Punishment vs.

Logical Consequences
What's the Difference?
Responsive Classroom Newsletter: August 1998
Logical consequences are directly related to children's behaviors and help them
to fix their mistakes.
The use of logical consequences is one part of an approach to discipline used in the Responsive
Classroom. Its a powerful way of responding to childrens misbehavior that not only is effective
in stopping the behavior but is respectful of children and helps them to take responsibility for
their actions.
Teachers often ask, How are logical consequences any different from punishment? It is a
critical question because there are some basic and important diffrences between the two
differences that must be understood in order to use logical consequences well. Take the
following example:
Six-year-old Jacob is zooming around the classroom when suddenly he trips and falls into
Michelles block building. Michelle lets out a scream and the teacher comes over.
Using punishment
This first scenario involves a teacher who uses punishment. Feeling irritated, the teacher looks at
Jacob and says loudly in front of the other children, I have told you over and over again not to
run in this classroom. Now see what youve done with your carelessness. Go sit in that chair and
dont move until its time for lunch.
What might be going on for Jacob? He might be thinking, I wasnt even running. The teacher
doesnt know what shes talking about. Shes always picking on me. Now everybodys looking at
me. I hae this school. It was a stupid building anyway.
Now, heres what might happen with a teacher who uses logical consequences. The teacher,
although also feeling irritated, takes a deep breath and makes herself begin by describing what
she sees: Michelle is very upset right now because Jacob knocked over her building. I need to
talk with Jacob first and then well figure out how to help Michelle.
The teacher takes Jacob aside and begins by asking him a question.
What happened?
I just tripped and fell into it accidentally. I didnt mean to knock it over.
Hmmm. So it was an accident. I did notice that you were running before it happened. Could that
have been why you fell?
Maybe.
When kids run in the classroom, accidents often happen. Thats why our rule says to be safe.
What do you think you could do to help Michelle?
I dont know.
Maybe she would like some help putting the building back up.
Jacob nods and the teacher walks back with him to the block area. Michelle accepts Jacobs offer
to help and together they build for the rest of the period.
Now, what might be going on for Jacob? He might be learning, When I knock things down I
have to help build them back up. I can fix things when I mess up. My teacher helps me solve
problems. I have to remember to walk in the block area.
Here are some of the fundamental differences in the two approaches:
The goal of punishment is to enforce compliance with the rules by using external controls or authoritarian
discipline.
While effective in stopping the misbehavior of the moment, punishment does little to
increase student responsibility.
Punishment often leads to feelings of anger, discouragement and resentment, and an
increase in evasion and deception.
The goal of logical consequences is to help children develop internal understanding, self-control, and a desire
to follow the rules.
Logical consequences help children look more closely at their behaviors and consider the
results of their choices.
Unlike punishment, where the intention is to make a child feel shamed, the intention of
logical consequences is to help children develop internal controls and to learn from their
mistakes in a supportive atmosphere.
Logical consequences are respectful of the childs dignity while punishment often calls upon an element of
shame.
Logical consequences respond to the misbehavior in ways that preserve the dignity of the
child. The message is that the behavior is a problem, not that the child is a problem.
The teachers tone of voice is critical in distinguishing logical consequences from
punishment. There are many ways to say to a child that theyve spilled their juice and
should clean it up. If the tone is angry or punitive, then its no longer a logical
consequence.
The same consequence can be respectful in one situation and demeaning in another.
Mopping the floor is a respectful consequence for the child who chooses to have a water
fight at the drinking fountain, but not for the child who fails to complete his work.
Logical consequences are related to the childs behavior; punishment usually is not.
Leaving the group is related to being disruptive in a group; missing recess is not.
Cleaning up graffiti on the bathroom wall is related to drawing the graffiti on the wall;
being suspended from school is not.
Logical consequences require that the teacher gather more information before reacting.
The teacher takes time to assess the situation and determine, sometimes with input from
the child, what will help fix the problem.
Here are a few questions teachers might ask themselves when trying to assess a situation:
What are the developmental issues at work here?
Is it clear to the child what is expected?
What rule is being broken?
What problem is the behavior creating?
What will help to solve the problem?
The belief underlying the use of logical consequences is that with reflection and practice children will want to
do better, whereas the belief behind punishment is that children will do better only because they fear
punishment and will seek to avoid it.
Teachers using logical consequences begin with a belief in the basic goodness of children
and the knowledge that every child is a learner, struggling to establish meaningful
relationships with us, each other, and the school community.
These teachers expect that all children will from time to time lose their control and make
mistakes.
The use of logical consequences helps children fix their mistakes and know what to do
next time.
Teachers frequently ask, Is it ever okay for a child to feel bad about their behavior? Of course
it is. When children misbehave, chances are they already feel bad. Our job is not to make them
feel worse but to help them choose a better course of action the next time.
As Ruth Sidney Charney says in Teaching Children to Care, Our goal, when children break
rules, is never to make them feel bad or defeated, although they may, in fact, feel bad. Our goal
is first to help them recover self-control and self-respect. When I observe a child acting the part
of the bully, or sneaking out of a job, or putting down a classmate or teacher, it is not a picture of
self-control and self-respect. It is a sign of distress and a signal for help. Something needs to
stop. The use of logical consequences urges respect for the rules and the people they are
designed to guide.

