BBL IN SENATE - Hearing On Issues of Local Chief Executives, June 3, 2015

Republic of the Philippines
CONGRESS OF THE PHILIPPINES

SENATE
Pasay City
COMMITTEE ON LOCAL GOVERNMENT
JOINT WITH THE COMMITTEES ON
PEACE, UNIFICATION AND RECONCILIATION; AND
CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS AND REVISION OF CODES
DATE
Wednesday, June 3, 2015
TIME
10:00 a.m.
VENUE
Sen. Claro M. Recto Room

Sen. Jose P. Laurel Room
Sen. Geronima T. Pecson Room
2nd Floor, Senate of the Philippines
Financial Center, Roxas Boulevard
Pasay City
AGENDA
Senate Bill No. 2408 An Act Providing for the

Basic Law for the Bangsamoro and Abolishing the
Autonomous
Region
in
Muslim
Mindanao,
Repealing for the Purpose Republic Act No. 9054,
Entitled An Act to Strengthen and Expand the
Organic Act for the Autonomous Region in Muslim
Mindanao and Republic Act No. 6734, Entitled An
Act Providing for an Organic Act for the
Autonomous Region in Muslim Mindanao, and for
Other Purposes (Introduced by Senators Drilon,
Sotto, Legarda, Recto, Binay, Escudero, Aquino,
Angara, P. Cayetano, Honasan and Guingona)
ATTENDANCE
SENATORS:
HON. FERDINAND R. MARCOS JR.
HON. SONNY ANGARA
Chairman, Committee on
Local Government
Committee on Local Government Joint with the

Committees on Peace, Unification and Reconciliation; and
Constitutional Amendments and Revision of Codes
Page 2
HON. JOSEPH VICTOR G. EJERCITO

HON. RALPH G. RECTO
HON. FRANCIS G. ESCUDERO
GUESTS/RESOURCE PERSONS:
Hon. Jose Y. Lorena
Hon. Senen Bacani

Hon. Froilyn Mendoza
Hon.
Hon.
Hon.
Hon.
Hon.
Hon.
Hussein Muoz
Talib Benito
Raissa Jajurie
Abdulla Camlian
Pedrito Eisma
Mujiv Hataman
Hon. Haroun Al-Rashid Lucman Hon. Jum Akbar

Hon. Mamintal Adiong Jr.
Hon. Esmael Mangudadatu
Hon. Abdulsakur Tan II
Hon. Abdulsakur Tan Hon. Norbert Sahali
Hon. Michail Ahaja
Hon. Antonio Cerilles
Hon. Daisy Fuentes
Hon. Jose Alvarez
Hon. Victorino Dennis Socrates Mr. Ramon Nunal Jr.
Atty. Smith General
Hon. Rosita Furigay
Engr. Al B. Belotendos
Hon.
Hon.
Hon.
Hon.
Hussein Amin
Jas Que
Ma. Isabelle Climaco
Peter Miguel
Undersecretary, Office of the

Presidential Adviser on the
Peace Process (OPAPP)
Member, GPH Peace Panel
Commissioner, Bangsamoro
Transition Commission (BTC)
Commissioner, BTC
Commissioner, BTC
Commissioner, BTC
Commissioner, BTC
Commissioner, BTC
Governor, Autonomous Region
in Muslim Mindanao (ARMM)
Vice Governor, ARMM
Governor, Basilan
Governor, Lanao del Sur
Governor, Maguindanao
Governor, Sulu
Vice Governor, Sulu
Governor, Tawi-Tawi
Vice Governor, Tawi-Tawi
Governor, Zamboanga del Sur
Governor, South Cotabato
Governor, Palawan
Vice Governor, Palawan
City Administrator, Isabela City
Legal Counsel, Isabela City
Mayor, Lamitan City, Basilan
Sangguniang Bayan Member,
Wao, Lanao del Sur
Mayor, Jolo, Sulu
Mayor, Bongao, Tawi-Tawi
Mayor, Zamboanga City
Mayor, Koronadal City, South
Cotabato

Page 3
Hon. Freddie Mangudadatu
League of Municipalities of the

Philippines (LMP) President,
Maguindanao Chapter
Hon. Alih Sali
LMP President, Basilan Chapter
Hon. Lampa Pandi
LMP President, Lanao del Sur
Hon. Cahar Ibay
Assemblyman, 1st District,
Maguindanao
Hon. Harold Tomawis - do
Hon. Khadafeh Mangudadatu Assemblyman, 2nd District,
Maguindanao
Hon. Ziaur-Rahman Adiong Assemblyman, 1st District,
Lanao del Sur
Hon. Majul Gandama
- do Hon. Janimah Pandi
- do
Hon. Hosni Macapodi
Assemblyman 2nd District,
Lanao del Sur
Hon. Yasser Balindong
- do
Hon. Khalil Hajibin
Assemblyman, 2nd District, Sulu
Hon. Myrna Ajihil
Assemblyman, Lone District,
Tawi-Tawi
Hon. Ahmad Ali Ismael
Assemblyman, Lone District,
Basilan
Hon. Ronie Hantian
- do Hon. Haber Asarul
- do Lt. Gen. Edilberto Adan (AFP, Ret.) Chairman and President,
Association of General and
Flag Officers Inc. (AGFOI)
Col. Cesar P. Pobre (AFP, Ret.)
- AGFOI
Gen. Renato de Villa (AFP, Ret.)
- AGFOI
Ms Edna Espinosa
- Chair, Lihok Wao
SENATORS STAFF:
Hon. Minda D. Lavarias
Ms. Shiela Mae P. Enriquez
Mr. Julius Palamos
Ms. Arifah M. Jamil
Ms. Jeng Rondal
Mr. Ginno Jaralve
Ms. Mary Caroline M. Perez
Ms. Sheryl Vargas
O/S Marcos
- do
- do
- do
O/S Ejercito
- do
- do - do

Page 4
Ms. Fiona Conde

Mr. Dominic Lacbayo
Ms. Sally Perez
Ms. Zheanne Aeson M. DantisMs. Kristela Castronuevo
Mr. Alemar Mosquito
Ms. Arlene Magtalas
Mr. Claro Sampaga
Mr. Ricardo Calimag
Ms. Jam Garcia
-
- do
O/S Legarda
- do
O/S P. Cayetano
O/S Recto
- do
O/S Trillanes
O/S Osmea
O/S Binay
O/S Poe
SENATE SECRETARIAT:
Ms. Assumption Ingrid B. ReyesMs. Nida A. Mancol
Ms. Anna Leah C. Catimbang
Ms. Cleofe P. Caturla
Ms. Jeanne M. Baisa
Ms. Christine M. Nery
Ms. Cindell B. Gealan
Ms. Jo B. Cadaing
Ms. Maribel P. Mendoza
Ms. Avigail G. Andaya
Ms. Ana Marie F. Deplomo
Mr. Daniel D. Diamzon
Ms. Mylene R. Palino
Ms. Laarni C. Vidal
Mr. Mary Jeanette L. Padilla
Mr. Eric Jalandoon
Mr. Ronnie Cabaero
Mr. Benjamin Oria
Mr. Lito Bancifra
Mr. Jose G. Busalpa Jr.
Mr. Roland D. Laureano
Committee Secretary, Committee

on Local Government
Committee Stenographer
- do
- do
- do
- do
- do
- do
- do Legislative Staff
- do
- do
- do
Legislative Page
- do
- do
Supervising Legislative Page
OSAA
- do
Audio Operator
- do
(For complete list, please see attached Attendance Sheet.)
COMMITTEE
ON
LOCAL
GOVERNMENT
JOINT
WITH
COMMITTEES ON PEACE, UNIFICATION AND RECONCILIATION;
AND CONSTITUTIONAL AMENDMENTS AND REVISION OF
CODES
Mancol
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June 3, 2015
10:38 a.m.
1
AT 10:38 A.M., HON. FERDINAND R. MARCOS JR.

CHAIRMAN
OF
THE
COMMITTEE
ON
LOCAL
GOVERNMENT, CALLED THE HEARING TO ORDER.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Good morning, ladies and
gentlemen. The hearing of the Committee on Local Government; the
Committee on Peace, Unification and Reconciliation; Committee on
Constitutional Amendments and Revision of Codes of the 3rd of June
2015 is hereby called to order.
Welcome to the Senate, ladies and gentlemen. I would like, for
the record, to acknowledge the presence of our resource persons.
Mostly, today, the agenda remains to be the Bangsamoro Basic Law. I
will not read the entire title, the Bangsamoro Basic Law.
And we,
today, are consulting with executives of the local government units

within ARMM and without ARMM so that we are trying to consult with
all the LGUs in the affected areas. And that means not necessarily just
within ARMM or within the defined Bangsamoro core territory but also
those outside who feel that it will have an effect on their LGUs.
I will go down the list.
We have a fairly complete attendance
here in terms of the LGUs and the ARMM officials. Let me start by the
OPAPP is represented by Usec Jo Lorena; and the GPH Peace Panel is
represented by Usec Senen Bacani.
COMMITTEE
ON
LOCAL
GOVERNMENT
JOINT
WITH
CODES
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10:38 a.m.
2
From
the
Bangsamoro
Commissioner
Froilyn
Commissioner
Talib
Transition
Mendoza;
Benito,
Commission,
Commissioner
Commissioner
we
have
Hussein
Muoz;
Raissa
Jajurie,
Commissioner Abdullah Camlian; Commissioner Pedrito Eisma. Thank

you for your presence here today.
Also here is the governor of the Autonomous Region in Muslim
Mindanao, Regional Governor Mujiv Hataman; and Vice Governor
Haroun Alrashid Lucman.
From the Province of Basilan, Governor Jum Akbar; from the
Province of Lanao del Sur, Governor Mamintal Adiong Jr.; from the
Province of Maguindanao, Governor Esmael Mangudadatu; from the
Province of Sulu, Governor Abdulsakur Tan II; and the vice governor
also of the Province of Sulu, Vice Governor Abdulsakur Tan; Province of
Tawi-Tawi, Governor Norbert Sahali; from the Province of Tawi-Tawi,
as well, the vice governor, Vice Governor Michail Ahaja; from the
Province of Zamboanga del Sur, Governor Tony Cerilles; the Province
of South Cotabato, Governor Daisy Fuentes; the Province of Palawan,
Governor Jose Alvarez and Vice Governor Victorino Dennis Socrates;
from Davao del Sur, Governor Claude Bautista.
Mayors that are here with us today, representing Isabela City of
Basilan, the city administrator, Mr. Ramon Nunal Jr.; and their legal
COMMITTEE
ON
LOCAL
GOVERNMENT
JOINT
WITH
CODES
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counsel, Atty. Smith General.
From Lamitan City, Basilan, Mayor
Rosita Furigay; from the Municipality of Wao, Lanao del Sur, SP

Member, Engineer Al B. Belotendos; from the Municipality of Jolo, Sulu,
Mayor Hussin Amin; from the Municipality of Bongao, Tawi-Tawi, Mayor
Jas Que; and the LMP of Maguindanao, Mayor Freddie Magundadatu.
From Zamboanga City, the mayor is here, Mayor Maria Isabelle
Climaco; from Koronadal City, South Cotabato, Mayor Peter Miguel;
and from the Municipality of Akbar, Basilan, LMP Basilan Chapter,
Mayor Alih Sali; the LMP of Lanao del Sur, LMP president, Mayor Lampa
Pandi.
From the Regional Legislative Assembly, Assemblyman Cahar
Ibay;
Assemblyman
Harold
Tomawis,
Assemblyman
Khadafeh
Mangudadatu, Assemblyman Ziaur-Rahman Adiong, Assemblyman

Majul Gandamra, Assemblyman Janimah Pandi; Assemblyman Hosni
Macapodi, Assemblyman Yasser Balindong.
From the second district of Sulu, Assemblyman Khalil Hajibin;
from the lone district of Tawi-Tawi, Assemblyman Myrna Ajihil; also
Assemblyman
Ahmad
Ali
Ismael;
Assemblyman
Ronie
Hatian,
Assemblyman Haber Asarul.
COMMITTEE
ON
LOCAL
GOVERNMENT
JOINT
WITH
CODES
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To speak for the retired officers, Lieutenant General Edilberto

Adan, Colonel Cesar Pobre, General Renato de Villa, and Ms. Edna
Espinosa.
I think I haveDid I miss anyone that we should put on record
as being here?
Very well.
This hearing is being conducted because of the
committees revelation that, in fact, during the negotiations between

OPAPP and the MILF that despite some conferences or conversations
between OPAPP and some of the LGU executives, there was no chance
to consult with the LGUs who are, I would say, the primary
stakeholders in this entire process.
Furthermore, it was pointed out along the way while we were
conducting the hearings that it was an anomaly to see that the
Committee
Bangsamoro
on
Local
Basic
Government,
Law,
had
not
conducting
hearings
conducted
any
consultation with our local government officials.
on
hearings
the
in
And besides that,
there have been constant calls from the very beginning of the hearing
process from our retired military officers who have experienced in the
area and whose experience is going to be invaluable in laying the
groundwork for what we are trying to do here today.
COMMITTEE
ON
LOCAL
GOVERNMENT
JOINT
WITH
CODES
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So, just as a procedural matter, what I will do is I will first ask

the officials from ARMM to give their positions, to give their comments
on the draft BBL. I will try to limit my questions because as you can
see, we have a long list to go through, and we have limited time to do
with it.
In any case, so we will start with ARMM and go on to the LGUs
that are outside of ARMM, and then we will hear from General Adan
who will give us his view on the Bangsamoro Basic Law as has been
given to the Congress.
So, without further ado, let us start with Governor Mujiv
Hataman. Gov, if you would like, you would take the floor first.
MR. HATAMAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Magandang umaga
po.
Just for the record, Your Honor, actually, parang even during the
process on the part of the regional government, parang hindi lang yata
consultation ang ginawa sa amin. In fact, I was invited many times to
join the panel, both of the GPH and MILF in Kuala Lumpur. So, ibig
sabihin noon, na-observe ko iyong process.
But I am here today, Mr. Chairman, dahil malinaw naman po
mula sa simula ang position ng regional government especially iyong
office. . . (nam)
COMMITTEE ON LOCAL GOVERNMENT JOINT WITH THE

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MR. HATAMAN.
especially iyong office of the regional
government sa executive. Because I learned the Regional Legislative

Assembly has their own position paper as legislative body of the
regional government.
Humarap po kami ngayon, Mr. Chairman, hindi na para pagusapan kung ano ang implikasyon at provision ng batas, kada
provision sa ARMM, dahil malinaw naman po sa ating lahat at mayroon
na tayong pinagkasunduan, halos lahat, at malinaw ito sa ating buong
kababayan na hindi naging tugon ang Republic Act 9054 pag pagusapan ang intention nito.
Naalala ko lang noong ni-review ko po,
noong akoy nasa Kongreso pa, iyong mga resulta noong proceedings
noong ipinasa ang Republic Act 9054. Noong panahon ng ConCon pa,
noong nagsalita si Senator Domocao Alonto kung ano iyong purpose ng
Autonomous
Region
for
Muslim
Mindanao
as
provided
in
our
Constitution. Walang ibang intention kung hindi, paano umunlad ang

rehiyon
at,
kapayapaan.
pangalawa,
kung
paano
magkaroon
ng
ganap
na
Dahil dito, pinag-aralan namin ang lahat noong
agreements hanggang sa Republic Act 9054. Lahat naman tayo dito

na nagkasundo at nagkaisa na dapat magkaroon ng kapayapaan at
dapat magkaroon ng pag-unlad. Pero dapat malinaw rin sa ating lahat
kung hindi umunlad and ARMM ngayon, maraming dahilan.
Pero
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magbibigay po ako ng ilang halimbawa.

dahil sa kaguluhan.
Ang isa, pinaka-factor dito,
At malinaw rin noong nag-conduct ng pag-aaral
ang World Bank, hindi lang sa ARMM, kung hindi halos sa buong
mundo, malinaw ang resulta ng kanilang pag-aaral. Sa lahat ng bansa
at komunidad na kung saan mayroong kaguluhan, talagang hindi
umuunlad ang bansa. Bibigyan ko ho kayo ng halimbawa dito. Noong
nagkaroon ng agreement ang MILF at ng GPH, nagsimula kami na
mamuno sa ARMM, negative point three (-.3) percent ang GDP ng
ARMM. Noong walang putukan mula 2011, 2012, nag-assume po ako
2013, hanggang 2014, pumalo ng 3.6 percent ang GDP ng ARMM dahil
lumago ang investment. Mula sa walang investor na pumasok, noong
2012 may pumasok na 500 million, noong 2013 may pumasok na 1.5
billion hanggang sa umabot kami ng six billion ngayon dahil nabalik
ang tiwala ng investment dahil wala na po ang conflict.
Another point, nakita rin namin dito, mula noong umupo ang
Pangulong Aquino, kinumpara namin ang investment ng gobyerno
mula noon at kung kailan kami nagsimula after 25 years--anyway, isasubmit namin iyong data, Mr. Chairman, para makatulong sa pag-aaral
ng Komite--malayo ang pinagkaiba. Kung noon-noon ho, halimbawa,
ang public investment natin sa daanan ay binuhos natin sa mga
regravelling, ang masasabi ho namin sa loob ng tatlong taon,
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nakasemento ang ARMM ng, more or less, 200 kilometers na hindi iyan
nagawa ng 22 years of ARMM.
At pangatlo, Mr. Chairman, nakita rin namin ang ilang problema.
Gusto kong tingnan at diinan iyong larangan ng edukasyon dahil
related ito sa issue ng awtonomiya. Oho, mayroong Republic Act 9054
at sinasabi ang mga ahensiya na ito ay devolved na sa ARMM. Pero
lahat ng ahensiya na ito, maliban sa DPWH, noong kami ay umupo,
lahat ng mga ahensiya na ito ay walang program fund. Tila ba binigay
natin ang ahensiya sa ARMM. Nandito iyong mga tao ninyo pero, sa
totoo lang, wala halos magagawa at ginagawa ang tao dahil lahat ng
programa ay hawak pa ng mga national line agency.
At ito ang
dahilan bakit namin sinusuportahan ang BBL dahil malinaw sa

proposed BBL kung ano ang hatian. At ang mamamayang Moro ang
magsasabi kung saan mapupunta ang pondo, hindi kada budget namin
kailangan buong kumpanya. Lahat kami ng mga ahensiya, ang RLA,
gumagastos kami palagi pag budget hearing.
Hindi ko sinasabi, Mr.
Chairman, na hindi tama ang proseso na ito.
Pero sinasabi ko mas
higit na mabuti kung itutuloy natin ang BBL at ganoon ang kalakaran.
Ang
Bangsamoro
Parliament
ang
pangangailangan ng mamamayan.
magde-determine
batay
sa
Halimbawa ho, mayroon kaming
dinevise (devise) sa ARMM na isang proseso ng budget.
Dahil tayo,
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ang accountability natin ay sa ating mga kababayan, therefore, gusto

nating maging proseso at participatory ang pagba-budget upang
makita ng ating mga kababayan kung saan napunta ang pondo dahil
sila mismo ang kasama rito.
Pero sa ARMM, hindi namin magagawa
dahil ang magsasabi kung magkano at ilan at para saan ang budget
namin, hindi po ang Regional Legislative Assembly at hindi rin po ang
regional government. Sa totoo lang, kung ako ang pasasabihin ninyo,
mas more autonomous ang ating local government units kaysa sa
current structure ng ARMM.
Ang ating local government units
puwedeng mag-function ang kanilang Sangguniang Panglungsod,

Sangguniang Bayan, Sangguniang Panlalawigan upang pag-usapan ang
kanilang budget. Pero sa amin sa ARMM, hindi. Lalong-lalo na ngayon
ni-line item natin lahat, once na pumasa sa Senado at sa Kongreso,
wala na kaming pag-uusapan sa ARMM. Parang ang sinasabi ko rito,
kung mayroon tayong i-improve sa BBL, dapat mabigyan natin ng
consideration ito.
Second point, Mr. Chairman. Tingnan ninyo, magbibigay ako ng
halimbawa, iyong kaibahan ng serbisyo ng national government line
agency pati iyong mga agencies devolved sa ARMM.
Halimbawa, sa
kaso ng DepEd. Ang programs, activities and projects or PAPssanay

naman tayo rito dahil dati tayong kongresista, hindi lang ako naging
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senadorpero ito iyong ginagawa natin sa budgeting--nandito si Mayor

Beng--sa Kongreso.
Ito ang tinilad-tilad natin.
Alamin kung ito.
Ikumpara natin, halimbawa, sa national DepEd, 23 ang PAPs nila. Pero

pagdating sa ARMM ay nine lang. Ibig sabihin, mayroong labing-apat
na proyekto o programa or activities, pinapakinabangan ng mga bata
sa labas ng ARMM na hindi pinapakinabangan ng mga bata sa loob ng
ARMM dahil dito sa istraktura at sa relasyon. Na ang tingin ko na ang
dapat pagbigyan ito ng diin habang tinatalakay natin ang BBL.
At ito pa ang masaklap, Your Honor. Halimbawa sa DTI.
May
PAPs ang DTI sa buong bansa na seven. Pagdating sa ARMM ay zero.

