Cliffwood Parent Council

Meeting Minutes March 26, 2015

6:43 to 8:03 p.m.

Attendees:

Sarah Frost (Principal), Gayle Mercurio (Teacher), Patricia Leblond (Teacher), Lois Woodland
(Teacher), Maria Rodrigues (Teacher), Ruth Bell (TDSB Safe & Caring Schools), Linda Curtis (TDSB
Superintendent), Alexander Brown (TDSB Trustee), Paul Kang, Julie Kwok, Eric Fung, Gabriela
Rotaru, Horia Tudosie, Karen Chan, Simon Tam, Yin Hua Qi, Christie Chung, Goli Vakilian, Oleg
Sergeyev, George Natchov, Christina Natchov, Roxanne Neagu, Svetlana Bojilov, Derya Ozturk,
Willie Chan, Shawna Soever, Ivar Soever, Sheleen Jaffer, Miki Zhu, Yinmin Chen, Myron Meng,
Anar Ismayilov, Lily Xia, Haiyan Zhan, Linda Xiang, Max Volkov, Nancy Chen, Wenyan Zhang, Alice
Wang, Heba Sabry, Mohammad Labbaf

Regrets:

Simona Matasaru, Melanie Rubens

Chairperson:

Paul Kang

Location:

Cliffwood Public School

Agenda
1. Introductions
2. Vice Principal Allocation
3. Plan/Strategy for Growing Enrollment
4. School Safety & Security
5. Open Concept Classroom Design (Partitions)
6. Other Questions
1. Introductions
1.1. Alexander Brown (TDSB Trustee)
1.2. Linda Curtis (TDSB Superintendent)
1.3. Ruth Bell (TDSB Safe & Caring Schools)
2. Vice Principal Allocation
2.1. Confirmed that Cliffwood will receive allocation for a Vice Principal with teaching responsibilities for
2015-2016 year
2.2. Does not result in any loss of teaching allocation to Cliffwood
2.3. End of April, Linda will work with staff and parents to build a profile for desired candidates, with Linda
recommending candidates for board approval
2.4. Question: Will the Vice Principal allocation be reviewed each year?
2.4.1. Linda: Yes
2.5. Question: Who's involved in the interview process to select a Vice Principal?
2.5.1. Linda: No interviews occur for individual schools. All candidates are qualified and reviewed by
TDSB Parent Involvement Advisory Committee (PIAC). It is more of a selection from eligible
Cliffwood Parent Council

candidates. Linda picks candidates based on the profile.

