Political Witchcraft sinisterforces.info...

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Can I hear an , Amen?!

reply posted on 6-9-2012 @ 01:57 AM by Maroboduus

aw man, are you done with the thread? I was enjoying it, despite my earlier negativity....

reply posted on 6-9-2012 @ 07:42 PM by Xoanon

Oh wait...

YouTube Link

There we go.

x.

reply posted on 7-9-2012 @ 05:25 AM by reject

this site claims the necronomicon is real and was "incorporated" by Crowley's "The Book of the Law" which was in turn "incorporated" by Lovecraft's "The Call of Cthulhu."

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Al Azif: Is The Necronomicon Real?, page 5

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reply posted on 17-9-2012 @ 09:58 PM by Guyfriday

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Sorry, but after lurking in the shadows of ATS I have to post something on this; The book doesn't exist (as many have said), but the idea of a book like this could exist. Please let me explain: The idea of finding a "Lost Book of Wisdom" out in the desert is very possible. Many nomatic tribes in the Arabian Desert hide books that have been past down for 100s of years within a clan. Some of these books pre-date the rise of Islam in Arabia (so yes they are very old books out in the desert) Due to the nature of these little known religons (at the time), a person who came across one of these books may have misunderstood the contents of what they have found. While the idea of using a recurring mystery book wasn't exclusive to Lovecraft (look up "The King in Yellow") His short stories seem to have hit a nerve better than any other writer has. I think thats the biggest mystery about it is, "Why does this one non-book affect so many people the way it does?" Thank you for reading.

reply posted on 18-9-2012 @ 06:12 PM by Xoanon

reply to post by Guyfriday

You are welcome.

I think that's the biggest mystery about it is, "Why does this one non-book affect so many people the way it does?"

Yes, you've got it. I like to think that that is what this whole thread is about. It does not provide many answers but I think that it concentrates the subject in such a way that we might be able to see something we have not in relation to your question, or maybe see the same stuff, only more clearly and in more detail. There are some pretty funky posts on this thread, I hope you'll take the time to check them all out.

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Thanks for stopping by, X.

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