Recommended Resources

Here are some excellent resources for learning how to use logical consequences in the classroom:
Positive Discipline, by Jane Nelsen
Teaching Children to Care, by Ruth Sidney Charney
Setting Limits in the Classroom, by Robert J. Mackenzie
Positive Time-Out, by Jane Nelsen
Discipline: Natural and Logical
Consequences
All children misbehave from time to time. The goal of discipline is to teach the child appropriate
behaviors, but sometimes it can be difficult for parents to choose an effective and appropriate
approach to their childs misbehavior.
Threats and punishment may be effective in managing the childs behavior in the short-term, but
these approaches do not tend to teach the child to make proper choices and accept the
consequences. Consequences are different from threats and punishment in that they are not
random, do not negatively affect parent-child relationship and do not hurt the child (causing the
child to withdraw, or react with anger or revenge).
Two of the more effective approaches to discipline are natural and logical consequences.
Natural consequences occur when parents do not intervene; for example, allowing a child who
refuses to wear gloves in the winter to walk from home to the car without wearing gloves the
childs hands will get cold and he or she might choose to wear gloves the next time. In these
situations, it is important to abstain from lecturing (i.e. I told you so), but instead empathize
with the childs feelings and assist the child with problem solving for next time.
Natural consequences can only be used when the consequence to a behavior occurs quickly and
safely. In situations in which consequences to behaviors are too dangerous (i.e. running into a
street) or too delayed (i.e. not doing homework) to be effective, logical consequences should be
used instead.
Logical consequences have a logical connection to the misbehavior, teach children to make
choices and accept responsibility for their behavior. Logical consequences work best when they
are agreed upon in advance. During a calm moment, talk to your child about a recent incident
when an undesirable behavior occurred; sometimes it is possible to gain insight into the reasons
the child misbehaved by talking to them. State specifically what behavior is undesirable and
why. Separate disapproval of the child from disapproval of the behavior (i.e. its not the child
who has been bad, but rather the behavior that has been undesirable). Emphasize problem-
solving approach and encourage the child to generate possible consequences that are reasonable,
rational and related to the behavior. Although the parent should emphasize cooperation with the
child, it is ultimately up to the parent to decide on the appropriate consequences and inform the
child of them in advance.
When a situation arises, remind the child of the agreed upon consequences in simple terms (i.e.
if ___ then ___); this should not be done in a form of an ultimatum or punishment, but rather
in a kind and consistent manner. A child, knowing the consequences for his or her actions, then
has a choice to behave in a desirable or undesirable way. It is important to remember that the
parent does not punish the child, but rather reinforces consequences for the behavioral choices
made by the child.
The most effective consequences occur immediately (there is a clear behavior-consequence
connection), are relatively short (i.e. not grounding a child for weeks), developmentally
appropriate and consistent (occur each time a behavior occurs). The parent should agree only to
the consequences that he or she is willing to carry out consistently (for example, if a
consequence for misbehavior in a store is an immediate return home, the parent must be prepared
to stop shopping mid-way and leave the store with the child).
When following through with a consequence be kind and firm, do not engage in an argument or
negotiation, and let the child know that they will have another opportunity to behave differently.
It is equally important to have consequences for desirable behavior as well in order to increase
chances that the desirable behavior will be repeated next time.