Sa DOH, mayroon silang beinte; pagdating sa ARMM, lima lang. Ibig
sabihin, ang mamamayan ng ARMM, kung mayroong beinteng health
services, lima lang ang pinapakinabangan ng ARMM. Kung maraming
nagtataka bakit sabi noong ilan, bakit nade-delay iyong project sa
ARMM lagi lalong-lalo na pag wala, tanggalin natin ang DPWH? Inuulit
ko ho, dahil lahat ng program funds ng agencies na na-devolve sa
ARMM ay hindi hawak ng ARMM.
agencies.
Ito ho ay hawak ng national line
Kaya nga natatawa ako minsan, kung nagmi-meeting ako
ng gabinete, bigla na lang mga kalahati ng aking gabinete ay wala.

Pag tinanong mo nasaan sila, kasi nandoon sa Palawan, sa Manila,
nag-a-attend ng budgeting process ng national line agencies. Hindi ko
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po sila masisisi.
Dahil nandiyan nga sila, kung wala ka namang
program funds, ano ang gagawin mo. Para kang isang sasakyan, may
driver ka, may pasahero pero wala kang gasolina.
So I hope itong situation, inuulit ko, Mr. Chair, ito ang dahilan,
ang tingin ko, na kung mayroon man tayong ipapasang batas, dahil
alam natin na hindi tugon ang Republic Act 9054 sa kasalukuyang
problema at social structure sa ARMM, hindi dapat mas mababa sa
ARMM ang ipapasa nating batas, dapat mas mataas.
Maraming-maraming salamat po.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you, Governor.
Gov, iyong sa first part ng inyong mga sinabi, ang sinabi ninyo
maayos naman ang takbo ng ARMM at napaganda mo na mula noong
ikaw ang naging governor at nakikita namin ito. Pero kung maaalala
ninyo/alicc
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THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). kung maaalala ninyo kaya

tayo nag-postpone ng ARMM election at kung bakit nating ginagawa ito
BBL ay ang pinaka pundasyon na dahilan na sinasabi is that ARMM is a
failed experiment.
Sang-ayon ba kayo doon na ARMM is a failed
experiment?
MR. HATAMAN. Masama.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Lahat ng inyong sinabi na
failure of the line agencies na gawin nila ang trabaho nila na magprovide ng pondo na i-implement iyong mga project.
Anong kaibahan ng magiging BBL, kung ilalagay natin iyong BBL
dahil ang line agencies ang may problema?
ayusin natin?
Di ba dapat iyon ang
Bakit ang remedyo doon sa problema ng mga line
agencies ay dito natin gagawin sa pagbago ng autonomous region?

MR. HATAMAN.
Actually, dalawang puntos ho, Mr. Chairman.
Una, dinipayn (define) natin iyong intergovernmental relation.
Dito
kasi sa RA 9054, immediately after the passage kailangan pa ang

Presidente mag-issue ng executive order para doon sa devolution.
Pero ang devolution na ito hindi na-fulfill at hindi fully na-realize.
Dito ho sa proposed BBL, dinipayn (define) natin kung ano ang
exclusive power, kung ano ang reserved power at ano ang concurrent.
So, hindi kailangan mag-issue ng executive order
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THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS).
But iyong devolution,
halimbawa, hindi specifically sa ARMM, pero sa mga LGU, under the

Local Government Code buo.
Nakumpleto ang pagka-devolve dahil
iyong 7160 applies to all LGUs. At sa pagkakaalam ko naman iyong

devolution ay kumpleto. In fact, iyong ibang LGU ay sinasabi masyado
ngang mabigat ang naging bureaucracy nila, that the point being, the
devolution
was
carried
out
completely,
at
least,
at
the
local
government level, hanggang sa mga governor.

So, ano pang devolution ang kailangan nating gawin? Dahil ang
pangkaraniwan na LGU ay devolved basically ang health at saka ang
agriculture. Iyong mga devolved functions ay matagal nang nabuo, 21
years na ang 7160.
gawin?
So, ano pang devolution ang kailangan nating
Again, itoy naging tanong doon sa hearing kahapon.
Bakit
kailangan na ibahin natin ang sistema para sa ARMM kung iyong

sistema sa mga LGU ay maliwanag na at tumatakbo naman? Doon sa
puntos nga ng devolution, as I said, paano mo sinasabi na hindi nadevolve ang functions when, in fact, sa LGU na-devolve lahat ng
functions na-specified sa Local Government Code?
MR. HATAMAN. Ganito ho, Mr. Chairman. Malinaw ho sa atin
may provision ang Constitution na dapat mayroong autonomous
region, di ho ba? So, noong pinasa natin ang batas na ito, dinipayn
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(define) natin kung ano iyong mga agencies ng national na dapat idevolve sa ARMM. Kumbaga hindi na national line agencies ang
gagawa, kung hindi iyong autonomous region na ho.
Halimbawa ho, public works.
Ang public works idinivolb
(devolve) natin sa ARMM, pinondohan natin ang ARMM so, lahat nung
daanan diyan ho na malalaki ay ginagawa na ng ARMM at hindi nung
national government at hindi rin nung provincial government.
So, ang sa public works,
iyong devolution, halimbawa, ito tinatanong nga, anong klasipikasyon

ng kalsada ang dapat i-devolve ang trabaho sa ARMM? Kasi mayroon
tayong barangay road, mayroon tayong municipal road. Ang barangay
ang namamahala sa barangay road.
And municipality, city, ang
namamahala sa municipal, city. Provincial road, ang namamahala ay

ang probinsiya.
works.
Ang national highway, ang namamahala ay public
So, ano iyong public works na ginagawa ng ARMM na
kailangang i-devolve?
MR. HATAMAN. Your Honor, bago ho ako umupo, ikwento ko
lang. Bago ako umupo, lahat nung national highways pag ginagawa ay
pinaghahatian ng ARMM at ng national government. Noong umupo ho
ako, pinag-usapan namin ni Secretary Singson, lahat nung national
highways sa kanila.
Only during my first year of my term na
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mayroong joint efforts ang DPWH central office pati iyong regional
DPWH.
Pero
noong umupo ho kami, dahil makikita rin ho natin
nandito iyong mga LGU, malalaman din ho natin kung gagamitin natin
iyong 20 percent nila ang para doon sa pag-aayos ng road sa buong
barangay ho.
Sigurado ako aabutin kami ng hundred years bago
masemento ang mga barangay roads kung 20 percent lang ang paguusapan.
Parang ang point ko ho, Mr. Chairman, ganito.
Ang denivolb
(devolve) natin is iyong function ng DPWH services to regional

government within the area of autonomy. Kasi iyon naman talaga ang
konsepto ho nung autonomy, hindi iyong function nung provincial
government or local government.
Halimbawa ho, di ba ho ang DPWH din gumagawa ng mga
proyekto, not national road sa other region?
Gumagawa sila kasi sila
ayhalimbawa, sa pagpatayo ng school building, ang public works ay

implementor, hindi sila ang nagde-decide kung saan dadalhin, kung
ano ang design galing sa DepEd, marami. But lahat ng infrastructure
na ginagawa, ang implementor ay public works.
Kagaya ng iyong
sinabi ay mayroon kayong joint effort, directed pa rin iyon sa national

highways, directed pa rin iyon sa mga national projects na ang nag-i-
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implement ay ang public works. Ano ang ating kailangan i-devolve sa

palagay ninyo?
Sabi mo iyong function.
Ano iyong function na sa
palagay mo ay kailangan pang i-devolve sa autonomous region?

MR. HATAMAN.
Halimbawa ho, iyong program funds na ina-
allocate natin sa agencies, since devolved na rin ng fully iyong ibang

agenciesHalimbawa,
ganito
Department of Agriculture.
lang,
Mr.
Chairman,
PCA
under
Noong kinukulisap ho kami ngayon,
tinamaan ng coculisap, ang sinisisi nung buong mamamayan, Ano ang

ginagawa ng ARMM? Teka, ang sabi namin, Hindi ho devolved ang
PCA sa ARMM, nasa Department of Agriculture pa.
Second,
halimbawa,
iyong
tanimirrigation,
tulad
ngayon,
kailangan namin maging self-reliant. Halimbawa, sa bigasan tulad ng

Lanao at Maguindanao ay napakalawak ng kanilang lupain, irrigable
areas, pero ang magde-decide noon kung sino ang mag-irrigate ho,
hindi kami, NIA.
Kasi ang NIA hindi po devolved sa regional
government.
devolve kahit saan.
Pero ang NIA hindi naka-
Ang NIA pa rin ang namamahala sa irrigations
kahit sa anong probinsiya, kahit sa anong LGU. At bakit nga kailangan

i-devolve?
Kasi maraming pagkukulang ang NIA.
Kahit pag-usapan
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natin ng matagal iyan detalyado ang kaalaman to tungkol diyan. I am

also the Chairman of Public Works kaya kabisado ko ito.
Ang tanong lang diyan is, ano ang magbabago doon sa pagdevolve nung mga sinasabi mong function na bakit natin kailangan
baguhin iyong sistema na lahat ng ibang LGU ay ganun ang sistema na
ginagawa?
At ang tanong ay, ano ang magiging trabahoSiguro
sabihin natin i-devolve natin ang public works, ibig mong sabihin ang
iyong suggestion na mas magandang gawin ay pati iyong mga national
highways sa loob ng Bangsamoro ay i-devolve sa Bangsamoro
government? So, ang Bangsamoro government na ang mamamahala
sa national highways sa pagpatayo ng eskuwelaha, pagpatayo ng
airport, pagpatayo ng puwerto, pagpatayo ng hospital ay ide-devolve
na natin lahat iyan. Iyong implementing lang, ang public works ang
sinasabi ko.
Iyong pag-implement niyan ay ide-devolve natin sa
autonomous region. Iyon bang sistema na pino-propose mo?

MR. HATAMAN.
Actually, Mr. Chairman, ang pinaka-essential
kasi rito iyong concept nung autonomy. Kasi dapat ho ma-differentiate

natin ang Local Government Code pati itong konsepto nung autonomy
as provided in the Constitution. Kumbaga, iyong function na which is
not unconstitutional na sinasabi natin na, halimbawa, ng national line
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agencies, pagdating sa Bangsamoro area or autonomous region dapat

iyan naka-devolve sa kanila kasi nga iyon iyong concept ng autonomy.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Ano?
MR. HATAMAN.
Or else, hindi na ho tayo magbubuo ng
autonomous region.
Gov, pag sinasabi mong
devolved, anong ibig sabihin ng devolved? May tao ang Bangsamoro

government na siya ang magtatrabaho, may magko-construct, may
contractor na galing doon na siya ang gagawa, hindi na gagalawin ng
public
works
iyong
mga
paglagay
ng
mga
imprastraktura
sa
Bangsamoro kundi ang Bangsamoro government lamang lahat ang

gagawa?
MR. HATAMAN. Actually, ngayoncpc
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MR. HATAMAN. ...Actually, ngayon ho ganoon ang ginagawa sa

ARMM. Ang naging problema lang in the past kasi hindi binababa ang
pondo. Actually, Mr. Chairman, even ngayon sa Republic Act 9054
So bale ang sinasabi mo,
na-devolve na nga dahil, iyon na nga, iyong pondo ang problema hindi
iyong function, na-devolve na, kasi, kagaya ng sinabi mo, iyan na ang
ginagawa sa ARMM. Ang problema ay hindi binababa ang pondo. So
ang problema hindi sa pag-devolve kung hindi sa pagbaba ng pondo.
Ibig sabihin, ang kakulangan sa sistema ay doon sa line agencies, hindi
sa pag-devolve.
MR. HATAMAN. Actually, Mr. Chairman, hindi lang sa agencies.
Ganito ho, sa batas sinabi i-devolve, sa Republic 9054. Pero iyong
devolution process, hindi nangyari.
Pero bakit ho ako humantong dito? Ang pinaka-essential naman
sa lahat ng programa kung bakit nagka-delay, kasi nakalaan sa
national line agencies, ito iyong esensya noong block grant.
Ibig
sabihin noon, kapag binigay mo ang block grant, ang gagawin ng

Bangsamoro
Parliament
depending
on
the
needs
sa
different
communities, kung ano iyong priority program, it is the power and

function of the Bangsamoro government.
Actually, mas iyon ang
konsepto ng autonomous.
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Ngayon ho iba iyong relasyon.
Halimbawa, DOTC, sabi nila,
Mayroon kayong DOTC. Pero sa totoo lang ho, ang ibinigay lang sa
amin sa DOTC is tao pati MOOE.
Even iyong authority hanggang
tricycle lang ang pwedeng i-register sa loob ng ARMM. Kapag lumabas

ka, mayroong ipaparehistro four-wheelexperience ito ng isang
Cabinet secretary naminpumunta ng Maynila, hinuli.
Ang point ko lang ho, Mr. Chairman, dito siguro, ito iyong mga
dapat maklaro habang nasa proseso tayo noong pagbabalangkas
noong batas para sa Bangsamoro autonomous.
Okay.
Thank you very
much, Gov. Mujiv.

Sinabi ko nga I will limit my questions, pero very interesting ang
ating discussion kaya napahaba ng kaunti.
But thank you for that.
The experience of the Regional Governor Mujiv Hataman is, of course,

invaluable to guide us on the improvements that we need to
implement to rectify what has been constantly described as a failed
experiment of ARMM.
So we move on now to the Regional Legislative Assembly. The
8th Regional Assembly of ARMM has given us a position paper and I
think it will be presented to the Committee today by Assemblyman
Ziaur-Rahman Alonto Adiong.
MR. ADIONG. Yes, Mr. Chairman. Thank you very much.
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Are you ready to present
the paper that you have given the Committee?

MR. ADIONG.
Yes, Mr. Chairman.
This is in support of the
previous position paper we submitted before this Committee when

your Committee conducted po the committee hearing in Cotabato.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thats right. Nevertheless,
maybe you can go through the salient points of the paper that you
have submitted today.
So Assemblyman Adiong, you have
MR. ADIONG. Thank you.
If I may be allowed, Mr. Chairman, to continue?
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Yes, you have the floor.
MR. ADIONG. Thank you.
In the name of God, the most gracious, the most merciful. All
praise is due to Allah, the God of no equal, the sovereign creator of the
heavens and the earth and all that exist. Peace and blessings be upon
the last prophet of Allah, Muhammad, the son of Abdullah, to his pure
progeny and to his fortunate companions.
Assalamu Alaikum Wa Rahmatullahi Taalla Wa Barakatuh.
Mr. Chairman, in behalf of the 8th Regional Assembly of the
ARMM, I wish to express my personal and our collective appreciation
for the conduct of this committee hearing on the Bangsamoro Basic
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Law. We truly appreciate the opportunity to address the Honorable

Members of the Senate and of the Honorable Committee on Local
Governments, believing as we do that this hearing is the best venue to
express all issues, concerns and sentiments on the very historic
legislation such as the pending BBL.
We would also, Mr. Chairman, like to extend our highest
commendation to the statesmanship displayed by the Chairman of the
Committee on Local Governments and its members in handling the
review on the Bangsamoro Basic Law placing the concerns of the
Bangsamoro people a priority legislation in our collective desire for a
genuine autonomy and lasting peace for the peoples in Mindanao.
It is our collective position, Mr. Chairman, in the current 8th
Regional Assembly to fully support the peace process between the
government of the Philippines and the Moro Islamic Liberation Front
that lasted 17 long years of hard negotiations occasionally punctuated
by three major armed encounters since the signing of the 1997
General Cessation of Hostilities pursued by then Ramos administration
which eventually continued up to this day and championed by the
Aquino administration under the principle of Tuwid na Daan.
As
native Mindanaoans and as a Bangsamoro at that, we should always

remain conscious of these historical antecedents that breathed new life
to the review on the Bangsamoro Basic Law.
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Mr. Chairman, we would like to manifest that the Bangsamoro

Basic Law should not be less than the Autonomous Region in Muslim
Mindanao. BBL should mean Improved Autonomy.
Mr. Chairman, we suggest that the powers already granted to
autonomous regional government by virtue of 9054 shall be retained
and shall not be removed but rather it shall be enhanced further.
All of us might be in agreement, Mr. Chairman, that the
impression that many of us have on the present structure of the
Autonomous Region in Muslim Mindanao based on RA 9054 has already
been judged by history as a failed experiment.
As a regional
assemblyman, although this is something that is really difficult to

accept, Mr. Chairman, I believe that such judgment has been passed
based on two very significant defects on Republic Act 9054. Number
one is the lack of genuine political autonomy and the other is the lack
of real fiscal autonomy.
Our Constitution mandates the creation of autonomous regions
for Muslim in Mindanao and in the Cordilleras because of shared
common and distinctive historical and cultural heritage, economic and
social structures and other relevant characteristics.
Since
1989,
we
have
seen
how
the
ARMM,
despite
its
shortcomings, attempted to live up to the vision and spirit that guided
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its creation which, in the words of the surviving framers of the 1987
Philippine Constitution, is all about human development.
We see the Bangsamoro Basic Law as one precious opportunity
to correct the structural as well as human flaws that have attended the
evolution of the autonomous regional government. The aspirations of
the Moros are comprehensively and well-articulated in its pages. This is
the best remedy to the present inequities that the ARMM has suffered
from, Mr. Chairman. If ARMM is dubbed as a failed experiment, then
as a matter of conscience and logic dictates that we must not replicate
the same mistakes again this time with the BBL.
We, therefore, humbly urge the Honorable Members of the
Senate of the Philippines under the leadership of Honorable Senator
Ferdinand Marcos to enhance it further, the version of this House, as
far as the review on the Bangsamoro Basic Law is concerned. This is,
Mr. Chairman, a lifetime opportunity to finally address the legitimate
grievances of our people and to create an atmosphere of peace and
progress for this age and for generations who have yet to arrive.
Again, we would like to express our gratitude to this Honorable
Committee chaired by Senator Marcos for extending to us the
invitation.
Peace be upon us all.
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Thank you, Assemblyman
Adiong.
I would like to acknowledge the arrival of Senator JV Ejercito to
join us in this hearing.
Assemblyman Adiong, as you said, there are failings in theyou
admit that the ARMM is a failed experiment, and on that basis, we
should improve the system and you feel that BBL has an opportunity to
do that. Do you have any specific proposals that should be included in
BBL so we do, as you say, not repeat the same mistakes that we had
made in the creation and in the implementation of the ARMM Organic
Law and its amendment 9054?
MR. ADIONG. Mr. Chairman, first of all, Id like to clarify that it
is not really the Regional Legislative Assembly who came up with the
phrase failed experiment. This is something that ...
No.
The phrase failed
experiment, came from the Palace.

MR. ADIONG. Yes, that is correct, Mr. Chairman.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). It was first used when we
were deliberating the postponement of the ARMM elections.
MR. ADIONG.
Yes, Mr. Chairman.
And that is precisely the
premise why we are having this review on the Bangsamoro Basic Law,
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its because of the perception that many has that the ARMM is not
failing.
And therefore, Mr. Chairman, this is an opportunity for us to
rectify the mistakes that were committed in the past, especially those
flaws that I mentioned in the Organic Act, which is
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). That is why, Assemblyman,
what are the specific areas that you feel need the improvement?
MR. ADIONG.
Well, as far, Mr. Chairman, as the Regional
Legislative... /jmb
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MR. ADIONG.
the Regional Legislative is concerned, the R.A.
1954 is very restrictive as far as exercising the plenary powers of the

regional assembly is concerned.
You see, there is a confusion that creates on the ground
whenever theres a law that is passed by Congress and a law that is
passed by the regional assembly. Mostly, these laws are to cover the
administrative functions of all line agencies in the ARMM. As Ive said,
as what the regional governor has stated, has mentioned before this
Committee earlier, the concept of devolution has not been finally given
to the regional assembly. Those line agencies in the ARMM have failed
to obey or to be instructed by whatever laws that come out by the
regional assembly.
But again, Assemblyman,
that would seem to be a failure of the line agencies and not the system
under which ARMM operates. If the line agencies and the officers that
are in those line agencies could perform their functions more
efficiently, then the problems that you quote and that the governor has
also mentioned would be solved. The solution does not lie in changing
the system as far as I can tell.
But if the solution lies in a more
rigorous implementation of the devolution and the other principles and
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it is a failure in implementation. Im not hearing that it is a systemic

failure.
MR. ADIONG.
I guess, Mr. Chairman, the problem really lies
on the system. I beg to disagree. Because, in the first place, ARMM,

under the Organic Act 1954 as far as the legislative function is
concerned, its very restrictive. There are enumerated restrictions as
to how to perform the regional assembly before its own mandate.
You see, Mr. Chair, the regional assembly cannot pass judgment
on local affairs because in the Organic Act 1954, it states that it must
be conformed with the national policies. Say, for example, as far as
the budgeting is concerned, Mr. Chairman, we do not
But you are saying that
you would like the regional assembly, legislative assembly, to pass

laws that are not in accordance with national policy.
MR. ADIONG.
No.
We are not trying, Mr. Chairman, to
compete with the Congress. What Im trying to prove, Mr. Chair, is on

the concept of autonomy which supposed to be on the essence of
parliamentary and essence of plenary powers
But, Assemblyman, you
said the limiting factor was that you are not allowed to pass laws that
are in conflict with national policy. So if that is the limiting factor, then
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it would seem to imply that you would like to pass ordinances and laws
that are contrary to national policy.
MR. ADIONG.
No, that is not my thinking, Mr. Chairman.
What Im saying, Mr. Chair, is that it creates confusion on the ground.