2.6. Question: When would we find out the name of the VP?
2.6.1. Linda: We should hear sometime between May-June
2.6.2. Alexander: Trustee has no role in the interview process. We used to be more involved in Principal
decisions, but degree of trustee influence is being reduced.
3. Plan/Strategy for Growing Enrollment
3.1. Linda: Had meeting with John Tancredi (TDSB Central Coordinating Principal, Teaching and Learning).
Original plan was for two (2) Grade 4 Extended French (EF) classes, but after discussion of the strain on
Cliffwood, planners have cut back to one (1) Grade 4 EF class. Additional enrollment that cannot be
accommodated at Cliffwood will be redirected to Rene Gordon. Current Grade 4 EF classes will continue
on through Cliffwood. Based on current anticipated enrollment, it would mean no new portables for
2015/2016. There is a long-term accommodation plan, which Alexander also looks at, that is trying to
address French Immersion enrollment across the entire ward.
3.2. Question: Does this decision result in a cap on new students?
3.2.1. Linda: This addresses the EF program, but does not put a cap on English enrollment. We don't get
additional provincial funding to build new schools because other schools in TDSB are not at
capacity.
3.2.2. Alexander: The Local Feasibility Team at TDSB is evaluating programs and enrollment across
schools to try and balance capacity. Principals have also been consulted. Goal is to balance out
number of students long-term.
3.2.3. Linda: This is an internal TDSB staff process. Once options are identified, the communities will be
consulted on those viable options.
3.3. Question: Is it the board's plan to eventually get rid of portables?
3.3.1. Alexander: Obviously the ideal situation, but no guarantees. Ministry guideline is that optimal
capacity is 80%. Very difficult to do in TDSB due to varying capacities across different wards. Even
when we sell underutilized schools, the plans for those funds must first be approved by the
provincial Ministry.
3.3.2. Linda: Because populations expand and contract, 2-3 portables at any given school for a few years
is considered acceptable to help address a potential temporary spike in enrollment. TDSB planners
will typically leave them to see if the spike will resolve itself. But other schools have many
portables (Secord has 35) because they are waiting for capital approval to expand or renovate.
3.3.3. Linda: Long-term plans are posted publicly on TDSB. Right now, we don't believe any additional
portables will be required next year.
3.4. Question: Cliffwood is currently rated at 96% capacity, yet we needed portables. The formula appears
flawed. Can you clarify how the Ministry calculates capacity?
3.4.1. Linda: The Ministry formula includes library, offices, hallways, daycare spaces. TDSB has separate
formula that more accurately measures teaching space.
3.4.2. Alexander: The Ministry has floorplans for every school in every board, but intentionally challenge
boards to ensure that boards are properly managing their own capacity.
3.5. Question: What happens if we have more than one (1) early French Immersion (FI) class?
3.5.1. Linda: FI programs are on a separate stream from EF programs. The cap of 1 class is for the EF
program
3.6. Question: What's the cap on FI class sizes?
3.6.1. Linda: The board has mandated a cap of 20 for primary classes (G1-3), but there is no cap for
juniors. Obviously, with some schools, we are seeing increased class sizes beyond that. Boardwide, the average is 27 students for junior (G4-6)
3.7. Question: Is there any discussion/collaboration with the Catholic schoolboard if they face similar issues?
Cliffwood Parent Council

3.7.1.

Linda: There are some things we do coordinate (eg. Busing), and there are some schools where
both TDSB and TCDSB schools are attached (typically through a community centre). We will rent
space out to each other, but typically for schools that are already closed. Those arrangements are
also typically done on a temporary basis (eg. Temporary relocation of students while their home
school is under construction or renovation).
3.7.2. Alexander: City Council has created a working group that includes representation from the 4
boards (TDSB, TCDSB, CSV, CSDCCS). There is also a City School Board working group. City Council
is concerned about the need to maintain public green space, but TDSB's objective is education,
which does not always align with providing public green space. However, I'm happy to take
suggestions forward to the working group.
3.7.3. SUGGESTION: Holy Redeemer is just across the park, but don't have strong enrollment. It would be
worth discussing opportunities to work together to balance our respective capacity issues.
3.8. Question: This year there will only be one (1) EF class. Next year, will that cap remain?
3.8.1. Linda: Because that's part of the discussion for the whole system, I can't say what will happen for
sure. John Tancredi is aware of Sarah, Linda, Alexander's concerns about capacity. However,
decisions will be made by the local feasibility team to address issues across the board. Towards the
end of the year (~September), we should have more information to share. Because of your
advocacy, the originally scheduled 2 classes have been decreased to 1. This also led to concerns
from some other parents that will not be accommodated now and whose children will have to be
bused to another school.
4. School Safety & Security
4.1. A walkaround was done with Safe Schools staff. Additional lighting and cameras have been approved to
improve safety/security at Cliffwood.
4.2. Question: Is there a timeline for when these improvements are expected to be installed?
4.2.1. Ruth: Request was approved 3-4 weeks ago, but no information yet on next steps. The
procurement process has recently changed, so acquisitions should happen faster than previously,
but not able to provide an estimate at this time.
4.3. Question: Can you elaborate on where cameras/lights will be located?
4.3.1. Sarah: Funding would be done in phases. Coverage is effectively all the way around the school
exterior. One camera will be at the front of the school, with others at corners, with 5-6 going all
the way around the school. Wattage has been increased on the lighting at the front of the school,
but additional lighting will be provided to better illuminate from the walkway to the parking lot.
4.4. Question: Related to safety. School policy is not to allow kids to carry phones until a certain age.
However, there are new models of phones that allow parents to connect and hear what's happening,
even if the child doesn't pick up. Is there any consideration to change the policy?
4.4.1. Sarah: Recommend tabling at the next Parent Council meeting. Related topics are being discussed
by the school's ICT committee.
4.4.2. ACTION: Paul to add mobile device accommodation to future Parent Council meeting
4.5. Question: Will cameras be constantly monitored? Or only recorded?
4.5.1.Ruth: During school hours, there will be monitors in the office. Feeds are also available to staff at
TDSB. However, cameras are not actively monitored at all times. There is no 24-hour central
monitoring.
4.6. Question: How long is the video retained?
4.6.1. Ruth: Recordings are kept for 5 days and are stored centrally by TDSB.
4.7. Question: Are camera feeds accessible for parents?
4.7.1. Ruth: No. Video would be available for authorities if there was an incident, but not generally
available for parents.
Cliffwood Parent Council