As noted above, consistency with disciplinary approaches is important in order for the child to
behave consistently across different contexts. For example, when children behave differently
with parents and grandparents, it is often a reflection of different consequences to their behaviors
from different caregivers. In such situations, it might be helpful for all caregivers to agree to
implement the same consequences for the childs behavior.
Agreement of Consequences during calm moment
ogical Consequences - Dreikurs
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Model Information
Logical Consequences - Rudolf Driekurs


Underlying Assumptions
Inappropriate behavior is motivated by a need to gain attention, exercise power,
exact revenge, or display inadequacy
If the motive for attention is satisfied, inappropriate behavior associated with
other motives will not be manifested
Inappropriate behavior can be terminated by helping students find legitimate ways
to satisfy their needs
Children can learn to understand their own motives and consequently eliminate
misbehavior by having teachers help them explore why they behave as they do
Students behave more appropriately in the classroom when they suffer the logical
consequences of their behavior
Presenting students with a choice between two alternative behaviors offers a
sufficient basis on which they can learn to be responsible


Strengths
Promotes a degree of autonomy for students.
It incorporates a preventative approach to discipline.
It helps students to understand why they behave as they do.
It helps students to learn correct behavior.
It promotes mutual respect between teachers and students.
It relies on logical consequences instead of arbitrary punishment and systematic
reinforcemen
It helps teacher focus on causes for behavior before they take action.


Weaknesses
Teachers have trouble determining the actual motives of their students.
Students may not admit their real motives, either because they believe that their
motives are unacceptable or because they do not know what they are.
Teachers may find it difficult to respond to students in a non-controlling way.
Teachers may have a problem dealing with the complexity of engaging in a dialogue
with their students.


Corrective Discipline
Teachers attempt to ascertain students motives.
Students are helped to understand their motives.
Students are helped to exchange their mistaken goals for useful ones.
Students are encouraged to become committed to their new goal orientation.
Students are taught to apply logical consequences.
Group discussions regarding class rules and problems are held.


Preventative Discipline
Ensure that everyone's needs for attention and acceptance are met.
Avoid reinforcing or provoking misbehaviour.
Develop a trusting relationship between you and your students.
Find value in each of your students.
Be flexible enough to maintain a positive attitude about every student.
Engage students in planning logical consequences.
Allow students to work at their own pace, be spontaneous, be enthusiastic, explore
personal interests, and accept responsibility for themselves.


Other Important Information
Motives for Behavior1.Gaining attention2. Exercising power3. Exacting revenge4.
Displaying inadequecy -A key tenat of logical consequences is that children should be given
a choice rather than forced to behave as directed. -According to Dreikurs, students
misbehave because their needs are not met. -Discipline problems can be prevented through
the use of class discussions and the application of logical consequences.