You see, there are laws that passed by Congress and that of this
Honorable Chamber, and there are also laws that are passed in the
regional assembly. There are certain cases wherein these laws are in
conflict. So how to go about with this, how to reconcile this, we dont
have that mechanism to do so.
And therefore, in all the line agencies, they preferred to
supreme.
National policy must be
The national law must be supreme.
reconciliation.
The national law must be followed.
must be followed.
There is no negotiation.
There is no
National policy
There is no discussion.
The laws of the land must be followed. And if anything is passed and
any inferior legislature, like the sanggunian, that is in conflict with any
laws of the land, then the laws of the land must be supreme.
So Im not sure what it is you would like to do that this concept
or this principle is not allowing you to do.
MR. ADIONG.
That is correct, Mr. Chairman.
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Under the economic provision of the Republic Act 1954 where the
assembly is mandated to provide franchise to all those companies
entering the ARMM and try to explore the natural resources. But those
fees, Mr. Chairman, only pertain to charges as far as operation is
concerned. The revenues Mr. Chairman, we are not allowed to impose
levy taxes as far as the major revenue collection is concerned and that
is already in the hands of the Congress.
And that is why, Mr.
Chairman, we are tied up, our hands are tied up to really exhaust all
the possible means to boost the potential of ARMM as far as its
economic survival is concerned.
here
is
essentially
revenue
So what we are discussing
enhancement
for
the
autonomous
government, is thatthose you feel that you are limited in the options
that are available to you for revenue enhancement.
MR. ADIONG.
Yes, Mr. Chairman.
So it boils down to
revenue enhancement that you would like to impose for taxes, you
would like to impose for fees, but that is not in consonance with the
national policy and the practice of regular LGUs.
MR. ADIONG.
The share, Mr. Chairman, of supposedly the
share, the inherent right of the autonomous government and Muslim
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Mindanao over those business interests that are coming in as far as

collection is concerned. And number two, Mr. Chair, there has to be a
clear revenue collection and policy direction as far as the sharing
between the central and the autonomous government is concerned
because that is already, not only silent in the organic act, but it is the
powers thats already been assumed by the central government. And
that is why, as Ive said, as far as the regional legislative assembly is
concerned, our hands are tied up to pass a law that has very, very
minimal effect on our economic condition.
Let us have a specific
example.
What law would you have liked to pass that you were not allowed
to do?
MR. ADIONG.
For example, Mr. Chairman, we are only allowed
to pass the Tax Revenue Code that we amended during the previous
assembly. But there are problems because it would be another issue
on double taxation.
That is correct, Mr. Chairman. The taxes that were supposed to
be getting from these companies are already given to the national
government and we are only limited to operational charges. And that
is one of the issuesthe scenario that happens, Mr. Chair, we cannot
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impose taxes. These taxes, Mr. Chairman, that we were saying, part
of our revenue collection.
If any local government is
to enjoy the benefits of the abundance of richness or services of the

state, then you must also contribute to the state. Hindi lang naman
one way, na dinadagdagan ninyo iyong buwis at nangongolekta kayo,
kailangan mag-contribute din kayo salike any other LGU. The LGUs
collect taxes, they have their local taxes but also the internal revenue
allotment, the IRA, they contribute to the national government and
part of that is given back to the local government. That seems to be a
fair arrangement.
Kailangan mag-contribute din.
Hindi naman
kailangan bastat isa lang ang direksyon ng pagpunta ng benepisyo.

MR. ADIONG.
Yeah.
But the difference, Mr. Chairman,
between ARMM and that of the LGU is the assembly is mandated to

create offices and also to create municipalities.
Where can we get, for example, budget for the operation of an
office being created if our resources is very, very minimal? And LGUs,
they are not mandated to create big offices, line agencies and as well
as municipalities.
I beg to differ.
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LGUs have many mandated offices and secondly, when you talk
about devolution, you ask any governor here about the load in their PS
of the civil servants in the healthcare sector kung gaano kabigat ang
napunta sa kanila but they have to live with it. They have had to live
with it.
What you are describing is the same situation that every other
local government has to operate under. Again, why should there be a
difference?
MR. ADIONG.
Because Mr. Chair, there is already a
jurisprudencetheres also a policy by the national government

especially the DBM that if an office is created or a municipality or
barangay is created, the budget that would be allocated for the
operation of such offices and barangays and as well as municipalities
shall be slashed out from the local funds that is gathered from the
regional
Thats the same as every
other LGU?
MR. ADIONG.
Yes. But that is why, Mr. Chairman, we have a
very, very minimal

So does every other LGU
have a very minimalWe will go through what are in an LGU.
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In an LGU, halimbawa, sabihin na lang natin that they are within

the limit of their PS which is 55 percent, which most LGUs are not,
lampas sa 55 percent.
But lets just say, 55 percent.
There is a
mandated appropriation of 20 percent, the 20 percent development

fund. After that, there is also a mandated calamity fund na pag hindi
nagamit kinukuha din naman sa LGU.
Anyway, what is left now/cmn
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what is left now to the
LGU? Maybe 15 percent of their entire budget. Pag maganda na ang

patakbo, that is the only thing that is left for the initiatives of an LGU.
How is that different from your situation?
MR. ADIONG. Let us go back, Mr. Chair, to the powers granted
to the regional assembly.
By virtue of Republic Act 9054, we are
tasked and mandated to create municipalities and barangays, line

agencies, and as well as province.
But then again, how can we get
these resources in order for us to allocate fundings for these line

agencies and
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Let me make a suggestion.
MR. ADIONG.
But the IRA, Mr. ChairmanIm sorry, Mr.
Chair
The LGUs to try to find
funding. Kung kulang ang IRA share, ang ginagawa nila pinapaganda
nila ang koleksyon nila sa real property tax.
Gumagawa sila ng
economic enterprise. They try to find ways to earn money somehow

para may pondo sila para magawa nila iyong kanilang mga project na
initiative nila. What is the difference? Why cannot the ARMM do the
same thing?
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MR. ADIONG.
I think the difference, Mr. Chair, is we are
expectedwe, Mr. Chair, we are only given, for example, as compared

to the barangays and to the municipalities which their IRA is
automatically devolved to them or downloaded to these agencies, to
the LGUs, in the ARMM, we have to defend our budget that is
determined and prepared by the DBM, and imposed a ceiling. So, for
example, the DBM decides to give us only one peso, we have to go to
the Senate and to the Congress to defend this one peso.
That is a
very dismal condition, Mr. Chair.

And, also, we go back to the essence of autonomy because if we
dont base our line of thinking in this review on the BBL on the concept
of autonomy, then theres nothing, Mr. Chair, Im sorry to say, but
theres nothing here to discuss other than to say that whatever the
government tries to impose on the people in the Bangsamoro, we only
have to obey and accept.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Again, that is pretty much
the same situation for every citizen of the Republic of the Philippines.
What is determined as policy by the national government,
everybody has to follow.
All of the government agencies have to
follow. All of the LGUs have to follow or else they will not be supported
by national government.
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MR. ADIONG. But their

THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). I dont see any difference.
MR. HATAMAN. Mr. Chairman.
MR. ADIONG. Mr. Chairman, theres also
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). The limitations that are put
upon ARMM are also put upon every other LGU, if not more so. So,
again, Im not clear. I understand that you, of course like all LGUs,
are trying to find ways to improve their financial situation.
That is
perfectly natural, and that is what all local executives have to do. But
again, the IRA, for example, of the local government units within the
ARMM are still given to them.
Now, in other regions, for example, there is no regional
government that has a budget of 24.3 billion in this year. All we have
in the LGUs is what we get from the IRA, from what we get from local
collections, and what we make on economic enterprises.
dagdag.
Walang
Pero sa inyo, ARMM, may 24.3 billion kayo sa 2015.
youre saying kulang pa rin iyon.
And
In our regions here, nandito si
Senator JV, kung madagdagan iyong region namin ng 24.3 billion ay

siguro we will be celebrating parang Pasko.
MR. HATAMAN. Mr. Chairman, if I may, Mr. Chairman.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Yes, Governor.
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MR. HATAMAN.
Mr. Chairman, ano lang ako, baka ma-
misunderstood iyong 24 billion. Mayroon kaming study, Mr. Chairman,

ngayon kinukuha ko iyong data, kinumpara namin, ni-lump up iyong
budget ng ARMM kasama iyong IRA, lahat, at ikumpara sa ibang
region, mas mababa pa rin iyong ARMM. Bakit ho? Kasi iyong sinasabi
nating halimbawa, twenty four point something billion, 60 or around 70
percent niyan ay mapupunta sa teachers, sa empleyado, na ginagamit
din noong ibang agency.
So wala hong bagong budget dito.
Nagkataon lang kasi nga dahil doon sa concept ng autonomy na dinaan

sa autonomous region iyong pondo.
Pag tinanggal mo iyong
autonomy, walang kaibahan iyon doon sa ibang region, and in fact,

mas malaki.
I-try nyo ho i-research, at I will give copy later, Mr.
Chairman, para sa comparison lang noong budgeting para hindi

mamangha ang ilan sa ating mga kababayan napakaespesyal naman
ng mga Bangsamoro dito. Pero ang reality ho niyan, hindi ho espesyal
pagdating sa allocation.
Ngayon lang din namin nararamdaman
actually na espesyal kami dahil ang public works budget namin ay

lumobo. Pero hindi ito nangyari noong mga nakaraan na ginagawa sa
ibang region.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Fair enough.
Thank you, Gov.
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Again, I did not mean to have an extended discussion with you,

Assemblyman Adiong, but again, these are issues that have been
raised in other hearings and it is very useful for us to ask you from
your own personal experience in the context, as I said, of other
ordinary, rather than special, LGUs.
So to move on at mahaba itong listahan, we would like to call on
the LMP President of Lanao del Sur, Mayor Pandi, President of the LMP
of Lanao del Sur, who will give us a presentation on their position.
MR. PANDI. Bismillah ir-Rahman ir-Rahim.
Assalamu alaikum warah matullahi wa barakatuhu.
My greeting of peace to everyone, especially to our Honorable
Chairman of the Committee on Local Government, Senator Ferdinand
Bongbong Marcos Jr., and of course, Senator JV Ejercito.
Mr. Chairman, with me today are practically all the mayors of the
provinces comprising ARMM. And just to be recognized, may I request
all my fellow mayors to please stand up.
Aba, kumpleto yata.
hope that may skeleton crew man lang na naiwan doon sa probinsya
ninyo. [Laughter]
Okay. To the mayors, welcome to the Senate.
Maraming salamat sa inyong pagdalaw.
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MR. PANDI. Mr. Chairman, we came to attend this Committee

hearing to show our support and solidarity behind the Bangsamoro
Basic Law.
We also would like to belie the insinuations and reports that the
local government units in the ARMM provinces are opposing the
Bangsamoro Basic Law. Mr. Chairman, we recognize the fact that the
interest of the entire country and of the Bangsamoro people is much
more important than our own individual interest.
That is why, Mr.
Chairman, we rest our caseour own political agenda to the

government.
So with that, Mr. Chairman, allow me, please, to read the
manifestation of support of the mayors of the ARMM.
We, the mayors, and other officials from the provinces of
Basilan, Lanao del Sur, Maguindanao, Sulu, and Tawi-Tawi, all under
the jurisdiction of the Autonomous Region in Muslim Mindanao, express
our unequivocal and unbending support for the passage of the
Bangsamoro Basic Law.
We declare this as we echo the resounding
hope of our people for the fulfillment of lasting peace not only for
Mindanao, but for the entire country as a whole.
This is our way of
showing to our constituents that as chief executives, we are not only

administrators, but most importantly, peace builders who represent
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the voices, the dreams, and aspirations of the Bangsamoro people.

We take note of how BBL has been perceived positively by majority of
the residents of the core areas of the proposed Bangsamoro territory
as shown by the results of the Social Weather Station Survey.
We
stand firmly for peace that has always been elusive for the people in
Mindanao, and that a status quo characterized by conflict is not
acceptable/cbg
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MR. PANDI.
is not acceptable.
We stand firmly against
Mindanao conflict and war that created an endless cycle of violence

that diminishes our peoples economic and social well-being, tarnishing
human dignity as conflict and war result in massive displacement and
deaths among our civilians, hunger and
poverty, human traffickings
and the disintegration of human moral standards. We believe that the

Bangsamoro Basic Law opens new opportunities for everyone in the
region.
Through its passage, the regional government and the local
government units would be strengthened further.

Currently, the ARMM is blessed with many natural resources
that can be tapped to help our people and our country in general.
Basilan is topmost in the production of rubber; Lanao Del Sur has the
Mindanao State University and the Lake Lanao; Maguindanao can
harness the Liguasan Marsh and is the top corn producer in the region;
Sulu has high quality coffee and durian; and Tawi-Tawi is the main
source of seaweed and high-value aquatic resources.
These
industries and and resources can be developed further if there is peace

in the region.
Peace can also provide the environment wherein our people,
instead of worrying about the conflict, can focus on economic and
developmental activities.
It has been shown that the current ARMM
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was able to accomplish a lot even if peace was still under negotiations.
Areas that were previously inaccessible were reached by government
services and significant development is beginning to be felt in remote
areas.
The Bangsamoro government can do a lot more.
We believe
that more breakthroughs can be achieved with the BBL especially

under a Bangsamoro Region that is structurally superior and better
clothed with authority compared to the Organic Act that created the
ARMM.
As we express this, we also reiterate our full support to the 17
long years of peace negotiations. Now is the time to finally complete
these peace negotiations. We could not afford to wait any longer. We
could not procrastinate on this issue. We could not miss this golden
opportunity to shape a better future for the Bangsamoro people and of
Mindanao.
Thus, we humbly request our legislators to review and
approve the proposed Bangsamoro Basic Law, a law that is undeniably

has the stamp of the Moro aspirations for peace, justice, genuine
autonomy and self-determination.
In the name of justice and peace in Mindanao, please, please
pass the BBL.
Thank you very much.
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Thank you, Mayor Pandi.
[Applause]
Ladies and gentlemen, no applause please. We are not making
speeches. They are testifying before the Committee.
Mayor Pandi, what essentially youre saying is that war is no
good and peace is good. I think only the devil would contradict you on
that.
So we are in agreement.
But just one question. So in your viewit is your position that
the BBL, the draft BBL as transmitted to Congress is the version that
we should pass, no changes.
MR. PANDI. Mr. Chairman, we leave that to the discretion of
the Senate.
But we believe that a strong BBL is the best for our
region.
We all believe the same
thing. But as they say, God is in the details.

Are there no specific proposals that you would like to make,
amendments to propose on the BBL or do you feel that the draft BBL
as it has been submitted to Congress is perfect?
MR. PANDI.
Mr. Chairman, in the last consultations that we
have, as far as the province of Lanao Del Sur, we have submitted our
position paper.
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[Power Interruption]
Ayan. Okay, its back.
Mayor Pandi, can you take us to the salient points of the

suggestions that you would like the Committee to take on, for the
record?
MR. PANDI. Yes. In that position paper that we submitted to
Your Honor, the foremost issue that we presented was about the ARMM
employees.
About the?
MR. PANDI. ARMM employees.

What about the ARMM
employees, Mayor?
MR. PANDI. Since they are going to be abolished and they are
also our constituents, we believe that there is a need to provide some
provisions on where should they go. And in fact, we suggested that
to make it more appealing to themwe should provide a good
separation package for them so that they can opt to retire if they want.
So the option that you
would like to present to our civil servants whose offices will be

abolishedthat they retire, they take on early retirement.
MR. PANDI. Yes, Mr. Chairman.
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So there are 36,000 civil
servants. You propose that all 36,000 take early retirement?

MR. PANDI. That is only for those who would opt to retire or
who will not be absorbed by the new Bangsamoro government.
Okay. So youre saying
that any of the civil servants that will not be absorbed by the new
Bangsamoro government and the bureaucracy will just be given early
retirement.
Okay. What other
proposals do you have for the BBL?

MR. PANDI. The other three concerns are, of course, the three
constitutional bodies; the creation of a separate Commission on
Elections, Commission on Audit and Civil Service.
What do you propose
concerning those constitutional bodies?

MR.
PANDI.
We
just
presented
that
issues
for
some
apprehensions that it might create more problems in our areas if that

is not properly addressed.
Okay. So are there any
other proposals that you have made in your position paper?
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MR. PANDI. No, Mr. Chairman.
We just raised that as an issue
for us to ponder upon.

Okay.
Upon further
discussion, clearly, you do not want us to pass the draft BBL.
You
want us to pass a different version. And that you have raised these
points and that you wish that the Senate and the Committee will
examine those points and make the appropriate amendments to the
draft BBL.
Thank you. Thank you,
Mayor Pandi. We will revisit your position paper and go into the details
of your proposals.
Next to give us a position, from the province of Basilan,
Governor Jum Akbar.
Maam, if you would care to present the position of the province
of Basilan?
MS. AKBAR. Salamat po.
Sa Basilan po ang position namin, kami ay para sa kapayapaan
at kung kayat sumusuporta kami sa panukala ng ating mahal na
Pangulo na tuwid na daan. Matagal na pong suliranin ang kapayapaan
sa Mindanao lalo na sa probinsiya ng Basilan at kami ay naniniwala na
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makakamtam natin ito sa ating pagtutulungan.

Sa tagal ng panahon, marami ng mga ibat- ibang paraan na
ginawa ang ating gobyerno para makamtan ang kapayapaan at ang
landas na tatahakin natin ngayon ay isa lamang sa mga paraan na ito.
Sana po ay bigyan/jbc
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MS. AKBAR. Sana po ay bigyan natin ito ng pagkakataon na

umusbong nang sa ganoon ay masabi natin na ginawa na natin ang
lahat ng ating makakaya para sa ating sarili, sa ating mga kapwa at
hindi lang para sa mga Basileo.
Maraming, maraming salamat po.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you.
I am smiling and I am teasing our friends from the OPAPP
because some of the testimonies that we are hearing now differs
greatly from what we heard when we were in Zamboanga, when we
were in Marawi and when we were in Cotabato.
But nevertheless, the Committee takes on all of the positions
that you have given. Again, what I am hearing is that everybody is for
peace.
Can we agree on that?
VOICES. Yes.
Okay.
So beyond that,
what are we going to do to achieve that peace? Are we now saying

that the draft BBL, as presented to Congress, is what is going to bring
that peace? If you say Yes, then what you were saying is that we
will pass the draft BBL with no amendments and no changes. Because
we are all for peace, nobody wantthere are statistics given here why
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during wartime the development of the economy was very poor. When
the fighting stopped, the development of the economy was very good.
I think that the whole reason why we are undergoing the peace
process is because we understand that.
I think we can agree that
everybody here is trying to find ways to achieve peace. People have

different ideas.
What we need to hear from you are those different
ideas, not that you are for peace. We are all for peace. As I said, only
the devil will contradict you saying that we want peace. I do not feel
that there are any devils here today.
So could we hear more specific proposals vis--vis concerning
the BBL so that it is made more effective at achieving that peace,
being part of the peace process? But if there are no specific proposals,
I can only infer that you feel that the draft BBL, as written, is what we
should pass and we should not make any changes.
MR. CAMLIAN. Yes,
Mr. Senator, you should pass that BBL.
Thats our answer to your question.

THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). No, no. I was asking those
who have already testified.
I was asking the others.
Your position in the Transition
Commission is very clear because you wrote the BBL. I wish you were
in our hearing yesterday because we had many questions on the
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specifics.
That is unfortunate because we didnt send you an
invitation. But never mind, at least you are here today and we can
take that up now.
Gobernadora, are there any specifics that you would like for the
Committee to hear about on how to improve the BBL?
Or is it your
view that the BBL, as it is written, does not need any improvement?
MS. AKBAR.
Mayroon na din po kaming sinumite na position
paper noong last hearing sa Zamboanga.
In fact, medyo malungkot
lang po ang aming mga constituents nang sinabi nila sa TV na we are

against BBL or ayaw namin sa BBL samantala may position po kami
supporting the BBL.
At ang position paper po namin ay halos
mayroon kaming common concern tungkol doon sa mga different

issues.
Kung pwede, for the
record, ipaalam mo sa Committee kung ano iyong mga concern ninyo.

MS. AKBAR.
Katulad po ng mga agencies na nabanggit na
kanina, mga pulis at saka COA, Comelec, Civil Service. Iyon po.
Iyong mga constitutional
bodies.
MS. AKBAR. Yes po.
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THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Tapos may dagdag, iyong

sa pulis.
MS. AKBAR. Yes.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Okay.
MS. AKBAR. Iyon po ang sinasabi naming common at mayroon
din po kaming specific na katulad noong para sa Basilan ay iyong mga
districting na medyo nagkakapalitan po atkaunti lang naman din po.
Ganoon din po ang ibat ibang probinsiya, lalo na sa Basulta na
mayroon din po silang specific.
So iyon po ang gusto naming i-apila na sana po ay mabigyan ng
solusyon.
So mayroon kayong
concern na unconstitutional iyong pag-create ng sariling COA, CSC at

saka Comelec sa Bangsamoro dahil ito ay constitutional bodies?
MS. AKBAR. Yes po.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). So what you are saying is
that essentially, the BBL as it has been written, is unconstitutional?
MS. AKBAR. Well
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Very well. No, never mind.
Ayaw kitang ipitin, I am just trying to clarify that position. But this is
more in accordance with what we heard when we were in Zamboanga.
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MS. AKBAR. Yes po.

THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). That is what I wanted the
Committee to hear, that these concernsdespite our support for peace
and the idea behind BBL that there are concerns, at least from the
governor of Basilan, on the constitutional level.
So, maam, hindi ko kayo gustong ipitin pero gusto ko lang
liwanagin kung ano ba talaga iyong inyong position.
MS. AKBAR. Opo.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Maraming salamat, Gov.
MS. AKBAR. Maraming salamat po.
Now, the next resource
person we will call on is the representative of the City Mayor of

Isabela.
His representative is Atty. Smith General, who is the legal
counsel of the city.

