Ed Psych Final Paper

Elana Glatt

To acquire knowledge, one must study; but to acquire wisdom, one must observe (Marilyn

Vos Savant). Interviewing and speaking with two children in distinct developmental age groups was an

extremely enlightening experience, and brought home the many lessons we learned together over the
course of the semester.

It was clear from the interviews that the seven and fourteen year old girls whom I interviewed,

although both very mature for their ages, were on different realms of cognitive, moral and religious

development. The first child I interviewed was a seven year old Beis Yaakov girl from New York. As the

oldest in her family, with four younger siblings, she is highly responsible for her age and takes great care
of her younger siblings. She pitches in a great amount in her home, helping her mother cook and clean,
and she takes tremendous pride in her role in her family. When I inquired if I could ask her a few

questions she was very excited, and I was impressed at her ability to clearly and concisely express what
she was thinking. Piagets third stage of development, the concrete operational stage, is when

children aged 7-11 are able to think logically about objects and events, and I could see that this girl was
definitely moving past a certain part of childhood and entering this new stage of development.

One question which I found very interesting was when I asked her if she could describe herself

in one word. As I was asking her the question, I was trying to envision what potential adjective she

would respond, if she would say anything at all, and I was pleasantly surprised when she answered
smart right away. No flinching or sense of embarrassment, just clear confidence. Reflecting back

though, I shouldnt have been so surprised with her uninhibited sense of confidence. We learned from a

lecture by Ken Robinson that all children are born with the creativity and skills of Picasso, and its only by
virtue of being repressed through many years of school that children lose this glimmer of confidence

within them. This girl is definitely bright, and I hope that as she progresses through the education

system and grows older she can still hold on to the unbridled confidence which she proudly defines
herself with now.

While discussing what she thinks should happen to a child who misbehaves, I learned a

tremendous amount about the moral development of children at this age. It was clear to her that a child

who misbehaves deserves to be punished and to get some kind of consequence. According to Kohlbergs
three stages of moral development, children in the Pre-moral stage of development see rules as fixed,

and that one must obey the rules in order to avoid punishment. They cant yet take into account other

reasons or rationales behind why a child might do something wrong, and view moral things as black and
white. Interestingly, in direct contrast to her response, the fourteen year old girl who I interviewed

answered according to the next stage of Kohlbergs mental development, the Conventional stage of

moral development. She responded that when a child does something bad, that child probably feels
lonely or angry and therefore acted up, or they were never told clearly what rules were expected of
them. This fourteen year old girl no longer saw morality as clear-cut, but was rather able to see the

picture from a different perspective and recognized that there are social reasons which could govern
why someone might do something wrong.

In terms of religious growth, this seven year old girl is a sincerely thought out and proud Jewish

girl. When I asked the question of what makes her family special, she responded that theyre Jewish, and
to her thats the ultimate marker of a special and unique family. Although she couldnt quite describe
what God looks like, she had a really good grasp on what makes God Omniscient and separates Him

from human beings here on earth. We learned in class that the ages of 0-12 are the essential and vibrant
years of religious growth for young children, and I could see that she takes tremendous pride in this
aspect of her and is mindful of religion and Halacha in a sincere and beautiful way.

After speaking with the seven year old girl, I was excited to interview the fourteen year old and

to see how her thoughts and answers would differ or relate to those which the first girl offered. The
second girl I interviewed is a 9th grader in a Modern Orthodox High School in New York, and is the

youngest in her family. She has always been years ahead of her classmates in terms of maturity, and as
the youngest has always been treated like an adult and included in the grown up activities and

conversations which takes place. As I began interviewing her, I noticed that her responses were much
deeper and thorough than those of the seven year old girl. It was clear that she had begun to enter

Piagets final stage of formal operational thinking, thinking logically about abstract propositions and
ideas and theorizing about hypothetical situations.

One question which made me smile during the interview was when she suggested that someone

is considered an adult in 9th grade. As a 9th grader, it was enlightening to hear her express why she thinks
that shes considered an adult in todays society. She explained that 9 th graders are considered adults
because now that they entered high school others have begun treating them older, and with the

newfound responsibilities which they have in school and in life, theyre able to begin acting like an adult
and making their own decisions. I think deep rooted in this response is the fact that this girl has always

been years ahead of her friends in terms of maturity, and now that her friends are beginning to catch up
to her in these areas she feels that theyve achieved a level of adulthood which they hadnt had before.
From a religious standpoint, this fourteen year old girl is highly committed to her Avodat

Hashem and cares a tremendous amount about Torah and growth. When she pictures her future self,
she sees someone who is involved in creating an initiative or organization which helps people learn

Torah and betters the world in a meaningful way. And when she was asked to describe God, she painted
the picture of a bright white cloud or light which has a nice smiling face and is just happy and nice.

