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Two P ar k Avenue tel 1.212.591.

8500

New Yor k, N Y fax 1.212.591.8501

10 01 6- 59 90 U.S.A. w w w. a s me . org

June 28, 2017

To: Members of the A17 Mechanical Design Committees Suspension Means Task Group

Subject: Agenda for the August 2 & 3, 2017 Meeting

Dear Members:

Attached find the Agenda for the August 2 & 3, 2017 Meeting

The following is a list of assignments for the Task Group:

ASSIGNMENT
Item Number Subject
(and responsible individual)
Mr. Kalgren is asked to review this item and report at
8.1 Record 11-1070
the next meeting.
Mr. Lamb
Record 11-2193
Mr. Conrey is asked to complete the final review of his 8.2
Wedge Sockets
road map and send it to the Staff Secretary.
Records 17-1347 & 17-1348
Messrs. Konyar, Rhiner, Mr. Horne 8.3
Use of Aircraft cable

Mr. Koshak 8.5 Wind Turbine

Record 15-86 - A17.1


Mr. Kalgren and Mr. Lamb are asked to address the
8.6.11.xx Examination After
latest ballot comments and revise the proposal as 8.6.1
Shutdown Due to a Residual
necessary.
Strength Detection Means"

Sincerely,

Nicole Gomez
S & C Engineer
Tel: (212) 591-8720
Fax: (212) 591-8501
E-mail: gomezn@asme.org
Two P ar k Avenue tel 1.212.591.8500

New Yor k, N Y fax 1.212.591.8501

10 01 6- 59 90 U.S.A. w w w. a s me . org

AGENDA

A17 Suspension Means Task Group

Wirerope Works Inc.


100 Maynard Street
Williamsport, PA 17701
(570) 327-4251

Wednesday, August 2, 2017 | 8:30 am 5:00 pm


Thursday, August 3, 2017 | 8:30 am 12:00 pm

This document is subject to approval and is for Committee use only. This document is not to be duplicated or quoted for other
than Committee business.

1 CALL TO ORDER

The meeting is scheduled to begin at 8:30 a.m. on Wednesday, August 2, 2017.

2 RECORD OF ATTENDANCE

3 ANNOUNCEMENTS

4 ADOPTION OF AGENDA

5 APPROVAL OF THE MAY 15, 2017 MINUTES

6 PERSONNEL

7 REQUESTS FOR INTERPRETATION

None.
8 TASKS FOR THE SMTG

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

See SMTG 205 (Priority List 2017_01) for a condensed version of the priority list.

8.1 Record 11-1070 A17.2 Strawman for Suspension Terminology

Dennis Kalgren was tasked to draft a strawman revision to ASME A17.2, Items 3.22, 3.23 and 3.24
to coordinate with revisions to 8.11.2.1.3. The title of the ASME A17.2 Items and 8.11.2.1.3(bb),
(cc) and (dd) should be the same. This was completed for the conference call and awaiting review
by the SMTG.

August 2008: Kalgren to review this assignment.

September 2008: No report. Mr. Kalgren will provide strawman at the October SMTG meeting.

October 2008 - July 2009: Mr. Kalgren provided draft set of proposed updates to A17.2 (SMTG
191 A17.2 Strawman for Suspension Terminology.doc). This item will be further discussed
after the work on A17.6 and A17.1 is completed.

November 2009: Mr. Kalgren is asked to prepare a report for discussion at the next meeting.

May 2010: Mr. Kalgren advised that he would like to update the proposal to the current (2009)
language. Mr. Kalgren is asked to prepare the proposal for discussion at the next meeting.

July 2010: Mr. Kalgren reported that he has the strawman completed however he would like to
review the current guide before circulating to the rest of the Task Group.
It was noted that it may be more appropriate to send a recommendation to the A17 Inspections
Committee. The SMTG should just concentrate on supplying the Inspections Committee with the
technical content.

Mr. Kalgren advised that he will have the strawman distributed to the SMTG by the next meeting.