Attorney, are you ready to present?
MR. GENERAL. Yes, Your Honor.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Please go ahead.
MR. GENERAL.
In behalf of the City Mayor of Isabela,
Honorable Cherrylyn Akbar, who is unfortunately on leave, please allow

me to read to you the official position paper prepared by the City
Government of Isabela City, Basilan.
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Time and again, Isabela City is faced with a crucial predicament.

To be or not to be? That is the age-old question that has become a
significant part of the journey of every Isabeleo. To be or not to be
included in the Bangsamoro Government is the question at hand.
Beyond any scintilla of
doubt, the
answer
of Isabela City
is
categorically in the negative.

Please allow me to mention to you the reasons why Isabela City
abhors its inclusion in the so-called Core Territory of the Bangsamoro
Government.
First, most of the Isabeleos are of the belief that the proposed
Bangsamoro Government is another strategy for peace in Mindanao
and the replacement of the would-be abolished Autonomous Region in
Muslim Mindanao or ARMM. As such, our stance on this issue remains
unchanged.
Isabela City said No to ARMM, Isabela City now says
No to Bangsamoro.
Second, majority of the Isabeleos viewed their right to selfdetermination as a cardinal principle that should be observed and
respected at all times. As a people, they have the right to decide on
what their future should be. They have the right to be consulted first
even before the name Isabela City should have been included in the
list of the core territory of the Bangsamoro Government in the
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Bangsamoro Basic Law. To ignore that right would be tantamount to

an unjust imposition. Hence, Isabeleos say No to the inclusion to
the Bangsamoro Government.
Third, the Bangsamoro Basic Law denies the Isabeleos of the
equal protection/mpm
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MR. GENERAL.
equal protection of laws guaranteed by no
less than the Constitution in the sense that while other contiguous local
government units are given the right to join in by resolution or petition
of 10 percent of the registered voters thereof, the Isabeleos are not
so given but are instead listed to be part of the Bangsamoro
government by providing for its inclusion in the core territory.
Fourth, the leading exponents of the Bangsamoro Basic Law are
saying that the Bangsamoro is the replacement of the ARMM. It bears
stressing at the present juncture that Isabela City had in the past
voted against its inclusion in the Autonomous Region in Muslim
Mindanao, not once but twice.
Fifth, the last sentence of Section 7, Article VI of the proposed
Bangsamoro Basic Law provides, and I quote, The privileges already
enjoyed by the local government units, under existing laws, shall not
be diminished unless otherwise altered, modified or reformed for good
governance, in accordance with the law to be enacted by the
Bangsamoro Parliament.
What, if any, is the guarantee that this provision will not be used
by the entity to make unjust and capricious alterations, modifications
or reformations of the said privileges under the pretext of good
governance.
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Sixth, the Isabeleos admire the noble intention proffered for the
making of the Bangsamoro Basic Law which is to end the decades-long
conflict in the Southern Philippines. But is there a guarantee that once
the Bangsamoro government is established, the atrocities wreaked by
other adventurous groups in this part of the country will cease?
We
know for a fact that there are other lawless groups capable of posing
threats to the peace and order in any barangay, municipality or city.
Seventh, from a reading of the draft of the Bangsamoro Basic
Law, it can be readily observed that an opt-in provision is provided for
local government units that are interested to be included in the
Bangsamoro government. But there is no opt-out provision for those
who are already included in the Bangsamoro government but who, for
some valid reasons, would want to get out of the said entity.
The
inevitable conclusion is brought to the fore. Whether the Bangsamoro

government will succeed or fail, those who are already on board
cannot but endure any consequence of being a part thereof.
Isabela City cannot afford to be a flotsam in the sea of political
uncertainty. But the Isabeleos are now at a point where all they can
do is to stand up once again for their beliefs and convictions.
The
Congress of the Philippines may have already drafted the Bangsamoro
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Basic Law in which is included our beloved Isabela City as part of the
Bangsamoros core territory.
But the true Isebeleo spirit will succeed come the plebiscite
day. All we ask from the government is to conduct a free, honest and
peaceful plebiscite where the voice of the Isabeleos will be heard and
respected so that we will not and never again be subjected to a similar
circumstance in the future.
Isabela City supports the peace initiatives of His Excellency,
Benigno Simeon Aquino III, but majority of its people believes that the
passage of the Bangsamoro Basic Law is not the only and the most
effective way to achieving peace in Mindanao.
The Isabeleos have already spoken.
They resoundingly voted
for no to its inclusion in the ARMM in 1989.
They reaffirmed that
stance when they voted for the second time no in the ARMM
plebiscite in 2001. The Isabeleos are one people with one stance and
one voice.
No to the inclusion of Isabela City in the Bangsamoro
government.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you, Atty. General.
That is clear enough.
You are objecting to the inclusion of
Isabela City as one of the areas where plebiscite will be conducted but
nevertheless, you feel that you will campaign to make your true
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feelings known should the plebiscite come about. However, you also
bring up some concerns as to the opt-in, the opt-in provision that
has become quite a contentious and controversial part of the
Bangsamoro Basic Law as it has been presented to us.
So, thank you for that, Atty. General.
Now, we would like to go to the province of Sulu. And we would
like to ask the governor, Governor Abdusakur Tan II, to give the
position of Sulu Province concerning the Bangsamoro Basic Law.
MR. TAN II.
Magandang tanghali po, sir, Your Honor, Mr.
Chairman.
Katulad po nung sinabi kanina ng mga naunang nagsalita sa
amin, maayos naman po ang pamunuan ng ARMM. Mayroon lamang
kaunting problema doon sa mga line agencies na hindi na-devolve o
hindi naayos. Sa aking opinion po, kung i-improve na lang natin iyong
existing na ARMM kaysa gumawa pa tayo ng bagong batas, at iyong
mga pondo na sinasabi na ilalagay dito sa BBL ay ibigay na doon sa
pamunuan ng ARMM, dito sa aming mahal na gobernador, si Governor
Mujiv Hataman. Well, according to him, record shows that iyong mga
proyekto sa kanyang termino ay mas dumami at mas na-implement
nang maayos. So, doon sa mga statements na narinig ko bago po ako
nabigyan ng pagkakataon na magsalita, ay wala akong marinig na
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problema sa existing ARMM maliban doon sa sinasabi na ang ARMM ay

failed experiment according po doon sa palasyo.
Again, Mr. Chairman, kami ay nag-usap-usap, kaming mga
gobernador ng ARMM, limang probinsya.
In fact, mayroon kaming
consolidated position paper na nabuo at iyon ay pirmado ng limang

gobernador. Kami po ay 100 percent na sumusuporta sa programa ng
ating mahal na pangulo, si Presidente Aquino, at kami ay very grateful
sa
kanyang
effort
na
mabigyan
kapayapaan ang aming lalawigan.
ng
tunay
at
pangmatagalang
Pero mayroon kaming mga
pangamba o takot na baka itong effort or batas na papasok dito sa BBL

ay baka kami ang unang maging biktima.
Kami ay namumuno sa
ibat-ibang probinsya na sakop ng ARMM.
Kami ay gobernador na
hinalal, binoto at pinagkatiwalaan ng aming constituents, kasama ng

aming mga mayor na nandidito ngayon. Halos lahat po ng mayor ng
Sulu ay nandito kasama pati ang mga former mayor.
So, Mr. Chairman, hindi po kami tutol sa BBL. Kami po ay 100
percent susuporta although there were certain provisions na aming
pinangangambahan. Iyong probisyon na iyon ay babasahin ng aking
bise gobernador, siya na ang susunod na magsasalita.
So, kung
mayroon po kayong mga katanungan, siguro bigyan lang natin siya ng
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konting oras para masabi ang mga probisyon na iyon at siya na rin ang
sasagot ng mga katanungan ng ating mahal na chairman.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Very well. Since you have
designated your vice governor to answer the questions.
Vice Gov, ikaw yata ang on the hot seat.
MR. TAN II. Mr. Chairman, babasahin po muna niya iyong ano.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Kayo ang nilagay ng inyong
gobernador sa hot seat so kayo na, Vice, ang susunod na. . . (nam)
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ang susunod na
magsalita. Vice Governor Abdusakur Tan.

MR. TAN II. Maraming salamat po.
MR. TAN.
Maraming salamat, sir.
Thank you very much for
inviting us to this Senate hearing, Senator Marcos.
At maraming
salamat din na pumunta kayo sa Sulu, ganoon din ang Committee ni

Congressman Rufus Rodriguez.
I would think that these were the only hearings that were
initiated by offices in Manila. The other consultations, if we may call
them, I remember there were two in the province: one was we call it
the regional consultation after the passage or after the approval of that
framework agreement where at least four governors were present
including Chairman Misuari, we invited him as a guest of honor or an
observing guest of honor. We invited the MILF leadership. We invited
OPAPP.
But I would think only the leadership of the MNLF came.
Although he was not afforded the opportunity to speak, he was only

there to observe.
And anotherthat was I think in December of
2013we wanted a consultation.
When I was invited by OPAPP to
comment or to get my nod on the Bangsamoro water to be carved out

of the Sulu Sea, and I told the OPAPP that I could not decide as far as
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the Sulu Sea is concerned.
I mean, renaming a portion of the Sulu
Sea to be called as the Bangsamoro water. So I instead invited them

to come. But since it was December, they could not make it. But I
told them that there are TausugsTausugs are knowledgeable and
very conversant about the peace process. One of them is my brother,
Usec Nabil Tan, another is Usec Jo Lorena, another was chairman of
the
NCMF,
Mehol
Sadain,
Commissioner
Baddiri,
Congressman
Tammang. So, they all came on the 28th of December. And I dont
remember the national offices have initiated consultations with the
Tausugs. These are the Tausugs. The Tausugs, I would think that we
are the biggest Muslim population in the entire country because the
Tausugs are in Sulu.
They are in Basilan.
They are in Tawi-Tawi.
They are in the whole of Zamboanga Peninsula. They are everywhere.

They are in Manila.
GenSan.
They are in Palawan.
They are in Davao, in
So it is only--also disgusting to note that we feel we have
been sidelined.
And they concentrated on negotiating with a certain
sector of the Muslim population. What percentage do they constitute

of the Muslim population, I mean, Filipino nation? And they said they
represent the Muslims in the entire country. Could there be any more
representative?
We
feel
that
the
elected
officials
are
more
representative than those who are not or those who only claim to be
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representative of the people because we have a mandate, the local

officials.
And we should know the ground situation as commanders
who are always engaged with the people. But we do not get that much
consultation. In fact, we have told people in the panel that we do not
want only consultation.
We want participation because this is about
our future. And we should know better our own people.
I have been
in Sulu since birth. That was 65 years ago. But up to now Im still
studying the culture of our people.
But even then, we are still very, very grateful to His Excellency
President Aquino for his desire to bring real peace to the Muslims in
the Philippines. We are very, very grateful for that. We support the
BBL. But there are certain provisions that we would like to be deleted.
Because even if we pass this, we feelaccording to our lawyers, this
might be stricken down by the Supreme Court. There are people who
may go up to the Supreme Court to question the constitutionality of so
many provisions of the BBL such as the constitutional bodies; the
constitutional bodies which powers and functions can only be given by
the Constitution. So we cannot alter this. Other than this, of course,
the constitutional bodies, we have a national police commission; police,
national in character.
These are offices. We are not questioning the
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competence of those who would sit there in the Autonomous Region.

But this is susceptible to abuse. We do not want this to be abused.
And another, of course, the matter of authorities vested in the
LGUs. It says that powers and functions of the local government units
shall not be diminished unless otherwise altered or modified by the
parliament for good governance.
Of course, you can always sayI
mean, we modify this in the guise of good governance. So we do not

want to become the first victims. We ask for the passage of this and
then we fall victim to it. So kami naman, Mr. Chairman, ay matagal na
rin kami sa pulitika. Alam na rin namin kung ano ang gusto. We have
all the experiences.
Other than this, there is a provision in the BBL that the BTA
would sit in transition before any election is called. So even during the
transitionyou know, powers of the LGUs could be clipped.
And, of
course, the constitutional offices that we have mentioned earlier, like

the Commission on Elections, the Comelec. Elections are forthcoming
in 2016. So we have also to protect ourselves. We have to be truthful
about this. We cannot just say, Okay, we pass this, we pass that.
We have to be very truthful that is why we are here. We do not want
to waste this opportunity, we want to tell you. In fact, if you ask us
you ask me personally, I do not want to be called a Moro. You know,
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in the past, when you are called a Moro, they refer to you as a pirate.
Pakukuha kita sa Moro. Pa-hold-up kita sa Moro. Moro-moro na.
And then now parang gusto na nating lahat Moro.
This is a term
coined by the Spaniards and institutionalized by the Americans. So I

would rather/alicc
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MR. TAN.
So, I would rather that we be called Pilipino-
Muslims or, if not, call us Tausugs. We are the Tausugs, Your Honor.
So, iyan ang mga ano namin. Other than this, ang hinihingi namin ay
sana may katapusan ito kasi we already negotiated with the MNLF.
After the MNLF, a breakaway group, the MILF came up, we are again
negotiating.
There is another breakaway group, the BIFF.
going to negotiate again?
Are we
Would there be no, I mean, end to these
negotiations? Kasi ang tingin namin kahit ngayon, we are surviving on

IRA. We are subsidized by the national government, but we want to
become autonomous.
Frankly, Mr. Chairman, we can never be autonomous for as long
as we are reliant economically or financially on other entities. We will
always be under the mercy of those who are making us survive.
And I remember one time I was invited toof course, there was
one time when I was invited when I was still a governor, to Malaysia.
And they started talking about taxation, all forms of taxations.
commented, and I said, Why do you speak about taxation when you
have nobody to tax, why dont we first create an environment that
would invite investors, create industries, create people, billionaires and
millionaires so that you have people to tax.
So, iyon sana, Mr.
Chairman, ang ina-ano namin.
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Now, dito sa ARMM, nagpapasalamat kami kay President Aquino

napakalaki, ang laki-laki ng ibinibigay sa amin na pondo sa ARMM. In
fact, I would think that we are the only region that has been given
iyong TISP, more than eight billion yata.
regions, for the five provinces.
This is not given to other
This is over and above, I think, the
regular funds that ARMM is getting. So, tingin naman namin, it is the
national government that can help us.
And I think it is incumbent
upon the national government to provide us with the support

infrastructures so that our economy could improve. So, iyon sana ang
gusto namin.
Maraming salamat, Mr. Chairman.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you very much, Vice
Governor Tan.
Maliwanag na sinasabi mo that you feel somehow na inaalala
ninyo
na
baka
hindi
kayo
properly
represented
pagdating
ng
Bangsamoro government.
Pangalawa, na may mga probisyon na sinasabi na iyong mga
karapatan at privilege ng ating mga local government units na
idinudulot sa ating local government units ng RA 7160, Local
Government Code ay baka mawala dahil nga sa probisyon na
puwedeng palitan ng Bangsamoro Parliament. That is something that
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has already been brought up.
And that ang pakiramdam ninyo ay
galing sa national government ang malaking tulong.

At lumabas din sa inyong pagsalita ay tungkol nga sa suggestion
na imbes gumawa ng bagong autonomous region ay ayusin na lang
kung anuman ang na-identify na problema sa ARMM.
Ito ay isang
punto na dahan-dahan ay naririnig natin sa ibat-ibang panig. At isa

doon ay ang bagong dating na isang Senador natin, Senador Ralph
Recto who has actually been espousing that in our private discussions.
Welcome, Senator Recto.
Thank you, Vice Governor Tan.
Moving down the list, we would like to call on Mayor and former
Congressman Hussin Amin of Jolo, Sulu to add his own comments on
the Bangsamoro Basic Law. Mayor Amin, please.
MR. AMIN. Bismillaahir Rahmaanir Raheem. Honorable Senator
Ferdinand Bongbong R. Marcos, Jr., Senator Ralph Recto, Senator JV
Ejercito, ladies and gentlemen, assalamualaikum rahmatullahi wa
barakatuh and good afternoon.
Mr. Chairman, thank you very much for inviting me here today to
share my thoughts on the Bangsamoro.
I would like also to inform you that with due respect to Mayor
Lampa Pandi, the majority of the mayors from Sulu were not invited
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when he consulted the mayors.
And so we were not part of that
position paper, with due respect, Mayor Pandi.

First and foremost, let me clarify that I am not against the BBL.
I am for peace, not only for peace, but for lasting peace. And, in fact,
all my life I have been working for peace and development in our
province, in our municipality and even for the whole country.
As a public servant, I have the privilege and honor of serving in
the three branches of the government. In the executive department,
as a former prosecutor; in the judiciary, as a former Regional Trial
Court
judge;
in
the
legislative
department,
as
three-termer
congressman representing the 1st District of Sulu; and now back in the
executive department in my last term as mayor.
In all these
capacities, I worked for peace and development.

I recall that when I was congressman serving as Chairman of the
Committee on Muslim Affairs and later, as Chairman of the Special
Committee on Peace, Unity and Reconciliation, we also conducted
consultations with different sectors to forge unity and peace among our
people.
I agree that the passing of the BBL is a step toward achieving
peace. However, I also acknowledge that this very document may also
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be the source of conflict in the future if the same will have provisions
that will frustrate and add confusion in the implementation of the law.
And for this reason, we need to clarify certain provisions, delete
if necessary so that the BBL as an organic law of the Bangsamoro
Region will undoubtedly be a document that is workable, realistic and
above all, consistent with the Philippine Constitution.
It is in this context, in addition to the points already raised and
articulated
by
recommendations,
other
resource
persons,
propose
some
that I believe will help clarify and simplify some
matters.
Number one, on the Bangsamoro Justice Systems.
Article X,
noticeably, there is no reference to the Supreme Court of the

Philippines, as the holder of judicial power, except, as one which
administers the Shariah Bar Examination, the appointment of court
personnel and the power to discipline them. But the 1987 Constitution
is very clear that when it comes to the judicial power which is vested
in one Supreme Court...
Section 1, Article VIII of the 1987 Constitution provides that the
judicial power shall be vested in one Supreme Court and in such lower
courts as may be established by lawcpc
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MR. AMIN. ...as may be established by law.

Moreover, Section 6 of Article VIII provides that, The Supreme
Court shall have administrative supervision over all courts and the
personnel thereof.
My recommendation, I propose to insert a provision that clarifies
that Sharia system is under the control and supervision of the
Supreme Court. It must be clear that judicial power is still vested with
the Supreme Court.
By inserting such provision, we are preventing
any more debate as to the jurisdiction of the Sharia and the power of
the Supreme Court over such courts, including their personnel.
Also, I would like to recommend to revisit Presidential Decree
1083 or the Decree to ordain and promulgate a code recognizing the
system of the Filipino Muslim laws codifying Muslim personal laws and
providing for its administration and for other purposes.
This law, Mr. Chairman, is one of the legacies of your father and
namesake, the late President Ferdinand Edralin Marcos, a legacy that
we Muslims are grateful.
I had the privilege of working with the Code Commission at the
time as a young lawyer and researcher under my then boss, Atty.
Michael Mastura, one of the MILF panel, and chaired by Dean Mahul of
UP. In this law, Mr. Chairman, the Sharia system is first instituted and
enshrined. It may be good to look at this law and, if necessary, amend
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it and conform with the present time.
As they say, the law must
march with the cadence of the time.

Number two, Mr. Chairman, the Sharia Judicial and Bar Council
must also be clarified.
Court.
There is also no reference to the Supreme
Under the 1987 Constitution, the Judicial and Bar Council is
under the supervision of the Supreme Court.

Section 8, Article VIII of the 1987 Constitution states that: A
Judicial and Bar Council is hereby created under the supervision of the
Supreme Court composed of the chief justice as the ex officio
chairman, the secretary of Justice, and a representative of Congress as
ex officio members, a representative of the Integrated Bar, a professor
of law, a retired member of the Supreme Court, and a representative
of the private sector.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Mayor Amin, your position
paper, you have read into the record when we visited with you in Jolo.
So just for the information of those others who were not with us at
that hearing and in the interest of brevity, dahil marami pang
magsasalita, so
if
you could
give
the
Committee
the
specific
recommendations and, again, the arguments that you made, the very
important arguments that you made are already on record.
MR. AMIN. Yes. Mr. Chairman, I did not discuss on the judicial
system when you had a consultation with us in Jolo. Because I believe
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some of us did not study well about the judicial system because, you
know
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Ang problema lang, Mayor,
is that at the rate we are going, the others will not be able to speak
because it is already 12:30, at kahit papaano kailangan itigil ang
hearing ng alas tres dahil magse-session na kami.
So para naman
mapagbigyan natin lahat na makapagsalita.