Overall, this girl has a very positive taste of Judaism and has the desire to spread what she finds so
beautiful and special with the world. In class discussions, we learned with Dr. Goldberg that teens

between the ages of 14 and 18 are not currently in the growth years of Avodas Hashem, and instead

they maintain where they are and continue to grow further when they move past this stage. I guess I will
have to wait and see how the next four years play themselves out for this girl, but one thing that is clear
is that this girl was given a strong foundation from her parents and school until this point, and has a lot
to be proud of in her choices in Avodas Hashem.

Child Interview Assignment

Elana Glatt

Interview #1- Child aged 5-7

Interviewer: Elana Glatt, Ed Psych Student
Interviewee: A 7 year old girl, Beis Yaakov student in New York
EG: Hi its so nice to have the opportunity to speak with you. May I ask how old you are?
LG: 7 years old.
EG: What grade are you in?
LG: Im in 2nd grade.
EG: How many brothers and sisters do you have?
LG: I have 2 brothers and 2 sisters.
EG: Are you the oldest, youngest, or in the middle?
LG: Im the oldest.
As the oldest of 5 kids under the age of 7, she definitely takes pride in her role as the first born and chips in a
tremendous amount in the house. She watches her siblings, helps her mother cook, and is a very competent
and mature 7 year old. As a child, shes in her pivotal growth years, and you can see her modeling herself, her
dress and her behavior after her mother and teachers in her school.
EG: What is your happiest memory?
LG: When I went to visit Zaidy Korn (her great-grandfather) in Florida. Bubby and Zaidy took me.
EG: Why do you like being a kid?

LG: Because I do fun things like going on trips and rides. Instead of having to watch children all day long.
EG: Whats one word you would use to describe yourself?
LG: Smart.
In class we watched a video presentation of Ken Robinsons about how children are born with tremendous
amounts of creativity and confidence. Students start off with the creative genius of Picasso, only to lose it
through the many years of schooling and being told theres only one right answer to things. Seeing this 7 year
old say shes smart right off the cuff, no prefacing or justification showed me just how much confidence little
children do have, and how important it is that we foster this strength instead of stifle it over the upcoming years.
EG: What is something that makes your family special?
LG: Being Jewish.
EG: At what age is a person an adult? Why do you think so?
LG: 19. I dont really know.
EG: Are you a good friend? Why do you think so?
LG: Yes. Im a good friend because I can play different games and dont have a specific one I play. My friends
can choose what game they want to play and wont have to have a hard time urging me to play a game. Also,
Im sensitive.
Its interesting to see what characteristic makes someone a good friend at age 7 versus age 14, etc.
EG: What do you think makes a person good-looking?
LG: When they wear matching clothes.
EG: What happens when a kid does something bad?
LG: They get punished. Theres some sort of consequence.
According to Kohlberg, the first stage of moral development is the Pre-Moral stage, where children see rules
as fixed, and obey rules at all costs to avoid punishment.
EG: What do you want to be when you grow up?
LG: A teacher. Because I like learning new things and I think I would be good at teaching new things.
EG: What does God look like?
LG: I have no idea.
EG: Last question for you, whats the difference between you and God?
LG: Hashem knows everything and I cant learn everything because no one can.
EG: Great, thank you so much for your time!