4.8.

Question: is there complete coverage, including portables?

4.8.1. Sarah: Yes, cameras are spread out to get as much coverage as possible, including portables.
However, primary purpose of cameras is for after-hours security.
4.8.2. Ruth: TDSB Security has increased random patrols in the evening hours. Toronto Police Services
has also put in a request to increase patrols around Cliffwood.
4.9. Question: Can we close off the parking lot in the warmer months as a deterrent? (recognizing the need
to leave the driveway accessible in winter for snow removal)
4.9.1. Ruth: We don't have caretakers doing external maintenance at night due to security concerns, so
we would not have a means to close a gate.
4.10. Ruth excused from the meeting
5. Open Concept Classroom Design
5.1. Linda: We recognize the importance of this issue to parents. We're not trying to block the installation of
partitions, but within the constraints of funding, we are looking for a way through.
5.1.1. There is a Central Accommodation Committee that must approve all requests. The Ministry
monitors capital spending and forces TDSB to select only 10 priorities each year for the whole
board. Last year, Cliffwood's request was not accepted. This year, we went asking about parent
fundraising to support installation of partitions, and CAC response was no. I went back a third
time, requesting if parents could fund a partition solution that was not considered a capital
expense. CAC said this would be allowed under the following stipulations. The solution must result
in no impacts to HVAC or Lighting, have no ongoing upkeep, and must be safe for students (i.e. no
risk of collapse).
5.1.2. In other schools that have put up walls, it is largely to accommodate full-day kindergarten. That
funding is no longer available.
5.1.3. Three (3) TDSB senior staff (Business, Real Estate, and Construction) came and met with The
Partitions Subcommittee and did a walk around and acknowledged that the concerns were
justified. However, all proposed solutions would require capital investment. A question was asked
if they have ever put up partitions that didn't require capital expense. All similar TDSB projects todate have been considered capital expenses. I'd like to meet with the Partitions Subcommittee to
develop a more specific proposal on the approach, in collaboration with TDSB staff.
5.2. Question: There was confusion if we can fundraise for this or not.
5.2.1. Linda: We can, but partitions could not be floor to ceiling as it would impact air flow. The selected
solution can't impact structure, must be low maintenance and must be safe. We had hoped that
Construction had done something similar elsewhere, but they've investigated and have found no
similar past project.
5.3. Question: We aren't the experts. We were expecting TDSB to be able to propose a viable solution that
we could then fundraise for.
5.3.1. Linda: We are suggesting that the Partitions Subcommittee meets with TDSB staff to come up with
options, not that Parent Council or the Partitions Subcommittee create a proposal independently.
5.3.2. Alexander: Makes more sense for Parent Subcommittee to work with TDSB staff directly.
5.3.3. ACTION: Linda Curtis to arrange a meeting with Parent SubCommittee and TDSB staff to define
potential solutions that would be acceptable to CAC.
5.4. Question: Technically, is there anything to prevent Parent Council from starting fundraising in advance of
final solution definition?
5.4.1. Paul: No impediment, though fundraising would be more effective with a defined target.
5.5. Question: Is there a way we can soften the CAC's stance on solution needing zero maintenance?
5.5.1. Linda: CAC explained that restrictions are based on Ministry's position about ensuring equity.
Otherwise, some wealthier neighbourhoods could easily fundraise for additional
Cliffwood Parent Council

extensions/facilities to their schools, with no similar opportunity for other schools.