October 2010: Mr. Kalgren noted that he would distribute the latest strawman proposal to the
SMTG prior to the meeting.

It was agreed to send the proposal shown in SMTG 191 R02 out for R&C to MDC and
Inspections Committee. GWG to coordinate a 7-day Administrative Ballot with the MDC
Secretary, to be coordinated with the publication of A17.1-2010.

June 2011: Ballot 11-1497 is currently out for voting and scheduled to close on 7/11/2011.
Comments will be available for the September 2011 MDC meeting.

{Secretarys Note: Ballot 11-1497 closed on July 12, 2011 and as a result this item was sent for
Review and Comment Ballot 11-1617 to the A17 Mechanical Design Committee and the A17
Inspections Committee. Ballot 11-1617 is scheduled to close August 9, 2011}
December 2011: The proposal shown in SMTG 191-R02 was sent to for Review and Comment
Ballot. As a result the proposal received 6 comments. Mr. Kalgren was asked to address the ballot
results for discussion at the meeting.

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

Mr. Kalgren advised that he was not able to work on this item. He advised that he would respond
to the comments for the next meeting of this Task Group.

December 2012: Mr. Kalgren was not present at the meeting.

April/September/December 2014, May/September 2016, January 2017: Mr. Kalgren advised


there was no report at this time.

May 2017: (May 3rd & 4th) This item was not discussed.

(May 15th) This item was not discussed.

August 2017 Discussion: Mr. Kalgren is asked to report.

8.2 Record 11-2193, Verification of Wedge Socket Requirements and TR 00-13

Background: Miles Lamb and Mark Lane to prepare a strawman to improve and update the
wedge clamp shackle requirements in A17.1 and to strawman quality control requirements for
wedge sockets. See May 2008 MDC Minutes, Items 8.1.2 and 8.1.4 for further background
history.

August 2008: This item will not be addressed until the suspension standard is adopted.

September 2008: No report.

October 2008 - July 2009: This item will not be addressed until the suspension standard is
published.

November 2009: Mr. Lamb is asked to review this item.

May 2010: Mr. Lamb was not present, therefore there was no report.

July 2010: Mr. Lamb reported that he has attempted to access the strawman which Mark Lane
prepared, to use as a starting point, without success.

It was suggested that if the original strawman could not be recovered than a teleconference
should be arranged with the Lanes to try to recreate the strawman.

Mr. Lamb is asked to reach out to the Lanes to arrange this meeting.

October 2010: Mr. Lamb has contacted Robert Lane (Mark Lanes son @ EMCO) and they
currently have plans to try to meet during October-December 2010 to prepare a strawman.
June 2011: Mr. Lamb submitted a strawman (SMTG 212) to be reviewed by the SMTG. Mr. Lamb
will prepare rationale for the proposal and all Task Group members are requested to review the
document and send comments to Mr. Lamb. SMTG members are asked to be prepared to discuss
the proposal at the next SMTG meeting.

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

It was suggested that a face-to-face meeting of the SMTG and perhaps Mr. Robert Lane may be
beneficial in order to finalize code language in the proposal prior to sending it out to ballot.

December 2011: Following the last meeting Mr. Lamb submitted the proposal shown in SMTG
212 R02. The Committee is asked to review the proposal for discussion at the meeting.

It was moved, seconded and VOTED to send the proposal for Review and Comment to the A17
MDC.

December 2012: At the October 2, 2012 meeting of the A17 MDC, Mr. Lamb indicated that he
needed to completely rewrite this proposal to incorporate all the negatives. Mr. Lamb is asked to
report.

Mr. Lamb was not present at the meeting. It was noted that Mr. Kalgren volunteered via email to
assist Mr. Lamb with this item.

September 2013 (MDC): Mr. Lamb reported that at the 9/9/2013 Task Groups meetings work was
begun on this item. The outline of the rewrite was presented at the meeting. It was noted that
EN 81 may want to be consulted regarding this issue.

The task force should look at the wedge itself to determine if any code requirements should be
crafted regarding the wedge.