MR. AMIN. Okay, Mr. Chairman. On one point only.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Go ahead.
MR. AMIN. Anyway, I will submit this. But I want to discuss on
the LGUs which was also discussed by our beloved vice governor.
On the LGUs. Section 7 of Article VI of the BBL provides that:
The authority to regulate on its own responsibility the affairs of the
local government units is guaranteed within the limits of this Basic
Law.
The privileges already enjoyed by the local government units
under existing laws shall not be diminished unless otherwise altered,

modified or reformed for good governance in accordance with a law to
be enacted by the Bangsamoro Parliament.
Mr. Chairman, at first glance, the provision seems not worrisome
at all. But if we look closely, the phrase within the limits of this Basic
Law, is a cause for alarm for the LGUs. This is because we are trying
to restrict the responsibilities of the LGUs only within the bounds of the
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basic law when, in fact, our LGUs have responsibilities mandated under
the Local Government Code and other existing laws.
So I find the
phrase rather restrictive and therefore diminishes the functions of the

LGUs.
To move further, while it is provided that LGUs still enjoy its
privileges under the existing laws, this provision is qualified by the
phrase unless otherwise altered, modified or reformed by the
Bangsamoro Parliament.
Again, this phrase is dangerous as it may
cause discord and problem in the future. Because of this phrase, no

one can stop any member of the Bangsamoro Parliament to move for
the diminution of the privileges and functions of the LGUs.
Recommendation,
therefore,
to
delete
the
phrase
unless
otherwise altered, modified or reformed for good governance in

accordance with law to be enacted by the Bangsamoro Parliament and
the earlier phrase within the limits of this Basic Law. These phrases,
in the context of the LGUs, will just open the floodgates of conflict and
more debates in the future.
But, anyway, I will submit this position paper of mine for the
consideration of the Committee on Local Government.
Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you, Mayor.
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I am going through your new position paper. To summarize, you

propose to insert a provision that clarifies that the Sharia system is
under the control and supervision of the Supreme Court.
The second point that you made is that you propose to delete the
provision on the Sharia Judicial and Bar Council. It is your belief that
Judicial and Bar Council under the 1987 Constitution is sufficient.
And the point that you made about Section 7, Article VI of the
BBL wherein the Bangsamoro Parliament is given the authority and the
power to amend a law that has been passed by the Congress.
And
your recommendation is that we delete the phrase, unless otherwise

altered, modified or reformed for good governance in accordance with
law to be enacted by the Bangsamoro Parliament.
That is a
suggestion that has come up before because the Bangsamoro

Parliament is proposing that they will amend a law that has been
passed by Congress.
The other points that you made are to do with the redistricting.
And you have suggestions to maintain to the status quo as far as
redistricting is concerned. And you even suggest further that we just
follow congressional redistricting.
The six point that you made is that you proposed that the
Bangsamoro Parliament be composed of district parliamentarians and
party-list or sectoral representatives, and that the party-list or sectoral
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representatives shall be 20 percent of the total membership of

parliament similar to the House of Representatives.
The seventh point that you made is that you want the BTA to
have more time to do their work... /jmb
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to do their work and your
specific proposal is that we give the BTA until 2019 to reorganize the
bureaucracy and prepare the Bangsamoro for regular elections.
One more comment that you have on the BTA that with the
specific mention of the MILF to lead the BTA, it may be considered
class legislation. You, therefore, proposed to delete that provision and
simply make it an agreement between the government panel, the MILF
that the BTA will be MILF-led.
And the final point that you made has to do with taxation. That
it is a point of law that if the ARMM is to be abolished, then the BBL
cannot make reference to the old laws relating to or pertaining to the
ARMM. So you proposed to delete that provision that make reference
to laws that the BBL is in fact intending to abolish.
So that is the summary of the position paper.
Thank you very much, Mayor Amin.
We now move to our next resource person.
From the province of Tawi-Tawi, we call on Governor Nurbert
Sahali to give the province of Tawi-Tawis position.
MR. SAHALI.
Before you start, I would
like to acknowledge for the record the arrival of Senator Sonny Angara.
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Sorry to interrupt, Gov. Please go ahead.

MR. SAHALI.
Thank you.
Assalamu alaikum wa rahmatullahita Allah wa barakatuh.

First of all, I would like to thank the two Committees
Committee on Local Government and Committee on Peace, Unification
and Reconciliationfor inviting me along with the other governors of
the ARMM provinces to the joint public hearing to participate in the
deliberation of the proposed Bangsamoro Basic Law.
I also would like to express my deep appreciation to the
Committee members for their efforts and goodwill involving all
stakeholders for them to generate valuable insights and inputs if only
to be able to craft a more constitutional, fair and acceptable piece of
the legislation.
I am with the chief executives of the provinces of Sulu, Basilan,
Lanao del Sur and Maguindanao in assuring the Committees of our
commitment towards peace in Mindanao.
The peace process is the
only sensible, viable and responsible option when trying to find the
best solution to the age-old Bangsamoro problem.
Now, let me reiterate that I strongly support the peace process
and that I am for a BBL that the Philippine Congress will pass, such a
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law is surely constitutional, well-balanced and within our capabilities to

pursue and implement.
Hereunder, I wish to enumerate for the record and the
Committees my position with respect to the proposed law. I speak in
behalf of the peace-loving people of Tawi-Tawi, my beloved TawiTawians.
First, that which is best for us, Tawi-Tawians is what guides us
and inspires us to support. If we perceive or are convinced that the
BBL, that Congress will pass is good for us, then we shall accept it and
endorse it for ratification. The BBL will be good for Tawi-Tawians if it is
meant to promote and sustain peace, unity and progress in Tawi-Tawi.
We desire for a BBL that will surely usher in for us. Tawi-Tawians a
climate of positive change, example: poverty alleviation; more socioeconomic and infrastructure development programs and projects;
more
employment
extensive
support
and
for
livelihood
increased
opportunities
productivity
in
for
our
people;
agriculture
and
fisheries; protection and preservation of the environment; better

dispensation of justice, bringing an end to criminality; improved trade
and commerce, security knowing that Tawi-Tawi is a multicultural,
vibrant and dynamic society.
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Second, Tawi-Tawians still and always remain Filipinos. We want

Tawi-Tawi to remain an integral part of the Republic of the Philippines.
To this end, we ask for a BBL that is consistent with the
Philippine Constitution.
Third, I affirm my previous position, along with the other ARMM
provincial governors in not wanting for the Bangsamoro entity to have
its own electoral, audit, civil service, human rights and police force
bodies.
Fourth, we do not wish for a BBL that poses a threat or is a bane
to our legal identities, political structures and rights and privileges as
local
government
units,
and
which
the
Constitution
and
Local
Government Code have already provided for.

Fifth, I wish for the BBL that gives due regard to a lot, rights and
genuine desires of the other major stakeholders particularly the Moro
National Liberation Front and our indigenous people and the Sultanate
of Sulu.
Finally, Mr. Chairman, I also would like to echo your statement
and that of Senator Miriam Defensor Santiago with regard to the BBL.
I agree when you said that it has to be inclusive, consultative and
comprehensive.
We are asking you to be deliberate considering the
unconstitutionality of many of its sections and provisions. For what we
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are doing and undergoing today will be our legacy to the future
generations of Mindanao, and we all want a better and brighter future
for our land of promise.
Let me end by extending our sincerest gratitude to our dear
President, our congressmen and congresswomen, our senators in
upholding our welfare, the Bangsamoro People, for the strong
determination in bringing lasting peace in our land. That may this BBL
mirror the sentiments, aspirations, ambitions and identity of the
Bangsamoro people.
Thank you, Gov. Sahali.
We are, I think, beginning to hear a consensus amongst the

ARMM governors that there is some concern as to the constitutionality
of the draft BBL as it has been presented.
Furthermore, there are
some other specific concerns to do with the powers of the local

government and essentially the dominance that is written into the law
of the MILF in the entire process that we are proposing.
So thank you, Governor.
We move now tofrom the province of Maguindanao, Governor
Ismael Mangudadatu.
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Gov, if you would like to give the position of the province of

Maguindanao on the BBL.
Thank you, Gov.
MR. MANGUDADATU.
Thank you so much, Mr. Chairman.
Magandang hapon po sa inyong lahat.

Gusto ko lang pong anuhin iyong kaninang sinabi niyo, Mr.
Chairman, iyong tungkol doon sa walang konsultasyon. Alam niyo po
doon sa amin we did a lot of consultations. In fact, there were some
members of the BTAs/cmn
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MR. MANGUDADATU. members of the BTAs, the MILFs, and

other
NGOs
consultations.
and
INGOs
in
our
province
na
nag-conduct
ng
So noong pasimula pa lang po iyong FAB, iyong
Framework Agreement on the Bangsamoro, nakita po namin the influx

of the investors in our province. Napansin din namin iyong sinabi ni
Gov. Mujiv kanina na the investments in the ARMM has a mark of
tumaas. Now, karamihan po doon ay nasa Maguindano. Pasimula pa
lamang po iyon noong mayroong sinasabing kapayapaan.
Now sana po tingnan ninyong maayos, tignan nating maayos
kung ano iyong makakabuti para po sa Bangsamoro. And I hope that
the good senators will take a look on the draft BBL para po magkaroon
na po ng tuluy-tuloy na kapayapaan.
Maraming salamat po.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you, Gov.
Mayroon ba kayong specific na proposal para doon sa BBL sa
palagay ninyo na kulang, na kailangang dagdagan, mga amendment
na proposal sa draft BBL na ibinigay sa Kongreso?
MR. MANGUDADATU.
Mayroon po kaming position letter na
nai-submit na rin. Five governors.

Ah, iyong joint.
Sinasabi
mo iyong
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MR. MANGUDADATU. Yes po.

Oo.
There is a joint
position paper that was given to the Committee, but that was not in a
hearing. I think it was in a meeting outside of the hearing process.
So, anyway, we will include that position that you have given us
in the discussions of the BBL that will follow.
MR. MANGUDADATU. Yes. Thank you very much.
MR. TAN. Mr. Chairman.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Yes, Vice Governor Tan.
MR. TAN.
position paper.
improved.
If I may be given the opportunity to submit my

This is an improved one.
A modified one and
We submitted earlier a position paper as well as the
position paper that was already a joint position paper of the five
governors.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you very much, Vice
Governor. The Committee Secretary will collect that from you.
MR. TAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Now, from Lanao del Sur,
we have to speak the position of the Province of Lanao del Sur,
Governor Mamintal Adiong.
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MR. HATAMAN.
Chairman, actually bumulong si Gov. Bombit
kanina mayroon atang emergency sa...

THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). I am sorry to hear that.
All right.
We have the SB Member Belotendos from the
Municipality of Wao, and Edna Espinosa, League of Wao.
They have
submitted their position paper.

Which of you would like to read to us? Please do not read the
entire position paper, just the salient points that you have. I think it is
specific to the Municipality of Wao, essentially giving your position
about your inclusion.
So who will present it to the Committee? Engineer?
MR. BELOTENDOS. Thank you.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Please go ahead.
MR. BELOTENDOS. Good afternoon to everyone.
Honorable Chair, I would like to present the salient features of
our documents submitted to the House of Representatives and the
House of the Senate.
The NGO manifesto to be discussed by our
representative from NGO.

We have already our ABC resolution and SB resolution asking or
pleading that we should be excluded from the Bangsamoro entity.
would like to express some salient features as part of the resettlement
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area that is one of our premises; and then, second, I would like to
point out that Wao is an awardee of Galing Pook in 2010 for its two
environmental
programs
and
recipient
of
the
Seal
of
Good
Housekeeping in 2011, 2012, and 2013. I would like to point out that
this is a document proving that ARMM is not a failure but a success in
our case, especially for Wao.
And with the introduction of the new
Bangsamoro entity, we are apprehensive that it might shaken the

peace and development in our town, the unity amongst diverse ethnics
present in Wao which are sustained for more than five decades now.
Im referring to what has been mentioned by the previous speakers
with regards to these apprehensions.
And then the Municipality of Wao supports the aspiration of our
President, His Excellency, Benigno Simeon C. Aquino III, our Muslim
brothers, and all Filipinos to attain a lasting peace in Mindanao, but the
Bangsamoro entity is not a solution for a lasting peace in Wao. This
entity is good for Muslim communities to let them practice the
governance fitted for their religion and culture. But Wao is a Christiandominated community comprising 83 percent of its population,
Christian.
Thus, we want to govern ourselves same as the present
administration.
What I mean is, we wanted to remain in ARMM.
If
there will be flaws or what we call failures in ARMM, maybe we could
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look into so that we could enhance the Autonomous Region in Muslim

Mindanao.
Our prayers, Honorable Chair, Your Honor, and to all members of
the honorable Committee, this is our prayer, that Wao should be
directly asked in the plebiscite favoring or not to join in the
Bangsamoro entity by counting the results of the plebiscite by
municipal level and not by provincial level before becoming part of the
geographical area or core territory of the Province of Lanao del Sur in
the proposed BBL.
We vehemently suggest that Article XV, Section
3(a) of the Senate Bill 2408 or House Bill No. 4994 as stated, For the
present geographic area of the ARMM: if the majority of the registered
voters in each province, we will include the municipality and then
city vote in favor of the Bangsamoro Basic Law, the respective
provinces,
municipalities
and
cities
shall
be
included
in
the
Bangsamoro.
We find the manner of the plebiscite in the ARMM oppressive.
Why? The plebiscite results in Wao in 1989 and 2001 were based on
the majority votes within the Province of Lanao del Sur, defeating our
No to be excluded in the ARMM.
If Article XV, Sections 3(b) and 3(c), as what had been
mentioned by the earlier speaker, it is unfair. Is it not fair and lawful
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also to give freedom to municipalities like Wao and even barangays the
chance to be excluded from the proposed Bangsamoro entity wherein
for inclusion for Bangsamoro entity we considered municipalities and
barangays?
If we want this proposed plebiscite be reflective of the
genuine heartthrob of the people especially for Wao, then let our
prayers be heard.
We rest our case in your hands and await the most just and
humane result of our prayer and appeal by the grace of the Almighty.
For the majority people of Wao, Im speaking in behalf of our
Municipal Mayor, Elvino B. Balicao, Jr.
I think it is very clear that it is your contention, as it has been

with other LGUs, that if you had already voted no into joining ARMM,
why should you be included now in the plebiscite for the inclusion into
the Bangsamoro.
You proposed that whatever failings that the ARMM has/cbg
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You proposed that
whatever failings that the ARMM has, that we remedy those failings.
But failing that, you would prefer not to be included in the proposed
Bangsamoro territory.
MR. BELOTENDOS. Yes.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you for that. Well
move now to the LGUs outside of ARMM.
MR. HATAMAN. Mr. Chair, before the LGUs
MR. HATAMAN.
Sorry. Gov Mujiv.
Just a quick manifestation, Mr. Chair, before
the governors and LGUs outside of ARMM.

MR. HATAMAN.
Yes, Governor.
I heard the statement of the councilor from
Wao. His recommendation, I do respect it, that the best way to attack
this problem is just to enhance ARMM. But I would like to state it for
the record, by our personal experience, Your Honor, that the best way
to address the failure of ARMM is to pass the Bangsamoro Basic Law.
Thank you, Gov
Hataman. Yes, your position is noted.

We will move on to the Zamboanga Peninsula. We will start with
Zamboanga
del
Norte.
Governor
Roberto
Uy
will
give
us
the
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presentation for the province of Zamboanga del Norte.

Is the governor ready to? He is not here?
I have here also the list to make a presentation, the city mayor
of Dapitan City, City Mayor Rosalina Jalosjos.
Also not here?
Dito
nakalagay present. Never mind, we will keep moving down the list.
Now, we move on to Zamboanga del Sur and we call on
Governor Tony Cerilles to give the position of Zamboaga del Sur, to be
followed by City Mayor Climaco of Zamboanga City.
So Governor Tony Cerilles, please.
MR. CERILLES. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
First of all, let me thank the Committee for inviting me and the
rest of the local officials outside ARMM in this consultation/public
hearing.
Im surprised with the answer of some LGUs inside ARMM.
think in this hall, I am one of the few guys who were able to serve the
autonomous government under P.D. 1618 during the time of President
Marcos. And I heard the same complaint as aired by Mujiv Hataman,
our regional governor, asking for more autonomy, more power. That
was also the clamor during the time of President Marcos when
autonomous government Region IX and XII were asking the same
power.
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Thats why I want to dwell on constitutionalities because I

understand the committee of Senator Miriam Defensor has come out
with so many constitutional infirmities.
Let me go to the practical side. Governor Hataman said there is
no real devolution in ARMM.
I would say, also outside ARMM.
As a
matter of fact, I was one of those who debated in the House on the
devolution of health and agriculture. Up to now, the money is not with
us; it is with the national government.
As a matter of fact, our hospital is fully supported by our IRA, I
think that is also true with the province of Ilocos Norte and some other
provinces.
I would say so many highly urbanized cities are luckier
than us because they are the host of medical centers and regional
hospitals who is actually financed by the national government.
We were discussing in Congress then about devolution of
agriculture because our farmers are the poorest among the poor
among the sectors. Thats why it was decided by Congress to devolve
agriculture to the local government unit. But if you look at the graph
of the budget of the Department of Agriculture since the time of
devolution, youll see the budget of Agriculture going up instead of the
money going to the local government, so in health and other devolved
agencies.
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Im happy that Governor Hataman said despite the fact he is

being close to the President, despite he is being sitting in the Cabinet,
he is complaining about money.
And Im happy also with the
statement of my colleague from old CongressVice Governor Tan and

the son of my friend, Governor Sahali and my old friend Mayor Amin
about the real position of the people of Mindanao. Of course, we need
all this development. We need the support of national government.
Who does not want peace? Everybody wants peace. But thats
correctly intimated by Vice Governor Tan.
Why is it government
talking only to a few people who do not represent the real interest of
the people of Mindanao? Huwag na nating itago ito.
Why are we talking to the MILF?
Why only the MILF? What
worries me is that in this proposed version of the House, the transitory

authority has so many powers. They can even enact laws that would
govern the election of ARMM, the Bangsamoro. And in thoseyou look
inside the proposal,
all those elected officials can be replaced by
people who are not elected. And we create another problem.

Are we trying to say to the people of the ARMM that these people
who were elected by you do not deserve to stay there and they ought
to be replaced by people who represent the MILF?
Can we achieve
peace with that?
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I am Mindanaoan, Mr. Chairman, thats why I see the sacrifices

of your mother, former First Lady, when she went to Tripoli, Libya with
Undersecretary Barbero.
But that is temptation of all government, to
talk with people who want to help.

My question is: The people are we talking, are they real people
who want to help? You dont even know their name, you dont even
know whether they are Filipinos.
Thats the question.
This is too
embarrassing. We talked in an international forum and yet the people

were talking and trying to solve our problem are not even from the
Philippines.
Thats why, Mr. Chairman, if this government honestly believes
that this is a solution, why dont we go on a national debate? Let the
people who believe in this submit themselves. Not only the people of
the five provinces but the entire Philippines because it is the money of
Juan Dela Cruz that would be given eventually.
Not the money of
ARMM or the MILF or Malaysia, but the money of Juan Dela Cruz.
If people honestly believe that this is good for them, this is good
for us, then they should stand and make a national debate from
Batanes down to Tawi-Tawi. They want to become president based on
this issue, so be it. They want to be senators based on this issue, so be
it.
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Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman, for inviting me on this. I

would like to talk more on these issues but I have here with me a copy
of the committee report.
And we need a long discussion of this
because we will be talking of three documents, not only this

Bangsamoro. We have to talk about the so-called the
agreement,
framework
of which the representative of Juan Dela Cruz agreed
verbatim to submit; and the comprehensive agreement/jbc
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MR. CERILLES. to submit any comprehensive agreement with

the
Bangsamoro
which,
again,
our
representative,
representative, accepted everything without consultation.
Filipino
And even
they have the temerity to submit to the Filipino people, that we dont
want to accept any changes in what they proposed.
This is not democratic. This is not the essence of democracy, Mr.
Chairman.
Thats why I am happy that the Chairman of Local Government
of the Senate has called for this consultation hearing. I am for peace
but I dont want any hidden agenda. I join my friends from the ARMM,
the governor and the vice governor in objecting to this proposed
Bangsamoro Framework Agreement.
Thank you, Governor
Cerilles, for that heartfelt commentary.

Again, you expressed misgivings in the process that was
undergone that created the framework agreement, the comprehensive
agreement and finally the draft Bangsamoro because you feel that the
only
representatives
that
were
part
of
the
negotiations
were
representatives of the MILF and not any other group in Muslim

Mindanao and that the MILF representative was not authorized or
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recognized
by
any
of
the
local
government
units
as
their
representative.
Secondly, you touched to the point that we need a great deal of
discussion about this and that we should not hurry, again, another
point that has been raised and that we have realized. In fact, it was
actually the Transitional Commission that first proposed in our hearing,
I believed it was in Marawi, that they be given three years to do their
job.
One of the elements that we are trying to understand is why
there are deadlines that are being put to all of this process. As I said
before, we have waited many, many years, decades, even you could
say hundreds of years and perhaps another month or two would not be
too much to wait for.
And the point of whether or not the BBL is a law of national or
local application is also something that has been discussed and the
argument
has
been
made
by
those
outside
of
the
proposed
Bangsamoro core territory that they also be included in the plebiscite

because the Bangsamoro Basic Law and the organization of the
Bangsamoro government will have an effect on the welfare of their
own communities.
resolve.
And that is another area that we have yet to
Although the proposal, of course, is a localized plebiscite, I
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think there are many from around the country who would like to have
their voices heard as well.
Yes, Governor Cerilles.
MR. CERILLES. It has to be in a national debate, Mr. Chairman,
because of the presence of the Tripoli Agreement of which it is not only
the five provinces but also the original provinces mentioned in the
Tripoli Agreement which likely includes my province, Zamboanga Del
Sur, province of Palawan up to Davao Sur.
So if this will not be a national debate, then our voices will not be
heard.
And you look at the proposed committee report of Rufus
Rodriguez, the transition authorities are very powerful.
It can enact
election code which will govern plebiscite and the entry of new
provinces. Thats why we should be included in a debate because that
would affect my province, Zamboanga City and the other provinces, to
include Palawan.
Thats why I hope this Committee, Mr. Chairman, would look at
the possibility of other ancient provinces to be included in the so-called
Bangsamoro, if the Senate or Malacaang will insist.
Thank you, Governor
Cerilles.
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Yes. Certainly, the debate, the discussion has widen in its scope
and that is why the increasing consciousness of the other provinces,
not only elected officials but ordinary citizens in this proposed measure
is very much welcome. That is why we are having these consultations
because it is a chance that we give to our local government officials to
say their piece so that their thoughts are included because apparently,
again, their representation isthey find lacking in the process that we
have undergone so far.
So thank you, Governor Cerilles.
Now, we call on the City Mayor of the City of Zamboanga, Mayor
Maria Isabelle Climaco.
MS. CLIMACO.
Buenas tardes a todos, Honorable Chair and
distinguished resource persons, paz de dios y abraza de la virgen del

Pilar.
I am with councilor Roel Natividad.
And I would like to
respectfully ask Councilor Rommel Agan to join us.