Personal Reviews

Sarah:I personally think that logical consequences are great in the classroom. I think it is
good for students to understand a consequence they are given because of an action they
did. The consequence has something to do with the behaviour they displayed and so it
makes understanding what they did wrong easier. In my classroom I would make class rules
at the beginning of the year with my class and consequences that go along with the rules. I
feel that because every individual helped make the rules, they better understand them and
hopefully will have an easier time following them.
Jordyn:I like how this model suggests that we should help students understand their
motives and exchange those mistaken goals for useful ones because it helps them
understand what they are doing that is unproductive and how to improve. I also like how
students are taught to apply logical consequences because this is a good tool to have even
outside of the classroom.
Danielle:I love the shared responsibilty between the teacher and the students. It
becomes almost like a family. Everyone plays their part and contributes to making the rules
and making sure everyone follows them. Class meetings are an excellent tool. Students like
to feel involved and having a say in how the their classroom runs, will definitely help
maintain a positive relationship with the teacher and his/her students.
Brittany:I like the idea of logical consequences because they make the most sense to me
and I think that most kids can understand a logical consequence versus a general
consequence that doesn't really have anything to do with their misbehavior. I also like the
idea of class meetings to figure out what the rules and consequences will be. I think kids
will follow the rules better if they had a hand in making them.
Darci:I agree with Rudolf Dreikurs idea of Logical Consequences. Students misbehave
because their needs are not met. To avoid having to deal with a variety of misbehaviors,
teachers should make sure that their students' need for attention and acceptance is met.
Both, the teacher and students, work together to be successful learners in the classroom.
Logical consequences are great to help teach kids right from wrong. Dreikur's idea of
involving the students while creating the classroom rules is awesome. This is a technique I
would used in my classroom.
8 models.wikispaces.com/Logical+Consequences+-+Dreikurs
Discipline with Reasonable and Logical Consequences
Another important part of a successful classroom management program is being able to
discipline with reasonable and logical consequences. I do not believe that disciplining is
synonymous with punishment. Students must have structure so they can learn how to impose
limits on their own behavior. Having just finished my first week with my new class of first
graders, I have been busy putting my classroom management plan in action.
On day one, we discussed why we have rules (to keep us safe, to understand what behavior is
expected of us) and who has to follow rules (students and adults). My students and I wrote our
own class rules together.
They are as follows:
1. Be nice.
2. Keep your hands to yourself.
3. Do your best work.
4. No Talking when the teacher is talking.
5. Follow directions the first time.
Inevitably, when I ask students to share with me what rules we should have, they always come
up with some extreme answers such as no biting, no spitting, no throwing chairs etc. I fake a
horrified expression and tell them that I hope that never happened in their kindergarten
classroom and I know it will not happen in mine. And then I go on to explain how those actions
would fit under the umbrella of being nice to one another, which is rule number one!
Every day this past week, a few times a day, we reviewed our class rules and consequences. I did
have to give out several sad sticks for rules that were broken, but I took time to explain why a
sad stick was earned and we discussed what could be done differently next time. When we wrote
our class rules, students also agreed to our consequences. Slowly but surely, students are
beginning to understand that it is they who are choosing the consequence when they chose to
break a rule. On the other hand, if they are choosing to follow the class rules that they helped to
write, they are rewarded with praise and stickers galore on their incentive chart.
We did do quite a bit of role-playing about how to solve behavior problems this week. There
were also many interesting behavior solving situations that came up naturally. I always take the
time these first several weeks of school to begin to lay the groundwork of teaching my students
how to problem solve on their own. This following course of action can be used between a
teacher and student or with two or more students. After a problem arises, I ask the student to use
their words to describe the problem, what caused it and how they feel about it. I model active
listening and train others to do the same, restating what the upset student has said. I then ask for
solutions to the problem and have the student choose one. Finally, it is agreed that the solution
will be given a try to see if it worked. If not, we will offer up more solutions and try again.
Remember, if a student misbehaves they are only repeating behavior, that in the past gained them
attention, gave them power or masked an inadequate feeling. In my classroom, it is my job to
praise the positive and give matter of fact, non-emotional attention to the negative. The
consequences have already been laid out and agreed to, there is no worth to getting angry or
showing disapproval, a student must learn that they are responsible for their choices and the
rewards or consequences that come with those choices. Setting up the rules and reasonable
consequences takes away the opportunity for arbitrarily imposed discipline and allows your
students to feel they are in a safe, fair learning environment. Teaching your students to choose
between acceptable and unacceptable actions is a skill they will use for a lifetime.
"Experience is a great teacher and sometimes a pretty teacher is a great experience." Evan
Esar
Blogs.scholastic.com/1_2/2008/discipline
Discipline with Reasonable and Logical Consequences
Another important part of a successful classroom management program is being able to
discipline with reasonable and logical consequences. I do not believe that disciplining is
synonymous with punishment. Students must have structure so they can learn how to impose
limits on their own behavior. Having just finished my first week with my new class of first
graders, I have been busy putting my classroom management plan in action.
On day one, we discussed why we have rules (to keep us safe, to understand what behavior is
expected of us) and who has to follow rules (students and adults). My students and I wrote our