April 2014: Mr. Kalgren reported that Miles is still working on this item with his alternate.
Nothing to report at this time.

September 2014: Mr. Lamb was not present on the call. Mr. Kalgren advised that work has not
been completed on this item.

December 2014: At the September 2014 A17 MDC meeting a revised proposal was presented
and it was agreed to send the proposal for Review and Comment to the MDC. This item is
currently out for Ballot 14-2712.

May 2016: Mr. Lamb advised that he and Mr. Conrey continue to work on the roadmap for the
reorganization of this section.

September 2016: Scott Conrey presented a revised proposal at the meeting. The SMTG returned
the proposal for reformatting.

January 2017: Mr. Conrey has nearly completed the roadmap which indicates any movement of
rules and/or amendments to current code language.

Mr. Conrey advised that he will review the roadmap once more before submitting it to the Staff
Secretary who will send it for Review & Comment to the Mechanical Design Committee. The
SMTG would like to request approval from the Mechanical Design Committee Chair on this
course of action.

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

Staff Note: This course of action was approved by the Chair of the Mechanical Design Committee
at their meeting on January 10, 2017.

May 2017: (May 3rd & 4th) This item was not discussed.

(May 15th) Mr. Conrey reported that he is working on the proposal.

August 2017 Discussion: Mr. Conrey is asked to report.

8.3 Records 17-1347 & 17-1348 Addition of Parts 4 & 5 to A17.6 and Corresponding
References in A17.1 (Use of Aircraft Type Cables (TR 99-13))

Background: See August 2008 Agenda.

MDC September 2007: Messrs. Frank and Konyar were requested to work on this item. It was
advised that they feel that aircraft cable is not suitable. A17 LU/LA Committee recommends that
it should not be used in an elevator but should be included in the rope standard. Mr. Simpkins
agreed to speak with Mr. Baxter, Chair of A17 LU/LA Committee.

MDC January 2008: Mr. Simpkins reported that he spoke with Mr. Baxter. The LULA is still
interested and is aware of the Rope Technical Committees concern.

May 2008: No Report.

August 2008: Previous historical information has been removed from this report. All of the
background information can be found in the May 2008 SMTG meeting Minutes and will not be
included in future SMTG meeting Minutes. This item will be addressed at a later date.

September 2008: This item was briefly discussed and it was agreed that it will be addressed at a
later date.

October 2008 - July 2009: SMTG agreed to consider this as a new part (e.g. Part 4) following
publication of A17.6 (Parts 1, 2, 3).

Mr. Konyar drafted at table shown in document SMTG 192 Tolerance for small diameter aircraft
grade cable.doc.

November 2009: The members present at this meeting are inclined to remove this item from the
Task List. The individual questions regarding use of aircraft cable have been answered by MDC to
the PRE and LULA Committees.

This issue at this point is that LULA wants inclusion of aircraft cables in A17.6.

May 2010: A Part 4 for all miscellaneous suspension means (coated rope, aircraft cable) was
suggested.

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

Mr. Simpkins is requested to follow up on MS 83420 and to follow up with the LULA and PRE
Committees. If the concerns of the Committees are not clear, Mr. Simpkins has advised that he
would invite a representative to participate at this TGs meeting.

July 2010: It was noted that this will be one or more new parts in A17.6. Information still needs
to be gathered on all applications of ropes/cables in elevators. It was noted that this is not a
traction application and therefore was not originally included in the standard.

A new Part 5, Miscellaneous Ropes (non traction), was discussed for ropes that are not used in
traction applications but are used in other applications. Another approach would be to limit to
A17.6 to only traction applications and leave everything else out.

October 2010: Other Rope Applications - SMTG identified other applications such as roped-
hydros, drum machines, LULA, etc and is soliciting guidance from the MDC and others on the
future direction for applications of these other suspension means.

MDC secretary is requested to add this item to the January 2011 MDC agenda.