On behalf of the City of Zamboanga, we are very thankful to you,
Honorable Chair, for giving us the opportunity because of recent
developments after the May 14 visit in the City of Zamboanga.
First of all, we would like to state that we support the peace
initiatives, particularly of President Aquino.
However, we call for a
comprehensive and inclusive peace pact that would include the
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different diverse voices of Mindanao. As you all know, we are still in

the rehabilitative process and I would like to thank our brothers and
sisters in the ARMM for coming to our aid, as well as the region.
However, we are both saddened and appalled by the draft
amended version of the House Bill 4994 as seemingly approved by the
House of Representatives Ad Hoc Committee on the Bangsamoro Basic
Law which is now in the House for plenary debates.
They have
conducted dozens of public hearings in Mindanao purportedly to listen

to the various and divergent views of the stakeholders, millions of
taxpayers money were spent. But while the hearings were conducted,
it appears that these were not fully listened to in the House. We were
made to believe that the City of Zamboanga shall be totally out of the
Bangsamoro entity to be created. No less than the Ad Hoc Committee
Chairperson on several occasions, including in the media, emphatically
stated that there shall be no more expansion of the Bangsamoro, as
identified in the initial BBL draft which meant that the City of
Zamboanga shall never form part of it.
In the end, the Ad Hoc Committee eventually unilaterally
amended the framework agreement and the comprehensive agreement
on the Bangsamoro by providing draft Section 4, Article XIV, The
Plebiscite.
That any local government unit or geographical area
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outside the territorial jurisdiction of the Bangsamoro autonomous

region but which are contiguous to any part of the component units of
the Bangsamoro autonomous region and within the area of autonomy
identified in the 1976 Tripoli Agreement may opt to be part of the
Bangsamoro autonomous region.
If you may recall under the 1976 Tripoli Agreement, 13 provinces
were identified including all the cities and villages situated in these
areas, the City of Zamboanga is included.
This provision is totally unacceptable to the City of Zamboanga.
We reiterate that we do not want to be part of the BBL because of the
two plebiscites as also mentioned by my other two colleagues who
spoke earlier.
We call upon the Senates independence and exercise its
constitutional mandates as part of the three branches of government.
We seek and expect the Senate to pass a law which is consistent and
harmonious and not contrary to the 1987 Philippine Constitution, a law
that truly addresses the grievances that bring about cessation and
armed conflicts in Southern Philippines/mpm
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MS. CLIMACO.
armed conflicts in Southern Philippines and
not merely for appeasement, and a law that treats every Mindanaonon
on an even keel and a law that respects the sovereignty and territorial
integrity of the Republic of the Philippines.
Let us all be reminded by our rich experience from the defunct
Memorandum Agreement on Ancestral Domain declared by the
Supreme Court as unconstitutional and contrary to law. The legislative
branch of government is mandated to enact laws not contrary to the
Constitution. Please, honorable members of the Senate, we appeal to
you as the people of Zamboanga City is given this last straw, enact a
law that shall pass judicial scrutiny and not a law that is based on
legislative avoidance and instead leave it to the Supreme Court to
decide upon its validity.
We owe it to the people who elected us to
perform our constitutional duties.

Finally, we again are reiterating the issue of the ARMM property
situated in non-ARMM areas. Pursuant to the mandate of Section 1,
Article XVIII of Republic Act 9054, the Expanded ARMM Law, and the
permanent buildings or structures owned and controlled under the
ARMM located in provinces and cities which do not vote favorably for
the inclusion of their respective areas in the ARMM shall be purchased
by the national government. In turn, the national government shall, in
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its acquisition of said land and permanent buildings or structures, sell,

transfer and convey the same properties in favor of local government
units having territorial jurisdiction thereover and willing to purchase
the said land and buildings or portions thereof.
It is our firm stand
that this provision of the Expanded ARMM Law is mandatory and has to
be complied with prior to the enactment of the BBL and not some other
amendment in the BBL again.
We respectfully ask the national government to purchase these
lands and transfer the same to the city of Zamboanga which can be
transformed into a governmental center to cater to the needs of the
local government and several other departments.
Our people of the city of Zamboanga has always been known and
recognized as ethnically heterogeneous.
Christians, Lumads and
Muslims united under one community. Despite our ethnic diversity, we

are truly blessed and inspired by cultural harmony. Again, we reiterate
that we are one Zamboanga City under one Republic of the Philippines
under one Constitution composed of united 98 barangays and blessed
by marine resources.
We would like to reiterate that majority of the sardine companies
are in the city of Zamboanga and thus, we really have to protect our
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fisheries and aquaculture resources because not only are the canning
companies in the city but majority of the poor rely on us for this food.
Very recently in Typhoon Haiyan, in Yolanda, despite of the siege
that happened in the city of Zamboanga, Zamboanga Citys canning
companies sent 100,000 cans of sardines to the affected residents of
Typhoon Yolanda.
And we would like to reiterate that we need to
implement Section 1 of Article XVIII.
We need to review and, if
possible, delete the opt-in provision of 10 percent, define contiguity

by land and water due to the sardine factories in the city and the
people in the peninsula that will be affected, retain the hydro complex
under the Republic of the Philippines, delete the provision that includes
Zamboanga City due to the Tripoli Agreement, and for that matter, the
other cities that are not included in the BBL. And, of course, we are
here to reiterate our stand of non-inclusion in the BBL. But, however,
we are for one Republic of the Philippines.
Muchas gracias y vaya con Dios.
Thank you very much,
Mayor Beng Climaco.

Again, the subject of the non-inclusion, the desire of at least the
leadership of the city of Zamboanga to not be included in the BBL has
been made. The outstanding issue of the properties of ARMM within, I
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think, the city limits seems to be something that has not been resolved
nor have there been any proposed solutions.
We take particular note of the suggestion or rather the view of
the mayor that it is the function of Congress not to letnot to leave,
knowingly leave unconstitutional provisions in a law that is passed by
Congress just to say, Pabayaan na natin sa Supreme Court iyan.
That is not fulfilling our function. I am in full agreement of that. And
in that regard, this committee will endeavor to do all that we can to
make sure that we fulfill, fully fulfill that function as legislators and
pass a law that we know to be constitutional, to be legal, to be
enforceable, and with the best chance of success that we know how to
pass.
So, thank you, Mayor Beng Climaco.
Now, we move on to the newly included province of Palawan who
was only referred to in the original draft BBL as part of the areas that
will
include
the
Bangsamoro
identity
or
the
definition
of
the
Bangsamoro people. However, that situation has changed considering

the reports, the discussions and the approval in the House ad hoc
committee, an additional inclusion.
So, Governor Jose Alvarez, give the position of Palawan to the
committee.
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MR. ALVAREZ. Salamat, Mr. Chairman, kay Senator JV, sa mga

lahat na kasama rito.
Una sa lahat po ay maraming salamat doon sa mga sardinas
galing po sa Zamboanga. Apektado din kami ng Yolanda. Maraming
salamat po, Mayor.
Nakikiusap
po
kami,
Mr.
Chairman,
kung
anuman
iyong
mapagkaisahan ninyo rito sa Senado at saka sa Kongreso, kung

magaling talaga iyan sa ating mga kapatid na Muslim, ay pagbigyan po
natin ang kanilang kahilingan. Ngunit ang Palawan po ay isinama na
kami noong araw, ay very resounding No. Ngayon, dito sa bagong
draft, mayroon na namang mention ng Tripoli Agreement. Ito po iyong
aming strong objection. Ayaw po naming sumama. Pero kung what is
good for our Muslim brothers in Mindanao ay wala po kaming tutol
doon. Kung okay sa kanila, okay sa bansa, kung makakatulung doon
sa kapayapaan sa lugar na iyon, ay wala po kaming objection.
Ang
pinakamabigat na objection namin ay sinasama po ang Palawan.

Iyan lang po. Thank you very much.
Thank you.
Thank you,
Gov. Pepito Alvarez, for your very simple and straightforward position.
I have to admit na pare-pareho tayong nagulat nang biglang
lumitaw ulit ang province of Palawan dahil nga, kagaya ng sabi ko,
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nang sa draft BBL, nabanggit lang ang Palawan bilang isa sa mga
areas kung saan ang mga indigenous people that comprise the
Bangsamoro people.
But again, nasama sa geographical area of the
Bangsamoro autonomous region doon sa latest draft ng House of

Representatives. Kaya again, ang gagawin natin ay we will take all the
arguments that you have made in your letter which I will ano as a
position paper from the province of Palawan.
MR. ALVAREZ. Maraming salamat sa pagkakaimbita dito.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). The other point that Mayor
Climaco had made that also you echo is the objection to the definition
of contiguity that includes the sea, and that is something that has been
much
discussed
because
this
changes
the
entire
definition
of
contiguous to the Bangsamoro territory. And again, those who will

now suddenly be included if we define contiguity to include the sea,
then there are areas. . . (nam)
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there are areas that will
suddenly become part of Bangsamoro whether they like it or not. So

that is another issue that we will have to take into account in our
discussions when we are writing the report of this Committee.
So, thank you very much, Governor Jose Alvarez.
Now, we move on to South Cotabato.
And we would ask the
governor to give the position of South Cotabato.

Governor Daisy Fuentes, would you like to take floor?
MS. AVANCE-FUENTES. Thank you, Mr. Chairman, Honorable
Ejercito.
Sa mga kasamahan kong resource person, magandang hapon
po.
I am very glad to be here katulad ni Mayor Climaco.
Napunta
kami at napasugod dahil nga sa development sa House na isinali uli

ang South Cotabato.
Naalarma po kami after 48 consultations na
ginawa, wala man lang palang pinakinggan doon sa mga sinasabi

namin.
Ako po naniniwala na ang Kongreso po ang siyang pinaka may
kapangyarihan na suriin ang BBL na ito. At naniniwala po ako na iyong
mga unconstitutional provisions ay dapat talagang alisin.
buts, pero dapat talagang alisin.
No ifs and
Obligasyon po nating lahat iyan. At
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naniniwala po ako na in granting expanded autonomous powers to the

BBL, the majority of ARMM Bangsamoro insititutions must be taken
into account whether or not they can absorb it or can exercise the
powers granted to them. Kaya ba nila? Responsable na ba? Mature
na ba iyong mga institution ng ARMM? At ang batayan natin doon is
ang actual experiences. Hindi puwedeng pagapang pa lang iyong bata,
bibigyan mo na ng responsibilidad para sa isang mature na tao.
Obligasyon ho natin na gabayan pag hindi pa mature.
Pero
pinagpapaubaya ko na ho sa Komite na ito at sa kasamahan kong mga

local government chief executives ng ARMM ang pagtitingin kung ano
ba ang dapat sa kanila at irerespeto natin. Pero kami ho makikialam
dahil kung ano iyong nangyayari sa Lanao Del Sur at saka sa
Maguindanao, ang South Cotabato po ang tinatamaan ng epekto noon
at experience ho namin iyan.
Una po, of course, we object to our inclusion.
twice already and we have said no.
provisions.
We have voted
We also object to the opt-in
Kasi mayroon ho kaming barangay, sa Tangtangan, na
magkalapit po kami ng municipality ng Mangudadatu na formerly

Buluan. Alam ho iyan ni Gov Toto at ni Gov Freddie. At alam nila na
iyong labanan sa boundary namin nagpapatuloy hanggang ngayon.
Two hundred hectares iyan, Ilocano ang population namin, evey month
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or so namamatayan kami. Humihingi kami ng tulong sa pulis. Sabi ng

pulis namin, Tatlo lang ang Armalite namin, Gov.
machine gun ang kalaban namin.
Barrett at saka
At pumasok sila sa Buluan area,
hindi na namin mahabol. Nag-uusap iyong mga mayor namin, mayor

ng Tangtangan, mayor ng Mangudadatunandito si Mayor Freddi
nag-uusap ho sila.
Hindi kayang solusyonan.
Humihingi kami ng
tulong sa Army, sabi ng Army, Baka panggalingan ng gulo iyan. Sabi

ko, Anong gagawin namin? Pabayaan na lang ba naming mamamatay
iyong tao namin padadalawa, paisa-isa, every now and then, if no one
can?
So that really showed to us the effect of this uncertainty na
puwede palang 10 percent lang ang mag-petition balang araw kasi

nag-aagawan ng teritoryo.
Kaya sinasabi nila hindi naman papasa
iyan. Pero iyong uncertainty na dinadala, dahil doon sa parang walang

katapusang opt-in, ay malaki ang epekto noon, not only in us but in
neighboring provinces.
Ngayon po ang hinihingi sana namin na kung mayroong plebisito
doon sa opt-in, isama ninyo na ang probinsiya.
Kasi sa IRA natin,
entitlement, kasama ho sa pagkukuwenta ng IRA entitlement iyong

population at saka territory. So hindi puwedeng barangay lang. Kasi
sa batas, sinasabi lang area. So if area, ano ba ang maaapektuhan
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pag nawala iyong isang barangay?
Hindi ba hanggang province
maaapektuhan? So dapat sila ang tanungin.

Ikalawa po, may worry kami doon sa apparently pagsasanib ng
power
ng
chief
minister
commissioner sa police.
separated.
na
gagawing
deputized
Napolcom
Kasi there is a reason why that has been
Our experience tells us na check and balance iyan sa
pulitikong abusado. Sana mas hindi abusado iyong Napolcom at chief,

PNP. Sa abusado namang Napolcom at saka chief, PNP, iyong concern
naman ng mga elected officials sa nangyayari sa kanilang lugar,
ibabalanse naman.
Ngayon sa BBL ho magsasanib iyan.
Saan ho
pupunta pag mayroong abuso? Ang sinasabi namin, lets look at our
experience, actual experience in the ARMM. Saan tayo nagkakamali?
Saan pumasok ang abuso? At doon ho ang ating lagyan ng safeguards
sa BBL, hindi ba? Gusto na natin lahat pera. Gusto lahat natin poder.
Mayroon ba tayong track record na magpapakita na magiging
responsable tayo pag binigay lahat iyan? So dapat medyo pagapang.
Medyo may tutoring na gagawin tayo bago ibibigay natin ang lahat.
Ika-fourth po na objection namin at concern, concerned ho kami
na iyong Armed Forces natin ay puwede lang maghimasok kung irerequest ng chief minister. Kami ho sa Mindanao, especially sa South
Central Mindanao, iyong amin hong kapulisan hindi kayang humarap sa
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magagaling manlaban na mga rebelde.
Iyong aming mga kriminal
matataas ang armas, hindi tulad ng ibang lugar.
Kaya kahit minsan
sa law enforcement humihingi ho ng tulong iyong aming kapulisan. In

fact, last month namatayan ho kami ng SAF, plain serving of warrant
lang sa drug.
Namatay ang SAF.
So kaya makikita ninyo na iyong
aming sitwasyon hindi pareho sa sitwasyon ng ibang lugar.
Kaya sana
dito sa BBL, the Armed Forces should be given the right and the option
to intervene, if necessary, only coordinating with the BBL authorities.
Pero hindi puwedeng maghintay sila na humingi ang BBL authorities
bago sila makapasok, baka kailangan.
At last po, in-assure kami na iyong lahat ng SPDA properties sa
labas ng core territories ay ibebenta na lang sa amin. Pero gusto ko
pong i-reiterate dito na kailangan nang ibenta para naman iyong
intrusions mabawasan na.
Ang tingin ko po naman kung maging
successful itong expanded autonomy na ibibigay sa BBL, siguro hindi

mahirap pag-usapan iyong mga pagsali na iyan. Pero sa ngayon po,
talagang ang hinihingi po namin, safeguards, kami na nasa paligid ng
core territories.
At sana po magiging sandigan namin ang National
Police at saka Armed Forces sa panahon ng kaguluhan.

Iyan lang po at maraming salamat.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you very much.
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MR. HATAMAN. Bumalik lang ako, Mr. Chairman. Nasa room

ako ngayon ng isang senador, nanonood po ako. Gusto ko lang i-put
into record iyong, halimbawa, pagbanggit na iyong magbibigay tayo ng
kapangyarihan sa musmos, ang tingin ko hindi yata appropriate.
Tingin ko iyong ilan dito puwedeng bumaba sa ARMM ngayon at
tingnan natin kung paano iyong pag-unlad.
Kasi kung general
statement po ito, kawawa naman ang Bangsamoro pag ganito iyong

misconception natin habang panahon.
Thank you, Governor Daisy Fuentes.
And I am reminded that some of the best talent in government is
in the local government because of the very practical and based on
experience suggestions that were made by the good governor of South
Cotabato.
To summarize, iyong opt-in provision, sa palagay niya, para maremedy ang sitwasyon na isang malaking problema sa amin na
nagsusulat ng Senate version kung papaano gagawinhindi na bale
ang constitutionality, hindi na bale iyong legalitykung hindi, iyong
administration lamang.
Halimbawa, ang isang noncontiguous na
barangay ay mag-opt-in, papaano ang administration niya?
Saan
siyang probinsiya?
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Ang remedy mo, Governor Fuentes, is pagka magkakaroon ng 10

percent na plebisito ay buong probinsiya lagi. So, either iyong buong
probinsiya/alicc
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THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). So, either iyong buong

probinsiya ay papasok at buong probinsiya hindi papasok.
So, hindi
iyong tinitingi na isang barangay dito, isang bayan diyan, et cetera, is

that correct, Gov Daisy?
MS. AVANCE-FUENTES.
Ang mini-mean ko po kung iyong
isang barangay gustong pumasok, dapat iyong a-approve sa plebisito

buong probinsiya na ibibigay iyong barangay na contiguous.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). I understand.
MS. AVANCE-FUENTES.
Kasi maaapektuhan ho ang kanyang
IRA dahil sa population at saka sa territory.

THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Lahat ng governor na nasa
non-contiguous areas na may posibilidad nga na may LGU sa kanilang
probinsiya ay mag-opt-in ay iyan ang nababahala diyan sa opt-in
provision dahil the administration of it is very, very difficult. Perhaps
the remedy is what you suggest na ang plebisito ng kahit na anong
LGU sa loob ng isang probinsiya, ang plebisito na mag-opt-in iyong
LGU na iyon ay to be conducted over the entire province.
That is a
very good suggestion. And we will include it in our discussions again.

The concerns that you have over the organization of the
Bangsamoro police at iyong powers ng chief minister over the police,
ito ay matagal na naminmula pa sa unang hearing namin tungkol sa
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BBL ay itinatanong na namin at ipinaliwanag namin kung ano ba talaga

ang relasyon ng Bangsamoro police sa Philipine National Police.
Maraming interpretasyon.
Kahapon lamang ay nakarinig kami ng, at least, two, maybe
three interpretations at ibat-ibang sagot.
Kaya siguro ay kailangan
nating gawin ay liwanagin ng mabuti na ang Bangsamoro police ay

bahagi ng PNP. At sa chain of command ng PNP ay itoy sumasailalim
sa chief PNP, sa Crame ang kanilang headquarters.
At kung anong
order na galing sa kanilang headquarters, kahit na iyong pinaka junior

na rank and file ay kailangan sumunod sa headquarters at ang chief
minister ay siguro coordinating lang. Sinasabi nga na pareho lang sa
ibang LGU.
Akoy laging nag-o-object doon sa ganung klaseng description
dahil sa aking karanasan, ang order ng superior officer ng kahit na
sinong police ay dapat sundan, hindi iyong order ng governor, hindi
iyong order ng mayor.
din ang sitwasyon.
At dapat sa Bangsamoro police dapat ganun
Siyempre malapit tayo sa ating mga police dahil
marami tayong kailangan sa kanila, marami silang kailangan sa atin.

Kailangan magtulungan para maging maganda ang peace and order
doon sa ating lugar. But it has to be very clear that the Bangsamoro
police is under the Philippine National Police and they take their orders
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from the headquarters of the Philippine National Police.
The chief
minister, of course, will act as the representative of the civilian

government.
But I think that the orders should emanate from the
officers of the PNP and not from the chief minister.