Interview #2- Older youth aged 10-14

Interviewer: Elana Glatt, Ed Psych Student

Interviewee: A 14 year old girl, Modern Orthodox High School student in New York
EG: Hi its so nice to have the opportunity to speak with you. May I ask how old you are?
DS: 14.
EG: What grade are you in?
DS: 9th grade.
EG: How many brothers and sisters do you have?
DS: 2 brothers and 2 sisters.
EG: Are you the oldest, youngest, or in the middle?
DS: Im the youngest.
As the youngest in the family, she has always been years ahead of her classmates in terms of maturity. Her
parents and siblings all treat her as if she was an adult, and include her in many of the grown up activities and
conversations that take place. Her childhood upbringing has therefore been much different than her older
siblings, and she loves her position in the family (except when all the older siblings are out of the house and
shes alone).
EG: What is your happiest memory?
DS: Winter vacation when my entire family (sister in law included) went to Israel and stayed in a hotel together.
EG: Why do you like being a kid?
DS: I like that if you make a mistake you're learning from it still, and you have older people to teach you stuff,
and you don't have to worry about money.
EG: If you could describe yourself in one word what would it be?
DS: Mature.
EG: What is something that makes your family special?
DS: That we're all nice to each other and all love each other, and we care about each other a lot.
EG: At what age is a person an adult? Why do you think so?
DS: 9th grade. Because first of all you're in high school and everyone treats you like you're older because you
are. And eventually people are going to start treating you like an adult so it makes sense to start when you start
high school. 7th and 8th you're training to be older, and in 9th you're starting to be older. Also, a time when you
should start making some decisions for yourself. And you need to be more responsible in school and in life.
Its cute to see how this girl believes that the stage she currently is in is the age which qualifies someone as
being an adult. 9th graders are by no means adults, but I believe she thinks this is because in high school,
many of her friends who were previously behind in behavior and maturity (according to the maturational theory)
are now catching up, and she feels that as a whole her grade is capable of handling more responsibilities,
which in turn makes them considered adults.
EG: Are you a good friend? Why do you think so?

DS: I think I'm a good friend because I'm trustworthy and I know when you should be more involved and helpful
and when you should back off a little bit.
EG: What was the nicest thing you did for someone?
DS: At the high school open house I sat with someone that I didn't want to sit next to because she was all alone
and I didn't want her to feel sad.
EG: What do you think makes a person good-looking?
DS: A certain smile that you see on someone and just know that they look like a nice person who wants to
listen when you talk to them. They just look like a nice person, pretty outside and inside.
EG: What happens when a child does something bad?
DS: When a child does something bad from the child's perspective he probably feels lonely or angry, or just
someone didn't set rules or didn't care the last time they did it so they did it again.
According to Kohlberg, the second stage of moral development is called the conventional stage. In this stage,
a child does good to be seen as good by others. In this interview, the 14 year old girl has definitely moved on to
this second stage, thinking about the perspective of the child and social reasons why he would do something
bad, instead of immediately thinking of reward and punishment.
EG: Whats the difference between an accident and on purpose?
DS: An accident is when you didn't intend for that to happen and you didn't want it to happen, also it's if you're
going to learn from it because you didn't mean for it to happen and you don't want it to happen again. On
purpose is more when you're kind of aware of what you're doing that it's going to be wrong or you know what
will happen and you just don't care.
EG: Of all the things you are learning, what do you think will be the most useful when you are an adult?
DS: Maybe the things I'm learning from mistakes. So for babysitting I'm learning how to work out how much to
be paid and not just to say it's ok. I learn from the mistakes I make. Also maybe how to communicate with
people. Learning that from the debate team and hearing my mother talk about her work, and in class when I'm
explaining things. I'm learning how to word things best. Also maybe how to talk to people when something
happens to them. How to talk to people in different situations.
EG: If you could grow up to be famous, what would you want to be famous for?
DS: For making an initiative or organization that makes peace or helps people to learn Torah, being someone
who can create a meaningful way for people to be good.
EG: What do you want to be when you grow up?
DS: Either a teacher or a doctor or a psychologist, or a nutritionist.
Its so refreshing to see someone with so many options ahead of them, making decisions now that will impact
their future career and life paths.
EG: What is the hardest thing about being a kid?
DS: That you have to be dependent on other people sometimes. Want to go out and need parents to drive you
and plan it. Nice to have your own house and do things how you want to do them. Also people look down at
you when you're a kid and assume you don't really know things, when really you do.
EG: If you could travel back in time three years and visit your younger self, what advice would you give
yourself?

DS: I would tell myself that no matter how many friends or accessories or things like that you have you'll get
farther with being a good person. Being a good person will get you much further than looking and being cool.
Always have a smile on your face and be good because itll come back around at some point in your life.
EG: Who are your three best role models?
DS: My older sister, my mother, my 8th grade teacher/ G.O advisor
EG: What does God look like?
DS: Kind of like a bright light and a cloud that's very white with a nice smiling face. Very shining light, but kind
of like a ghost a little bit. But just looks happy and nice.
EG: K, last question Whats the difference between God and you?
DS: A lot. God can see the whole picture while I can only see what's happening now. God is powerful while I'm
limited. God can do anything. God does everything that's best for me and I don't necessarily.
EG: Great, thank you so much for your time!