June 2011: At the May 2011 meeting of the A17 Mechanical Design committee is was noted that
the SMTG should approach representatives from LULA and Residence Committees to discuss the
applications these ropes would be used for, in order to determine if there is a pressing need for
inclusion of aircraft cable in A17.6.

SMTG agreed that requirements for aircraft-type cables should be added to A17.6 to cover LULA
and Residential and possibly Wind Turbine elevators. The actual suspension means requirements
for these applications needs to be defined. Mr. Konyar is asked to prepare a questionnaire in an
effort to obtain actual requirements for these products regarding suspension means. The
questionnaire will be reviewed by SMTG before being sent to other committees.

December 2011: Mr. Konyar reported that he had collaborated with the SMTG to formulate the
questions for the survey.
Mr. Frank supplied the secretary with historical files for inclusion in the SMTG files.

Mr. Walker advised that he would collaborate with Mr. Bialy to follow up with the chairmen of
the sections that use this technology to see if they still want to use it.

December 2012: Mr. Walker reported that the LULA committee still wants this included in A17.6.
It was noted that there are partial requirements in A17.1 currently.

It was requested that a Mr. Konyar and Rhiner prepare a strawman proposal for the inclusion of
Aircraft Cable into A17.6. It was advised that the current requirements in A17.1 (LULA) should be
incorporated.

Future Considerations:
LULA Aircraft Cable Application
Roped Hydraulics
Wind Turbine Applications
Governor Ropes

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

The committee discussed the list of preliminary questions developed by Mr. Konyar, shown in
SMTG 215. It was requested that these questions be forwarded to the LULA and Residence
Committee for their consideration so that Mr. Konyar and Mr. Rhiner have a place to start.

April 2014: The questionnaire was sent to the LULA and Residence Committees on February 26 th,
2013 for their consideration. As a result the two committees responded as shown in SMTG 215a.
The SMTG is asked to review the responses to the questionnaire.

It was requested to send the response of question 5 on the questionnaire to LULA for
clarification What kind do they use?

Kim Konyar and Martin Rhiner and Bruce Horne are asked to collaborate and draft a strawman
proposal for inclusion of aircraft cable in A17.6.

September 2014: The A17 LULA Committee met May 5, 2014 and sent the following revised
response to question 5:

[As a direct response to the manners listed in question 5] We are currently not aware of
anyone using these drive applications for LULA elevators. The only rope usage the
committee is aware of is for roped hydraulic elevators. The ropes used in these
applications are either elevator wire rope or aircraft cable as permitted in 5.2.

Kim Konyar was not able to participate in the teleconference but submitted the email shown in
SMTG 222 to the committee for their consideration with this matter.

December 2014: Mr. Konyar advised that this item is dependent on some of the other items on
this agenda regarding to specialty type ropes.
It was suggested that the new part for be labeled Miscellaneous Applications.
It was also noted that load and usage would need to be considered.

It was suggested that we collect all the materials that have been compiled on these alternative
ropes and invite the manufacturers to participate in the discussion.

Mr. Konyar advised that he can start to collect data on these miscellaneous ropes.

May 2016: It was advised that the concerns in this item will be included in the new Part 4 of
A17.6.
September 2016: No report.

January 2017: No Report. It was advised that Mr. Konyar will provide an update at the March
2017 meeting in Morristown, NJ.

May 2017: Mr. Rhiner submitted the latest proposal for A17.6 - Part 4. The Task Group was asked
to review this proposal prior to the meeting. See SMTG 206 R2.

(May 3rd & 4th): The Task Group reviewed and updated the strawman for Part 4 of A17.6.

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

The following changes were made:


- Part 5 was created to list all references in the Standard. The dates on the references
were changed to latest edition.
- Sections 2, References, of Parts 1, 2, & 3 were updated to references the new Part 5.
- In Part 1, Section 1.6.4.1.1 and 1.6.4.1.2, references to final-galvanized or hot-dipped
galvanized ropes were deleted, including the deletion of Table 1.6.4.1-1. Rationale:
This information is being changed to reference the current industry practices today.