Yes, this has to do with the auxiliary police and the military, also
the requirement that the AFP have a request or a clearance from the
Bangsamoro government to enter into areas where there is trouble.
Again, this is beginning to indicate that it has its own sovereignty dahil
ang militar ng isang bansa ay hindi puwedeng pumasok sa lugar ng
ibang bansa. And that would seem to be the definition of what is being
put here.
Mayroon pang ibang other concerns na hindi napag-usapan, this
is on the separation of church and state.
Also, you bring up your
concerns on the constitutional bodies. The COA should be clearly part

which has the central offices in Manila, and that they again answer to
their superiors in the COA in Manila, the same for the Comelec, the
same for the Civil Service Commission, and the same for the other
constitutional bodies.
Yes, Gov Daisy, please.
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MS. AVANCE-FUENTES. Can I just add two points? Also, for

us to look into the powers of the intergovernmental relations
mechanism. Parang sobrang laki at sobrang powerful sila.
maliwanag.
Ano ba talaga?
Isa pa iyan na hindi
At iyong intergovernmental relations
parang nagne-negotiate ngayon ang Republic of the Philippines sa

Bangsamoro government.
At lagi kong pinapaaalala, tayo sa local
government walang negosasyon sa national government. Kung anong

utos ng national government sumusunod tayo kahit ayaw natin. But
that is the situation that we have.
And that is why we have some
concerns as to bakit sa Bangsamoro government ay iba ang sitwasyon

na pagka hindi nag-a-agree ang Bangsamoro government sa utos ng
national government ay pag-uusapan pa, whereas, in other local
governments ay wala namang ganoong klaseng mekanismo.
Yes, Gov Daisy.
MS. AVANCE-FUENTES.
Last, Your Honor, I would like to
clarify when I talked about levels of efficiency and maturity of

institutions in the ARMM and Bangsamoro.
Let me cite an example. Kami ho sa South Cotabato, 48 years
old na province, akala ko ho magaling na kami. Pero noong binigyan
kami nung requirements na bago kami maka-avail ng national
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government project, kinakailangan naming gumawa ng feasibility

studies, ng detailed plans, at tagdadalawang daan na project, tatlong
taon ho akong nagka-backlog because I have to hire people kasi hindi
pala kami ganoon ka-efficient.
So, iyon ho ang mini-mean ko na
maging honest tayo, tingnan ano ba ang kaya natin at hindi natin
kaya.
Kasi ako ngayon parang nabulaga ako na palagi kaming awardee
pero ngayon nagba-backlog kami kasi wala kami palang mga engineers
na marunong sa mga bagong pamamaraan at mabilisan. Wala kaming
taga-gawa ng feasibility studies na makakapasa.
So, iyon ho ang
mini-mean ko. At I hope that it will be taken positively by Governor

Hataman.
MR. HATAMAN.
Maam, for your information, ngayon po
awardee na rin ang regional government nung ARMM. First time in the
history po ng ARMM nagka-seal of good housekeeping kami.
Ang
DepEd namin pumasa sa PBB.

Kaya ang point ko lang ho dito, Maam, huwag tayo mag-issue
ng general statement which is unfair din sa ilan. Hindi kasalanan ng
isa ay kasalanan ng lahat, nagmo-move on din po tayo lahat.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Gov, pakiano lang, please
address the Chair. Alam mo naman iyan ang sistema natin.
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MR. HATAMAN. Yes, Your Honor.

Ako, I interpret the rules
very liberally. I want an open discussion.

I think what Governor Daisy is trying to point out is that,
halimbawa, on a related note, lets not talk about ARMM, lets not talk
about LGUs, lets talk about, lets say, Department of Public Works.
Sabihin natin na gusto natin i-increase ang infrastructure development.
Bigyan natin ang Department of Public Works the first six months of
one year ng 300 billion, will that solve the problem? Hindi. Dahil hindi
naman ganoon kadami ang kanilang bulldozer, ang kanilang truck, ang
kanilang engineer, ang kanilang mga trabahador.
billion sila, anong magagamit nila doon?
Kahit may 300
So, its not absorptive
capacity what you are able to actually utilize efficiently.
Kasi if you
just throw money at a problem and the entity that you are giving the
funding to does not have the ability or the capacity, kahit iyan na ang
pinakamagagaling sa lahat ay kung tatatlo lang sila, wala silang
magagawa, sayang iyong pera mo.
That will be open to abuse,
wastage, malfeasance. Kaya iyon lahat, if I am correct in my analysis

of what you have said, Governor Fuentes.
That is what I think the
governor is trying to point out, that let us make surecpc
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...let us make sure dahil
ang Pilipinas ay hindi mayaman na bansa. At kung anuman ang pondo

na mayroon tayo, dapat tiyakin natin na ito ay magagamit sa tamang
paraan at hindi masasayang at hindi mananakaw at mabibigyan nga ng
kung ano iyong ninanais ng ating mga mamamayan. So I think it is a
reasonable point.
We would like to move on now to
MR. CERILLES. Mr. Chairman, one short statement.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Yes, Gov. Cerilles.
MR. CERILLES. Thank you very much.
For the record, let me congratulate the leadership of Governor
Hataman for his very effective and able leadership in making the
autonomous government where it is now, where it has gained
recognition.
But I think we would like also to go on, I mean, local
government outside ARMMespecially the chairman of Finance is here,

Senator Rectowhy dont you look at the IRA; increase our IRA;
reverse the IRA.
Make the IRA of local government bigger than the
national share.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Governor Cerilles, you have
one vote right here.
MR. CERILLES. Thank you very much.
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We have a proposal to
increase the IRA share of local governments to 50 percent and we

have a proposal to increase the tax base to include all collections of
government to include customs, VATeverythingwhich will bring an
additional 92 billion for local government.
However, this has been
rejected by the President. So we have a lot of work to do

MR. CERILLES.
Please make it public so that the local
government officials will know who is against the prosperity and

development of local governments.
Well, this is not BBL
anymore, these are local government issues.

MR. CERILLES.
Yes.
But it has something to doWe want
that, Mr. Senator. We dont need the Bangsamoro.

THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). I feel safe here because Im
surrounded by fellow governors who will understand and agree with
these issues that we feel very passionately about.
So we will be tapping you, not BBL, but for these issues. And I
hope that you can help us push it and support it so that it will become
a law so that we will not be dependent on policy of the executive but
we will depend on the enforcement of the law that we will pass.
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MR.
CERILLES.
Thank
you
very
much,
Mr.
Senator.
I will send you, Governor
Cerilles, a copy of the proposed draft.

MR. CERILLES.
Please extend my condolence to the Liberals.
[Laughter]
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). [Laughing] Thank you very
much.
Now, we move on to Davao Del Sur. I would like to hear from
Gov. Claude Bautista.
Gov. Claude.
MR. BAUTISTA.
Thank you, Chairman Marcos, Senator Recto
and Senator JV Ejercito. Thank you for inviting us here.

I share the concern of South Cotabato, Palawan and Zamboanga
because time and again since the creation of the ARMM, it has always
been the favorite province for inclusion of the ARMM. Nevertheless, we
readily objected for the inclusion because I, for one, we know that we
live harmoniously with our Muslim brothers in the province and we live
peacefully with them.
The only thing that matters most is with regard to the BBL.
There is a provision there with regard to the territory which is broad in
nature. It is considered as an area. If you look at the geographical
map, Davao del Sur is not even a neighbor of one of the ARMM
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provinces. Thats why for us we suggest and we request that Davao

del Sur must not be included in the BBL. However, being intended to
pursue and implement the right of our Muslim brothers and indigenous
people of Mindanao to autonomy and self-determination, the concept
of BBL is laudable and should be supported. This said, must equally be
assured that the intended BBL will be one that can work and be
sustainable in the long term.
The issues of constitutionality and legal technicality is best left to
the lawyers and the Supreme Court and the latter being final arbiter of
such matters.
So, Mr. Chairman, I really request that in order to pursue a
lasting peace in Mindanao, those provinces that dont want to be
included must be also respected.
Because the framers of the BBL
didnt even consider us or didnt even give us the leeway to be

consulted with regard if we are really interested to be included in the
BBL.
There are some issues too that I have to discuss but I have
already given the position paper to the Committee, more so that we
are not interested in joining the BBL. So I just want to reiterate my
position and put it on record that we really suggest that we will not be
included in the BBL.
Thank you and good afternoon.
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Thank you, Governor
Claude. Thank you for that.

You have expressed concern about the inclusion of Davao del Sur
as one of those who are included in the Bangsamoro core territory.
You also expressed concern on the opt-in provision as the other
governors have outside of ARMM. And again, since nakapag-ugnay na
tayo, nasa amin na angit is already of record iyong inyong position
paper tungkol sa BBL.
MR. BAUTISTA. Mr. Chairman, one more.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Yes, Governor.
MR. BAUTISTA. Please include also the newly created province
of Davao Occidental for the exclusion to the BBL.
Thank you very much, Mr. Chairman.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you very much.
Yes. Actually, the officials of Davao Occidental have spoken to
me and they have made their opinions known.
The same concerns
that they have voiced that they will be included as part of the
Bangsamoro core territory. They would not want to be included. They
worry again also about the opt-in provision, as we all have come to
become worried about.
So thank you, Gov. Claude, sa inyong presentation.
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I have just received the position paper from the Office of the City
Mayor, the City of Koronadal from City Mayor Peter Miguel of
Koronadal City.
Mayor, would you like to make a quick presentation?
MR. MIGUEL.
Yeah.
Your Honors, good afternoon.
Maayong
hapon sa tanan.
The people of Koronadal would like to express the following
sentiments: At its present form and substance, we cannot say yes to
BBL. At the outset, we manifest our strong opposition to the inclusion
of the city, Koronadal in South Cotabato, and the whole Region XII, in
general, in the proposed Bangsamoro area because such inclusion is
mandatory or optional.
In the event that the passage of BBL would be inevitable, we
would like to ask humbly the legislature to respect the decision made
by the people for so many times during the plebiscites who previously
rejected the inclusion of the city to the ARMM.
The inclusion of the
opt-in provision in the proposed BBL once again opens the issue that
has been put to rest a long time ago.
For the sake of stability, it is desired that the LGUs which have
voted not to be part of the ARMM be spared from the coverage of the
proposed BBL optionally or not. The opt-in provision of the proposed
BBL poses a constant threat of expansion of the Bangsamoro area
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thereby causing instability on the part of the LGUs.
Besides, this
provision is too divisive as it comes the possibility of further conflict

among constituents in the locality instead of fostering unity among us.
In effect, the opt-in provision simply creates animosity among peoples
in the LGU.
Thus, we pray that the opt-in provision should be ultimately be
removed.
Instead, if we may suggest, to recognize the voice of our
Muslim brothers and sisters, we recommend that in each LGUs where

there are Muslim communities, mandatory representation should be
made... /jmb
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MR. MIGUEL.
should be made and is acceptable to us, just
like the IPMR or the indigenous peoples mandatory representative.

It cannot be denied also that the people of the City of Koronadal
were not properly consulted in drafting of the proposed BBL.
When
you ask the ordinary people, it is true that one can get a reaction but
not an informed reaction.
To make a point, the government has a burden to ensure that its
constituents are correctly informed and judging on what is happening
now, the people are still groping in the dark when it comes to the
debate over the proposed BBL.
To make it short, we are not convinced of the necessity of the
proposal. We believe that ARMM could have been effective in granting
the needed autonomy to the Muslim areas in Mindanao. And there is
no ample explanation why the ARMM is considered a failure in bringing
about the long lasting peace and sustainable development.
What is really wrong with the ARMM?
Is there no way for the
ARMM to be improved in such a way that the purpose for which the
BBL is being pushed could be attained?
We believe that under the present set-up in the LGUs in
Mindanao, our Muslim brothers and sisters are already empowered and
amply represented particularly in our province, in the City of
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Koronadal.
The tribe people, the Muslim, Lumads and us Christians
have been living harmoniously, peacefully in coexistence.
Ours is a
true manifestation of unity in diversity. As a matter of fact, we have

been very assiduous in promoting the economic and well-being of our
people without any distinction as to race or religion. The LGU has been
in the frontline of promoting the distinct cultures that have been
amalgamated and blended us so well.
But we have also one particular concern and that is about the
shariah justice system being introduced in the BBL.
The present
Presidential Decree No. 1083 or the Muslim Personal Code of the

Philippines already governs the personal and family relations among
our Muslim brothers and sisters, and as well as the matters affecting
inheritance. This has been successfully in effect for decades already.
However, the introduction of criminal law among the laws that can be
enacted by the Bangsamoro government is a cause for some concern
considering that this is entirely new. Sa totoo lang, magkakapitbahay
po kaming lahat, takot kami in respect of mayroong penalty such as
lashes or maybe the foreign countries are doing, pugot-ulo, or even
decriminalizing simple criminal acts or even revising our Revised Penal
Code.
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The question is, what are the limitations of the penalties and the
punishments?
Much have been said about the unconstitutionality of the
proposed measure.
Arguments have been put forward against the
legality of the same. Equally important, however, is the issue whether

or not the proposed BBL would really solve the peace and order
problem in Mindanao. Would BBL bring about so longed sustainable
development? Would BBL bring food to the table of our Bangsamoro
people? It brings us back to the question that has the ARMM failed to
achieve which can be attained only through the BBL.
Or would it
suffice if we are to strengthen the ARMM by instituting some changes

in its structure and by giving additional powers that are in accord with
the Constitution? For we believe that ARMM is not a failed project and
that ARMM is a project in progress.
We are all Filipinos. We are one nation despite our cultural and
religious differences. It should not be a ground for our disintegration.
We already have proven that despite our differences, together, we can
succeed in fighting poverty and calamities and in bringing about
inclusive growth and progress.
Unification, not fragmentation or
dismemberment, is the answer to the problems in our dear Mindanao.
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As weve said, at its present form and substance, we cannot say

yes to BBL. But, definitely, we are for peace and development.
Salamat po.
Mayor
Miguel,
again,
for
that
very
Thank you very much,
straightforward
and
clear
presentation.
We particularly take note of the last part where you say,
Despite our cultural and religious differences, it should not be grounds
for our disintegration.
desirous.
Quite the contrary, integration is what is
And there are certain elements of the BBL which we feel
would tend to lead to that disintegration.

At this point, that is the last of our resource speakers from the
local governments.
But I think Senator Recto would like to ask
questions before we let our local executives go.

So Senator Recto, please.
SEN. RECTO.
I just like to follow up on some of the points I made yesterday

and the local government representatives were not here yesterday.
First, let me congratulate all the LGUs present, all the governors,
the city mayors.
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Many of you, Ive known for how many years.

together in Congress.
Weve been
And Im glad to see many of you also in the
local government at this point.
Its also very nice to listen to the
governors because the governors are very practical and very smart.
The situation in ARMM is different from any other place in the
country in the sense that there is no other regional government in the
country similar to ARMM, the institution, with the exception of MMDA in
Metro Manila.
Its a regional government.
different from ARMM.
But, of course, totally
Pero regional pa rin iyan.
At may kinatawan
diyan iyong mga local governments doon sa MMDA.
Iyong MMDA
naman for common concerns of the cities and municipalities in Metro

Manila.
Now, dito sa ARMMthere is no other region in the country, as I
mentioned earlier, na mayroon ganun. Youve had experience already
with the ARMM.
Sa
local
government,
maliwanag
ang
tungkulin
ng
LGU.
Maliwanag ang barangay, ang munispyo, ang siyudad, ang probinsya.

Maliwanag ang mga responsibilidad ninyo. Ang problema, IRA. Okay.
Ano ang ARMM?
What is your relationship with ARMM at
present?
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Can we ask the governors?

regional government?
What should ARMM look like as a
Dapat ba ilagay diyan maliwanag, halimbawa,
that education in ARMM should be devolved?
Isulat pa natin sa
Organic Act na ito na lahat ng national road diyan ay gawing regional

road
at
ipaubaya
natin
sa
ARMM,
halimbawa,
para
hindi
nagkakalituhan between the national, the regional, the regional and

the local government.
Ang unang pinupuntahan ng tao barangay, si kapitan.
At
kadalasan problema ng kalsada, patubig, kuryente. Ang problema si

kapitan walang pondo para diyan.
Pupunta kay mayor, pupunta
naman kay governor for a provincial road, halimbawa.
So ang
problema lagi kulang ang pondo din diyan.

What do you think should be the role of the ARMM or in this case
the BBL or your regional government?
Yes.
MR. TAN.
Mr. Chairman.
Yes, Vice Governor Tan,
please.
I would think that the purpose of the creation of the ARMM is
for
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SEN. RECTO.
In terms of public administration.
Please go ahead.
MR. TAN.
The purpose isthey call it autonomy, autonomous
government and the purpose of which is to democratize functions of

government. And, therefore, while there was mention about problem
of nondevolution, I would think that the devolution should go down to
the local level.
provinces.
I mean, devolve it to a line agency operating in the
And, of course, like appointments.
Appointmentswith
due respect to Governor Hataman herein fact, we have been

monitoring performance of the members of the Cabinet.
In fact, I
wrote Governor Hataman a letter to request him about matters

concerning education. I told Governor Hataman that we are affected if
the departments do not perform and, therefore, we have to report to
him and tell the governor about the performance of the certain
departments.
And one of which is, we also discussed during the
consultation that we had during our regional peace and order council
meeting that was held in Sulu which we requested for the Basulta
area. One of which was/cmn
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MR. TAN. one of which was the authority for the local offices or
the provincial offices like the DepEd, to give that authority to appoint
certain grade of officials in the Department of Education like what,
teachers, ordinary teachers.
But apparently, appointments are done
only at the regional office.

MR. HATAMAN. Mr. Chairman, if I may. Point of information in
relation to the point raised by Gov. Tan.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Yes, Gov. Mujiv. Yes.
MR. HATAMAN.
Di ho ba sa national ang maga-appoint ng
teacher is regional director, sa DepEd?

Thats right.
Yes, regional
director.
MR. HATAMAN.
Yeah.
Actually ang kailangan natin, siguro
tingnan natin anong difference ng ARMM sa local government units. Ang

LGU is governed by Local Government Code, and ARMM is governed by
Republic Act 9054, as provided by the Constitution.
Kaya medyo
malilito tayo kung i-similarize natin iyong LGU sa ARMM dahil ang
dinevolve (devolve) na function sa ARMM is iyong function ng national
line agency as provided by Republic Act 9054.
At lahat naman ng sa
Local Government Code ay dinevolve (devolve) naman talaga sa local
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government, even sa LGU within ARMM.
Halimbawa, DepEd.
Ang
DepEd hindi naman dinevolve.

SEN. RECTO.
Governor, gusto kong intindihin.
Dito kasi, ang
pinag-uusapan dito the relationship and the sharing of powers between

the national government and the regional government. Today, we are
discussing also the relationship between the regional government and
the local government. Iyon ang pinag-uusapan natin ngayon dito.
Ang tanong ko sa inyo, ano yung kulang sa Organic Act ng ARMM
o di kaya sa BBL para maging maliwanag ang role at responsibility,
halimbawa, ng regional government katulad ng ARMM or iyong
Bangsamoro?
MR. HATAMAN.
Actually, Your Honor, Mr. Chairman, kung ako
ho ang tatanungin nyo, what is proposed in the Bangsamoro Basic Law,

dinefine (define) iyong exclusive power, concurrent power, pati reserved
power. Klaro iyon, which is sa ARMM, kailangan mong i-devolve. Kaya
iyong devolution, since the creation of ARMM, is continuing. And in fact,
hanggang ngayon hindi siya hundred percent.
Kumbaga, iyan yung
sinasagot doon sa proposed Bangsamoro Basic Law.