5.5.2. Alexander: Pre-1997, trustees would work with communities to define the local education tax rate
based on community priorities. Post 1998, Ministry took over and removed that flexibility.
5.6. Question: Are we stuck with having to use TDSB approved contractors? What happens if we raise
enough funds, but TDSB doesn't have enough resources to actually install them?
5.6.1. Linda: TDSB has a list of approved vendors and contractors because it is work being done inside a
school and student safety must be considered. We would contract out to an approved vendor.
Depending on the size of contract, it would potentially go to tender. If it's small enough, it's
possible the vendor could do the work directly.
5.7. Question: Does the installation have to be performed by unionized staff?
5.7.1. Linda: We aren't necessarily constrained one way or the other because the solution should not be
considered a construction project.
5.8. Question: re Funding formula for capital projects. Is it the same between TDSB and TCDSB?
5.8.1. Alexander: Yes, but because TDCSB got rid of several schools several years ago, they were able to
start collecting education development charges that TDSB is not allowed to collect because of
under-utilized schools. TDCSB has been able to collect significant funds. TDCSB development
charges can only be used to build new schools or construction projects. TDSB maintenance backlog
of $3B+ because funding is prioritized to programming (would require sale of 250+ schools to
cover the gap)
5.9. Question: Clarification: Why can't I send my kids to a Catholic school if I'm not Catholic?
5.9.1. Catholic Board policies differ across regions. York region allows for non-Catholics to enroll, but
TCDSB does not.
5.9.2. TCDSB can also be hesitant to cooperate too closely with TDSB because it raises questions on need
for separate TDCSB.
5.10. Question: Linda mentioned that this is a new type of project for TDSB. Can we setup Cliffwood as a pilot
project for this type of Partition solution?
5.10.1. Linda: Yes. CAC is treating this as a new model and are interested to see how this approach might
be applied to other schools in future. The fact that they are allowing us to engage directly with
their staff means that they are investing to some degree.
5.10.2. Linda: Outdoor playscapes, basketball nets etc. are not considered capital/construction, so can be
funded by Parent Council. Other items like textbooks, facilities renewal, upgrade, infrastructure
improvements are not allowed. No school parent council across the province is allowed to
fundraise for capital projects.
5.10.3. Alexander: I would not want to encourage you to fundraise too much, as we also don't want to let
the TDSB or province off the hook for having to pay for reasonable school needs.
6. Questions
6.1. Alexander: Due to well-publicized issues at TDSB, the provincial Ministry required TDSB to meet 13
guidelines, which have been met. However, the Ministry is pressing on TDSB's plans for underutilized
schools. The original report was supposed to deal with TDSB governance issues, and not specifically
plans for underutilized schools. The Ministry has come back with a panel of 9 experts, which over the
next 8 weeks will define recommendations for improved Governance. Trustees are trying to define what
we want to tell expert committee. However, we also want parents to express their concerns, to be
included in the panel's findings. Parents are encouraged to tell the experts your concerns (if your
concern is governance or funding or other), so that Ministry clearly hears what parent priorities are.
Submissions can be done in person, mail, email.
6.2. Question: Concern about Sex Ed curriculum.
Cliffwood Parent Council

6.2.1.

Alexander: The provincial Ministry is rolling it out across schools for implementation in Sept.
However, TDSB and individual schools are not allowed to selectively implement the curriculum.
6.2.2. Paul: Suggest at next council meeting, we have an education session to cover specific concerns
about the curriculum.
6.2.3. Alexander: We will be having a Ward forum to specifically discuss. Next one will be at Churchill and
a representative from the Ministry will be able to provide details there. There may be space for
additional attendees beyond usual Parent Council chairs.
6.2.4. ACTION: Paul to send Alexander's Ward update and post on Parent Council with additional info on
the Health/Physical Activity curriculum.
6.2.5. ACTION: Paul to schedule education session to learn more about the new Health/Physical Activity
curriculum at an upcoming Parent Council meeting.
6.3. Question: In TDSB, seniority often bumps good teachers from our school. What can we do as parents?
6.3.1. Linda: Because its a collective agreement, we have no control over that. We hear your frustration,
but can't be changed without change to the Collective Agreement.
6.3.2. Alexander: We have little/no direct influence in negotiations relating to the collective agreement.
We are only consulted.
7. Meeting adjourned 8:03pm

Action ID
8.