Tables and Section titles in Part 1 will require renumbering. A reference to A17.6, Part 4 needs to
be added to A17.1, Requirements 5.2.1.20, 5.3.1.12, 5.4.8, 5.7.14, and the introduction to 5.9
and 5.9.20.1. Martin Rhiner will work on these revisions.

(May 15th) This item was worked on during the May 3rd and 4th SMTG meeting. Any Task Group
members who were not present at that meeting were asked to review the proposal and present
any proposed changes.

References to A17.6 were added to A17.1, Requirements 2.20, 5.2.1.20, 5.3.1.12, and 5.7.14.

It was determined that a reference to A17.6 Part 4 was not necessary for A17.1, Requirement
5.4.8.

The SMTG will present this proposal to the Mechanical Design Committee at their meeting on
Tuesday, May 16, 2017. The Task Group will request sending the proposal for a 6 week Review &
Comment Ballot to the Mechanical Design, Inspections, LULA, PRE, Rack and Pinion (Special
Purpose Elevators), and Wind Turbine Committees.

The SMTG plans to schedule a meeting the end July or beginning of August in either Bethlehem,
PA or Morristown, NJ to review the ballot results.

August 2017 Discussion: The Mechanical Design Committee approved sending the proposal for a
6 week Review & Comment Ballot to the Mechanical Design, Inspections, LULA, PRE, Rack and
Pinion (Special Purpose Elevators), and Wind Turbine Committees.

The proposals for the additions to A17.6 and the corresponding references in A17.1 were split
into two difference records to be balloted together since they pertain to two different code books
with difference publication schedules. Record 17-1348 was opened for the addition of Parts 4 & 5
to A17.6. Record 17-1347 was opened for the proposal containing the addition of references to
the new A17.6, Part 4 in A17.1.

Review & Comment Ballot 17-1695 closed with Record 17-1347 receiving 10 comments and
Record 17-1348 receiving 11 comments. The Task Group is asked to generate ballot responses
and revise the proposals accordingly.

8.4 Alternative Inspection Information

Background: Lou Bialy to respond to Inspectors Guide Committee who are requesting non-
destructive testing details. As a result of recent work of the Wire Rope Technical Board, the SMTG

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

discussed adding other retirement criterion, such as NDT (non-destructive testing) for steel wire
ropes into A17.6.

August 2008: This item will not be addressed until the suspension standard is adopted.

September 2008: No report.

October 2008 July 2009: This item will not be addressed until the suspension standard is
adopted.

May 2010: No Report.

July 2010: Mr. Bialy advised that there was nothing new to report, however it is still an important
issue to keep aware of. The members of the SMTG were asked to send the secretary any
information on this subject so that the entire SMTG can review.

October 2010, June 2011: No report.

December 2011: Mr. Walker advised that he would confer with Mr. Bialy for a status update.

December 2012: Mr. Walker reported that there is nothing to report at this time. Mr. Walker is
asked to discuss this with Mr. Bialy for a status update.

April 2014: It was reported that Mr. Bialy advised that this item should remain on the agenda,
but there is no action at this time. Mr. Frank advised that this item was opened at the A17
Inspections Committee as well.

It was noted that we may want to invite a member of the A17 Inspection Guide Committee to
participate on this task group.

September 2014: No action required at this time.

8.5 Record 11-2009, Item from Wind Turbine Task Group

October 2010: At the September 2010 meeting of the A17 MDC it was noted that the task group
on Wind Turbines will be submitting a proposal to codify the odd sized ropes used with that
technology.

No report.

June 2011: No report.

December 2011: Prior to the meeting Mr. Koshak submitted the proposal shown in SMTG 213
TN 11-2009, for review and discussion by this Task Group and the A17 MDC.

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

At the meeting Mr. Koshak and Mr. Gromek presented the tables shown in SMTG 213. The
Committee discussed the inclusion of these in A17.6 and it was noted that this item has been
held for ballot pending the outcome of this task groups discussion.