SEN. RECTO. Anong devolution ang sinasabi ninyo, to be specific
about it?
MR. HATAMAN. Yeah. Halimbawa ho
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SEN. RECTO.
At iyong relationship ninyo with the LGUs, how
should that look like? Halimbawa, Ill give an example, maliwanag ang
relationship ng barangay sa munisipyo.
Ang sharing ng resources,
maliwanag. Ang munisipyo o syudad sa probinsya ang sharing din ng

resources, taxation powers, maliwanag.
How should it look like with
ARMM?
MR. HATAMAN. Actually sa ARMM ho, ang taxation, halimbawa,
tax, 70 percent. For ARMM, 50 percent of the 70 percent goes to local
government units within ARMM.
SEN. RECTO. Yeah. You know, we may not have enough time
today to discuss all these matters, but is it possible for the local
government units and the governor of ARMM to submit to the
Committee a response to these queries?
MR. HATAMAN. Yes, Your Honor.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). I think what is needed by the
Committee for its deliberations when we actually write the Senate
version is a detailed analysis of this.
Because we keep hearing that
Governor Mujiv has done a good job, and yet the basis of what we are
doing is that it is a failed experiment. So wheresaan?Im sure it is
somewhere in between. But like any system, it is not perfect, so let us
identify those imperfections and try to remedy them as best we can.
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And that will not come from political theory, but more from data that
you have gathered from your experience in your time as governor, and
perhaps, also the experience of the local government executives in their
dealings with the ARMM.
So with that, thank you, Senator Recto.
MR. TAN. Mr. Chairman.
Yes.
I have to move on,
Vice, kasitwo minutes para hindi naman

MR. TAN. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Patungkol dito sa ARMM, lahat naman sinasabi natin maganda na
ang ARMM, why dont we just enhance this if it is already good? They
said in the past it is a failed experiment, but after Gov. Mujiv Hataman is
seated there, everybody now is saying that the ARMM is magaling. Why
dont we just enhance it para gumaling nang gumaling?
Thank you.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Gov. Mujiv, sinasabi ko lahat
itong mga LGU officers ikaw ang gusto.
MR.
HATAMAN.
Actually,
Mr.
Chairman,
iyong
BBL
ay
pagpapagaling talaga.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Pero iyong performance mo
laging nababanggit.
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Anyway, thank you to all our local government executives for the
inputs that they have given us in this hearing so far. You are, of course,
welcome to continue to stay while we now go to listen to the
observations, opinions, and suggestions of the Association of General
and Flag Officers Incorporated represented here by very senior general
officers, Gen. Renato De Villa, Gen. Edilberto Adan, and Col. Cesar
Pobre.
So, Gentlemen, please, who would you like to speak for you?
General Adan, you are recognized.
MR. ADAN. Good afternoon, Mr. Chairman, Your Honors.
In behalf of the Association of General and Flag Officers, the
retired members of the PMA Alumni Association, the Philippine National
Police, Coast Guard, the BJMP, and the Bureau of Fire Protection, let me
express our appreciation for your kind invitation to attend this hearing
this afternoon.
Members of this and other brother organizations are retired
officers, many of them are veterans of the campaigns against
insurgency and terrorism in Mindanao. We have pledged to preserve the
Constitution of the Philippines, helped professionalize our armed forces,
and fostered the welfare of our veterans. As veterans, we experienced
the scourge and cruelties of war, its physical, mental, and psychological
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demands. We had to suffer the tormenting thought of leaving personal

comfort and family behind. Though unmindful that in putting our lives
on the line, we could come any time into that fateful moment when bells
for us are rang and our last taps is sung.
And so when we say we abhor war, we long and crave for peace,
lasting peace, just like anybody else, please believe us.
Our veterans
fought for a noble cause. They saved Mindanao from separating from
our Republic, and becoming a separate Islamic state.
What have we learned over these years? The Filipino soldier, time
and again, has proven that when provided the proper direction and
adequate resources to defeat the nations enemies, he will prevail. This
was demonstrated in the successful campaigns against the MNLF
secessionist rebellion since the 70s and the major operations against
the Moro Islamic Liberation Front in the year 2000 in Central Mindanao.
We recognize that the military alone cannot solve the problem in
Mindanao, but the problem cannot be solved without the participation of
the military.
The MILF is a rebel group, and rebellion is a crime punishable by
the Revised Penal Code. The President has broad powers provided by
our Constitution to deal with rebellion and sedition. He may call on the
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Armed Forces or he may choose the path of negotiation, the outcome of

which should be within the conditions allowed by the laws of the land.
The proposed Bangsamoro Basic Law is touted to be precisely that
instrument of peace, the solution to the decades-old strife in Mindanao.
But in our view as the derivative of two covenants, the Framework
Agreement and the Comprehensive Agreement on the Bangsamoro, the
BBL, in its present form and substance, may not prove to be that
instrument.
This is because it contains provisions which can create
more problems than it can solve. Also, it lacks provisions/cbg
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MR. ADAN.
Also, it lacks provisions that would ensure its
workability and prevent the dismemberment of our country.

Mr. Chair, we have submitted our paper to your office.
Yes, General, we are in
receipt.
MR. ADAN. So let me go directly to the recommendations for
the interest of brevity.
MR. ADAN.
Yes, thank you.
Our recommendations are:
(1) The Bangsamoro
Basic Law should include a provision explicitly stating that the

Bangsamoro or MILF renounces forever its avowed separatist policy
and goal of independence and pledges to remain under or be a part of
the Republic of the Philippines. The inhabitants therein shall be Filipino
citizens acknowledging allegiance to republic and rendering to its
government their habitual obedience;
(2) The normalization aspect of the peace agreement instead of
being a mere annex to the framework agreement should be included
as a major provision of the Bangsamoro organic law being crafted by
Congress.
Pinakamahalaga sa amin iyong normalization which we
believe should be defined as disarmament, demobilization of the armed

component of the MILF and reintegration. Pero sa dokumento, ito ay
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annex lamang, hindi major component of the agreement;

(3) Ang disarmament, demobilization and reintegration or
normalization, as called in the framework agreement, should be carried
out jointly by the MILF and the government through a process that has
a definite timeline. The MILF armed component must disarm and turn
in all their weapons on a fixed date;
(4) All the above-mentioned provisions of the MILF government
agreements,
in
particular,
the
framework
agreement
and
the
comprehensive agreement on redeployment of the Armed Forces

should be omitted or repealed;
(5) The phrase civilian authority is at all times supreme over the
military in Article IV, Section 4 of the BBL should be deleted. Hindi na
po kailangan ito sapagkat ito ay nasa Constitution na.
Magkakaroon
ng confusion sapagkat sa iba, ang meaning ng civilian authority over

the military ay puwedeng mag-order iyong local mayor or kung
sinumang official sa military. Ang definition ng civilian authority over
the military ay ang ating presidente ang commander-in-chief, siya ay
isang civilian at sinusunod siya through the chain of command. Iyan
po ang pagkakaintindi ng military at iyan ang aming sinusunod;
(6)
The
central
government
shall
exercise
authority
and
jurisdiction over defense and security. And this should be both internal
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and external, hindi lamang external. Ang Armed Forces should be

responsible in all internal and security problems, hindi lang po
panglabas;
(7) There should be no Bangsamoro police. Instead, the present
ARMM
regional
police
should
be
reconstituted
to
become
the
Bangsamoro regional police office which is under the Philippine

National Police;
(8)
The provision that allows the creation of the AFP-
Bangsamoro
command
should
be
deleted.
Hindi
po
kailangang
magkaroon ng AFP-Bangsamoro command, hindi isinasabatas ang

creation ng component ng Armed Forces. Ito ay based sa threat
situation,
sa
geography,
sa
force
mix,
components ng command na iki-create.
anong
kailangang
mga
Hindi ito isinasabatas, kung
hindi, mawawalan ng flexibilidad ang presidente;

(9)
Article IX, Section 17 on the requirement to establish
coordination protocols for the movement of AFP in the Bangsamoro

area should be deleted.
Kailangan mayroong flexibility, depende ho
iyan sa sitwasyon, ano ang threat.
At iyong mga coordination
protocols, sa aming experience, ay pinagmumulan ng mga leaks,

information leaks. At this could cause needless casualties, ambushes
kung ito ay mayroong mga tinatawag na information leaks dahil nga
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sa may mga coordination protocols na mina-mandate.
Hindi namin
sinasabing hindi dapat mag-coordinate kung hindi iyan ay depende sa

misyon, depende sa pangangailangan ng sitwasyon;
(10) The provision in the normalization annex of the framework
agreement that the AFP is to retain only such installations as are
necessary for national defense and security should be removed. Hindi
po kailangan iyan.
Again, iyan ay base sa kondisyon, sa threat
situation at pangangailangan ng area.

Conclusion. In a recent talk show wherein MILF panel chairman
Mohagher Iqbal was interviewed, he said that the government of the
Philippines must trust the MILF or
Bangsamoro, that it will remain
under the Philippines and the decommissioning will be carried out.

And since the governments trust is ask for, so should we not also ask
for the MILF to show that it can be trusted? This, it can do so by
consenting to the inclusion in the BBL of a provision expressing
explicitly that the Bangsamoro is a constituent part of the central
government, that it renounces the original policy of separatism and
goal of independence and that it undertakes to decommission its
combat elements with all their arms removed from their possession.
It is unfortunate that the tragic Mamasapano incident had to
happen and that so much has already been and continued to be said
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and written about it. Its complications are yet to unfold.

And so in closing, Your Honors, may I be allowed to express the
concern of many citizens? The need to enact a law that will not only
ensure peace and security but the unity of the nation and the
preservation of the territorial integrity of the Republic of the
Philippines. The government should not be afraid of the MILFs veiled
threat of war if the BBL is not passed or approved in the form that they
want.
This challenge is great, time is short, the decision is yours. Sa
ngalan ng inyong mga nagtanggol sa bayan, salamat po.
Thank you, General, for
again, a very, very clear presentation with some very important points
made, and all those points born of experience. Not from theory but
from experience of both war and peace in the areas that we are talking
about.
I would just like to correct you on one point that you made, that
the MILF makes a veiled threat. Hindi na po veiled, they are saying,
Pass the BBL or there will be war.
There is no veiled involved
anymore.
The points that you have made, I think, are particularly relevant
to the discussions that we are having today. The point of the
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normalization has been an area of some concerns which we have

discussed at great detail.
We are, in fact, at this point way behind
schedule in terms of the decommissioning. We are supposed to be in

the phase where the crew-served weapons have already been
inventoried, embargoed put aside, that has not yet happened.
The
organization of the panel that will oversee that decommissioning has

only just been done.
And, again, the suggestion that you have a specific timetable is
one thing that is well received. Because right now, it is not dates that
we look at but events, that upon passage of the CAB, upon passage of
the BBL, plebiscite, etcetera. Perhaps, that is a more practical
approach. Because with the vagaries of a political process, we cannot
tell when these events will occur and we can always say that it has not
actually been implemented and it is not yet time to completely
decommission.
The suggestion that you make that instead of including the
decommissioning
and
normalization
process
in
an
annex
but
rather.../jbc
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THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). but rather in the law itself

is, again, one that is well-taken and that will make it more robust and
it will make it a condition to the implementation of the other parts of
the law.
And it is the first time we have heard that suggestion and
that is why I thank you for your inputs because that is something that
is, again, born of your experience in Mindanao.
The concern about the Bangsamoro police is something that,
again, has been discussed in great detail but the problem that we have
is the lack of clarity in the lawin the BBL as of now.
As I had
mentioned earlier in our discussions where we have heard different

interpretations of the chain of command, the relationship of the
Bangsamoro
police
with
the
national
government,
with
central
command of the PNP in Crame has not been clarified and, as I said,
there are several interpretations that are conflicting and we will
endeavor to clarify that very clearly. And what we are going to clarify
is that I believe that we should just make the Bangsamoro police
similar to your suggestion, another regional office.
tayo sa mga region, may opisina ng RD.
May RD naman
They coordinate with their
PDs. They coordinate with their chiefs of police. Why do we have to

have a different system?
But, again, that will clarify the chain of
command that the lowliest policeman is under the command and
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authority of the chain of command that originates from the commander

in chief and down to the chief, PNP and along down to the command
structure that the PNP has.
The creation of the AFP Bangsamoro command is very worrisome
because we already have a Bangsamoro police which is under the
command of the chief minister.
Nandoon po kayo noong na-establish ang PNP.
Linipat natin,
ginawa nating national police dahil nagiging private army iyong mga
local police na nasa ilalim ng mga officials.
Now, this is taking a step backward, rather than forward because
ang kinatatakutan nga ay magiging private army ng chief minister ng
kung sinuman ang nakaupo at lahat naman tayosiguro agreed tayo.
Ngayon, dinadagdagan pa na mayroon silang sariling armed
force. So hindi lang private police force pero may private na army at
saka hindi na itopagka sinabing army, iba ang usapan pagka sa
pulis at saka sa militar. That is why, again, it will be a fighting force,
not an enforcement force like the police that enforces the law, the
armed forces are there to engage in battle when need be and they will
have the capability to do so with the attendant weaponry, command
structure that will be against all of the mandates that we have for the
organization of a standing army.
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The coordination protocols, again, I think we should learn from

the lessons of Mamasapano at maliwanag na maliwanag na ito ay
naging problema on both sides of the situation.
So, again, this is
something that needs to be clarified. I think that we should be very

wary of any language which will say that the AFP needs somehow
clearance or permission from the Bangsamoro government to conduct
operations
in
the
Bangsamoro
area.
That
seems
to
be
counterproductive in many situations and it is something that needs to

be clarified.
The point that is also made that we must be very clear that,
separate this policy and the goal of independence should be renounced
by all parties involved is also something that has been discussed and
that we have discussed with the MILF.
As a matter of fact, there is
such a provision in the ARMM organic law but somehow it no longer is

in the Bangsamoro law.
The argument that was made to us by Chairman Iqbal was very
simple.
It says, You should trust us.
And precisely, as you have
stated here, General Adan, You should trust us that we will not
separate. And the answer that we give them, We trust you. But we
do not know about those that will follow you.
What if when you are
no longer at the head of this government, when the leadership that is
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now that has pledged allegiance to the flag is now replaced by another
group and they decide that they should separate the Bangsamoro from
the Republic, we have no guarantees against that.
So I thank you again for what would I say are very common
sense
straightforward
measures
and
that
they
are
particularly
important to us because we know that they have been born of your

experiences not only in the conduct of battle, in the conduct of combat
but after the battle is done, many of our officers were involved in the
actual administration of the areas that they were assigned to. So even
that side of it is something that you have experienced in and we
welcome your inputs and insights into that.
Yes, sir, the former Chief of Staff, General De Villa.
MR. DE VILLA. Mr. Chairman, just one little point for emphasis
when you write out the law.
We would like to emphasize that the
powers and prerogatives of the president as commander in chief

cannot
be
shared
with
the
chief
minister
of
the
Bangsamoro
government.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you, General. Yes,
that would be a valuable point and I think it is an added guarantee for
us, for any rogue elements to try and take advantage of this autonomy
that we are giving to these regions.
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I would like to acknowledge the arrival of Senator Chiz Escudero.

But it is hello and goodbye because we have finished with all our
resources persons, unless you would like to ask questions.
And I would like once againI know maybe I am biased but I
always get a lot.
I learned very many things when I talk to local
government executives simply because like our commanders in the

military, all the suggestions, all the insights, all the observations are
practical and are common sense because you actually have gone
through the experience that we are trying to emulate by bringing
peace to Muslim Mindanao.
I thank you all for your participation.
It has been highly
productive. I am very gratified that we conducted these hearings and

I believe that it will add a great deal to our discussions. Thank you all
very much.
Please if there is anything else, pag mayroon kayong naisip na
hindi ninyo nasabi dito sa hearing, pakisulat langmost of you have
my number, please call me.
If you need to give me any other
additional material, please feel free to send it to my office.

Yes, Usec Bacani.
MR. BACANI. Two minutes lang po.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Sige lang.
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MR. BACANI. We are not going to dispute any statement about

the lack of consultations or communications. We acknowledge that it
is never enough. However, we have submitted to your office a listing
of more than 500 consultations we have done for the last five years
from small gatherings to gyms full of participants.
We have talked
with representatives of the Sultanate of Sulu, MNLF, religious leaders,

police, military, IPs and other different sectors.
acknowledge that its never enough.
However, we
So we will endeavor more to
reach out to more people to let more of the population know about
what the BBL is all about.
Second, I think its not for the interest of anybody, as we
mentioned
yesterday,
unconstitutional.
that
there
is
any
provision
which
is
So we are willing to work together with all of you
just to make sure that there is no unconstitutional provision in the final

law that will be passed by both Houses of Congress.
Third, I think to lessen the anxiety on the issue about opt-in, I
think we can all help each other by basically saying that it has to be
contiguous by land, therefore, eliminating many other areas like
Palawan, Zamboanga, etcetera becausethat was discussed in the
House.
They said that there is no need to include it because it is
understood. But if it is needed to make sure that it is clear, we can
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say contiguous by land. So in effect, on a practical basis, we are only

talking about Sultan Kudarat, North Cotabato, Lanao Del Norte.
Because I think there is a lot of anxiety in the other areas that they
may be included. /mpm.
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MR. BACANI. areas that they may be included.

Fourth, I think you were asking about what can be improved in
the new law. I think one structural flawI think you have noticed it in
the conversations na nangyari ngayoniyong automatic appropriation
and regular release of the funds. Tinutugon ito ng block grant because
I think its very important na magkaroon ng fiscal autonomy because
what we have in the ARMM today is even less than what the LGUs
have.
Sa LGUs, mayroong IRA, automatic appropriation, regular
release.
Sa ARMM, detailed line budgeting.
So, nandito sa
Bangsamoro Basic Law iyong tugon diyan in terms of a block grant,

automatic appropriations, regular release, the Parliament can decide
on the spending priorities to fill the needs of the constituents.
Iyon
lang po. Just general because I realize that there is not enough time
to address all the issues raised po.
Salamat po.
THE CHAIRMAN (SEN. MARCOS). Thank you, Usec.
I think on the issue of consultation, the desire was to have
consultations duringfrom the very beginning of the process.
But
anyway, we cannot turn back the clock. We are here so we will try to
remedy the situation by having hearings such as this.
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On the question of contiguity, the definition that included the

seas did not come from the LGUs, did not come from anywhere else,
but it first came up during the road show noong umiikot sila.
TinanongI think Congressman Celso Lobregat was the first person
who brought it up.
And when asked what is the definition of
contiguity, the answer came back that it included the seas. And as you
say, we can assume that it is clear to everyone but I think from our
hearing today, it is not clear.
So, just to make it clear because the
success is dependent on us being very definite in the functions, the

powers,
the
systems
of
government,
the
power
sharing,
the
administration, all of that, like in any ordinary job, the job description
is extremely important for the job to be done well. You cannot do a
good job if you do not know what the job is. And that is what we are
trying to do so that everyone knows exactly what is expected of them
and what powers we grant them so that they can do their job properly.
So, on the question of clarification, we are very much for that,
and that is precisely what we will be trying to do because even the
recommendations of the Peace Council, though there were specific
recommendations given by Chief Justice Davide on amendments to the
Constitution, what he could see are constitutionally infirm provisions.
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Aside from that, the rest of the recommendations were to clarify areas
that could be misinterpreted.
So, thank you, Usec Bacani.
We seem to be in consonance in
our thinking and I thank you for your interventions.

Yes, Senator JV.
SEN. EJERCITO. Thank you, Mr. Chairman.
Before we end, I would like to thank the local government
officials, of course, the governors and, of course, our officers for your
very important observations. Its all well-taken. But considering with
what Ive heard this afternoon, theres still a lot of loopholes, a lot of
questions and a lot of provisions that, you know, still have questions
on constitutionality. So, Mr. Chairman, my only concern is that, you
know, the implications might be irreversible in the long run. Once we
pass a law that is not reallythat has so many loopholes and so many
questions, the long-term effect will be irreversible.
So, my only
comment, Mr. Chair, is that, you know, probably this can wait and we
want to make sure that we pass a law that will address all the
questions especially on its constitutionality and especially on matters of
security and all the other concerns that have been brought up this
afternoon.
Thank you, Mr. Chair.
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Ejercito.
Thank you, Senator
And if there are no other interventions from anyone, then
thank you all once again.
Thank you all very much for your
participation, and as I said before, it has been a highly productive

discussion. Rest assured that the points that you have made here will
be included in our deliberations on the final version, Senate version, of
the BBL.
Maraming salamat po. We are adjourned.
[THE HEARING WAS ADJOURNED AT 2:44 P.M.]
162

BBL IN SENATE - Hearing On Issues of Local Chief Executives, June 3, 2015

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Republic of the Philippines

CONGRESS OF THE PHILIPPINES

Wednesday, June 3, 2015

Sen. Claro M. Recto Room

Senate Bill No. 2408 An Act Providing for the

Committee on Local Government Joint with the

HON. JOSEPH VICTOR G. EJERCITO

Hon. Senen Bacani

Hon. Haroun Al-Rashid Lucman Hon. Jum Akbar

Undersecretary, Office of the

Committee on Local Government Joint with the

Hon. Freddie Mangudadatu

League of Municipalities of the

Committee on Local Government Joint with the

Ms. Fiona Conde

Committee Secretary, Committee

(For complete list, please see attached Attendance Sheet.)

AT 10:38 A.M., HON. FERDINAND R. MARCOS JR.

today, are consulting with executives of the local government units

We have a fairly complete attendance

Commissioner Abdullah Camlian; Commissioner Pedrito Eisma. Thank

counsel, Atty. Smith General.

From Lamitan City, Basilan, Mayor

Rosita Furigay; from the Municipality of Wao, Lanao del Sur, SP

Mangudadatu, Assemblyman Ziaur-Rahman Adiong, Assemblyman

Assemblyman Haber Asarul.

To speak for the retired officers, Lieutenant General Edilberto

This hearing is being conducted because of the

committees revelation that, in fact, during the negotiations between

consultation with our local government officials.

And besides that,

So, just as a procedural matter, what I will do is I will first ask

COMMITTEE ON LOCAL GOVERNMENT JOINT WITH THE

especially iyong office of the regional

government sa executive. Because I learned the Regional Legislative

Naalala ko lang noong ni-review ko po,

Constitution. Walang ibang intention kung hindi, paano umunlad ang

Dahil dito, pinag-aralan namin ang lahat noong

agreements hanggang sa Republic Act 9054. Lahat naman tayo dito

COMMITTEE ON LOCAL GOVERNMENT JOINT WITH THE

magbibigay po ako ng ilang halimbawa.

Ang isa, pinaka-factor dito,

At malinaw rin noong nag-conduct ng pag-aaral

COMMITTEE ON LOCAL GOVERNMENT JOINT WITH THE

dahilan bakit namin sinusuportahan ang BBL dahil malinaw sa

Hindi ko sinasabi, Mr.

Chairman, na hindi tama ang proseso na ito.

Pero sinasabi ko mas

Halimbawa ho, mayroon kaming

dinevise (devise) sa ARMM na isang proseso ng budget.

COMMITTEE ON LOCAL GOVERNMENT JOINT WITH THE

ang accountability natin ay sa ating mga kababayan, therefore, gusto

Pero sa ARMM, hindi namin magagawa

Ang ating local government units

puwedeng mag-function ang kanilang Sangguniang Panglungsod,

kaso ng DepEd. Ang programs, activities and projects or PAPssanay

COMMITTEE ON LOCAL GOVERNMENT JOINT WITH THE

senadorpero ito iyong ginagawa natin sa budgeting--nandito si Mayor

Ito ang tinilad-tilad natin.

Alamin kung ito.

Ikumpara natin, halimbawa, sa national DepEd, 23 ang PAPs nila. Pero

PAPs ang DTI sa buong bansa na seven. Pagdating sa ARMM ay zero.

Ito ho ay hawak ng national line