23.
27.
29.

34.

35.

36.

Description
Bring forward request for
creation of class mailing
lists to teachers and provide
update by next meeting
Re-visit discussion on
ensuring nut-free school at
next meeting
Investigate usage of new
water fountains at other
schools
Gather teacher suggestions
on how to encourage
students to eat their
lunches
Share maximum capacity
and current occupancy data
for Cliffwood

Investigate identified
parent council issues and
provide update via Melanie
Rubens
Distribute PDF of Sklz Art
catalogue to Parent Council
and Members-at-Large

Cliffwood Parent Council

Date Raised
Oct 1, 2014

Actions

Assigned to
Mrs. Frost

Status
Open

Action Taken:
With Kindergarten registration
in Feb, this will be explored once
registration is completed.

Oct 29, 2014

Paul Kang

Open

Deferred to next parent council

meeting

Oct 29, 2014

Julie Kwok

Open

Waiting for teacher's funding

request before deciding

Oct 29, 2014

Mrs. Frost

Open

Nov 26, 2014

Paul Kang

Closed

Nov 26, 2014

Alexander
Brown

Open

Nov 26, 2014

Paul Kang

Open

As per TDSB, school capacity is

rated for 481 students. As of Oct
31, 2014, enrollment of 441
students equates to utilization
rate of 96%. Clarification on
formula to be requested at
March 3 meeting
Some updates provided by email
and noted in minutes. Further
clarification to be provided at
March 3 meeting

Action ID
38.

42.

47.

49.
50.

51.

52.

53.

54.

55.
56.
57.

58.

Description
Poll Members-at-Large for
preferred lunch-time
programs to be run from
Jan-Mar and Apr-Jun terms
Confirm where Northern
Karate donation of $2000
was allocated in school
budget
Direct Alexander Brown to
speak with David Percival in
TDSB Construction re:
Partitions in other schools
Submit tickets for TDSB to
service slow desktops and
optimize performance
Define list of technology
needs for Grade 1-3
classrooms for April Parent
Council meeting
Inquire if proposed
windows to replace
Plexiglass will be able to
open
Provide hyperlink to
Partitions petition, for
distribution to Parents
email list
Develop proposed parent
survey for drop-off
behaviours and review with
Paul Kang, Svetlana Bojilov,
and Sheleen Jaffer
Eric Fung to gather requests
for volunteers/committee
members and distribute by
separate email to Parents
List
Post requests for volunteers
to school website
Discuss mobile device policy
at upcoming Parent Council
Arrange meeting with
Partitions Subcommittee
and TDSB staff to define
potential partition solutions
acceptable to CAC
Distribute Alexander's latest
ward update to Parents List

Cliffwood Parent Council

Actions

Date Raised
Nov 26, 2014

Assigned to
Paul Kang

Status
Open

Action Taken:
Winter programs underway.

Jan 21, 2015

Sarah Frost

Open

Jan 21, 2015

Paul Kang

Closed

Feb 25, 2015

Mrs. Frost and

teachers

Open

Feb 25, 2015

Mrs. Frost and

teachers

Open

Feb 25, 2015

Mrs. Frost

Open

Feb 25, 2015

Roxanne
Neagu

Closed

Completed

Fe 25, 2015

Eric Fung

Closed

Completed

Feb 25, 2015

Eric Fung

Closed

Completed

Feb 25, 2015

Mrs. Frost

Closed

Completed

Mar 26, 2015

Paul Kang

Open

Mar 26, 2015

Linda Curtis

Open

Mar 26, 2015

Paul Kang

Open

Julie Kwok to provide specific

donation total to assist with
determination of where funds
have been allocated
Completed

Action ID
59.

Decision ID

Description
Schedule education session
on new Health/Physical
Education curriculum for
upcoming Parent Council

Description

Cliffwood Parent Council

Actions

Date Raised
Mar 26, 2015

Assigned to
Paul Kang

Decisions

Status
Open

Action Taken:

Date