own class rules together.
They are as follows:
1. Be nice.
2. Keep your hands to yourself.
3. Do your best work.
4. No Talking when the teacher is talking.
5. Follow directions the first time.
Inevitably, when I ask students to share with me what rules we should have, they always come
up with some extreme answers such as no biting, no spitting, no throwing chairs etc. I fake a
horrified expression and tell them that I hope that never happened in their kindergarten
classroom and I know it will not happen in mine. And then I go on to explain how those actions
would fit under the umbrella of being nice to one another, which is rule number one!
Every day this past week, a few times a day, we reviewed our class rules and consequences. I did
have to give out several sad sticks for rules that were broken, but I took time to explain why a
sad stick was earned and we discussed what could be done differently next time. When we wrote
our class rules, students also agreed to our consequences. Slowly but surely, students are
beginning to understand that it is they who are choosing the consequence when they chose to
break a rule. On the other hand, if they are choosing to follow the class rules that they helped to
write, they are rewarded with praise and stickers galore on their incentive chart.
We did do quite a bit of role-playing about how to solve behavior problems this week. There
were also many interesting behavior solving situations that came up naturally. I always take the
time these first several weeks of school to begin to lay the groundwork of teaching my students
how to problem solve on their own. This following course of action can be used between a
teacher and student or with two or more students. After a problem arises, I ask the student to use
their words to describe the problem, what caused it and how they feel about it. I model active
listening and train others to do the same, restating what the upset student has said. I then ask for
solutions to the problem and have the student choose one. Finally, it is agreed that the solution
will be given a try to see if it worked. If not, we will offer up more solutions and try again.
Remember, if a student misbehaves they are only repeating behavior, that in the past gained them
attention, gave them power or masked an inadequate feeling. In my classroom, it is my job to
praise the positive and give matter of fact, non-emotional attention to the negative. The
consequences have already been laid out and agreed to, there is no worth to getting angry or
showing disapproval, a student must learn that they are responsible for their choices and the
rewards or consequences that come with those choices. Setting up the rules and reasonable
consequences takes away the opportunity for arbitrarily imposed discipline and allows your
students to feel they are in a safe, fair learning environment. Teaching your students to choose
between acceptable and unacceptable actions is a skill they will use for a lifetime.
"Experience is a great teacher and sometimes a pretty teacher is a great experience." Evan
Esar
Discipline with Reasonable and Logical Consequences
Another important part of a successful classroom management program is being able to
discipline with reasonable and logical consequences. I do not believe that disciplining is
synonymous with punishment. Students must have structure so they can learn how to impose
limits on their own behavior. Having just finished my first week with my new class of first
graders, I have been busy putting my classroom management plan in action.
On day one, we discussed why we have rules (to keep us safe, to understand what behavior is
expected of us) and who has to follow rules (students and adults). My students and I wrote our
own class rules together.
They are as follows:
1. Be nice.
2. Keep your hands to yourself.
3. Do your best work.
4. No Talking when the teacher is talking.
5. Follow directions the first time.
Inevitably, when I ask students to share with me what rules we should have, they always come
up with some extreme answers such as no biting, no spitting, no throwing chairs etc. I fake a
horrified expression and tell them that I hope that never happened in their kindergarten
classroom and I know it will not happen in mine. And then I go on to explain how those actions
would fit under the umbrella of being nice to one another, which is rule number one!
Every day this past week, a few times a day, we reviewed our class rules and consequences. I did
have to give out several sad sticks for rules that were broken, but I took time to explain why a
sad stick was earned and we discussed what could be done differently next time. When we wrote
our class rules, students also agreed to our consequences. Slowly but surely, students are
beginning to understand that it is they who are choosing the consequence when they chose to
break a rule. On the other hand, if they are choosing to follow the class rules that they helped to
write, they are rewarded with praise and stickers galore on their incentive chart.
We did do quite a bit of role-playing about how to solve behavior problems this week. There
were also many interesting behavior solving situations that came up naturally. I always take the
time these first several weeks of school to begin to lay the groundwork of teaching my students
how to problem solve on their own. This following course of action can be used between a
teacher and student or with two or more students. After a problem arises, I ask the student to use
their words to describe the problem, what caused it and how they feel about it. I model active
listening and train others to do the same, restating what the upset student has said. I then ask for
solutions to the problem and have the student choose one. Finally, it is agreed that the solution
will be given a try to see if it worked. If not, we will offer up more solutions and try again.
Remember, if a student misbehaves they are only repeating behavior, that in the past gained them
attention, gave them power or masked an inadequate feeling. In my classroom, it is my job to
praise the positive and give matter of fact, non-emotional attention to the negative. The
consequences have already been laid out and agreed to, there is no worth to getting angry or
showing disapproval, a student must learn that they are responsible for their choices and the
rewards or consequences that come with those choices. Setting up the rules and reasonable
consequences takes away the opportunity for arbitrarily imposed discipline and allows your
students to feel they are in a safe, fair learning environment. Teaching your students to choose
between acceptable and unacceptable actions is a skill they will use for a lifetime.
"Experience is a great teacher and sometimes a pretty teacher is a great experience." Evan
Esar