It was advised that the table should be completed before it can be codified. Also retirement
criteria should also be developed for these rope constructions before their inclusion is
considered in A17.6.

In connection with the inclusion of steel wire rope sizes constructions, etc. for the WTE industry
the SMTG recommends the following path forward:
WTE should consider utilizing the current rope constructions as defined in the current
tables of A17.6
Tables covering the unique constructions of SWRs used must be completed by the WTE
committee.
The tables will be included in A17.6, Part 1
All other criteria specified in A17.6, Part 1 will be applicable to the unique rope
constructions needed by the WTE.
Revisions to replacement criteria needs to be defined for these new tables by the WTE.
Add explicit use language to the tables limiting the application to WTEs.
Wire Rope Technical Board questions the use of sisal cores for these rope sizes in these
applications.

It was moved, seconded and that the above represent the consensus of the SMTG and that this
list be sent to the WTE Project Team for their consideration.

December 2012: Mr. Koshak was not present at the meeting.

April 2014: Mr. Koshak was not present at the meeting.

September 2014: It was noted that there was a ballot from the wind turbine committee.

December 2014: No report.

May 2016: It was advised that the concerns in this item will be included in the new Part 4 of
A17.6. It was also noted that a new record should be opened for the new Part 4. It was also noted
that when the new Part 4 is sent for first consideration ballot, the entirety of the standard should
also be sent with the revision. Since this is on periodic maintenance.

Questions for A17 WTE Response:

1. Do we know what the effect is when the rope is just sitting idle for months? What effect does
this have on the lubrication for the rope that is bent over the sheave?
a. When a dry rope, where the lubricant between the wires is no longer present, bends
in subsequent operation what effect would this have on the rubbing of dry wires
across dry wires?

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

2. What is the theoretical residual strength of the ropes when they are retired according to the
proposed diameter reduction or wire breaks? Is there empirical test data that supports the
values being used?
a. What methodology is used to evaluate the empirical test data?
b. How was the 5 year/250 hours of operation established?
c. What is the basis to increase the 5 years to 10 years?
3. In addition to the time based retirement criteria, are there any other applicable national
standards that are being used in other parts of the world?
4. What rope constructions and classifications are used for wind turbine elevators and what was
the basis for their selection?

The Secretary was asked to research the previous list of SMTG question regarding Wind Turbine
suspension means.

September 2016: Record 16-1703 was opened for A17.6, Part 4.

The questions from the May 2016 meeting were sent to the Wind Turbine Elevator Committee.

Mr. Koshak reported that there is a current ongoing study being done to verify the requirements
in this code. The answers are currently out for ballot.

The WTE submitted their answers to the questions from the May 2016 Minutes after this meeting
concluded. The MDC looked over the responses and generated some additional
questions/comments that were sent to the WTE Committee to review.

January 2017: The A17 WTE Committee will review the comments from the A17 Mechanical
Design Committee at their next meeting in February 2017.

The SMTG will review the responses from the WTE Committee at their March 2017 meeting in
Morristown, NJ.

May 2017: Mr. Rhiner submitted the latest proposal for A17.6 - Part 4. The Task Group was asked
to review the proposal prior to the meeting. See SMTG 206 R2.

The WTE submitted the following responses to the SMTGs questions (see May 2016):
Responses from A17 WTE:
1. Yes. The rope remains lightly lubricated.
a. The wires are never so dry to be in condition described. In addition, the elevator
operates 20 times maximum in one day every six months. The wire to wire abrasion is
limited.
2. Those values are the same values used in ISO 4309, which our understanding is 60% of
residual minimum breaking force. Yes, we have three empirical tests. We are expecting more.
a. Pull testing ropes from various locations and environments after 5 years have expired.
b. From the wind turbine tower elevator manufacturers.
c. Testing to date, ropes retired after 5 years show only a reduction of 80% of residual
minimum breaking force.
3. Yes, ISO 4309.

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

4. Rope construction and classifications are located in the tables provided in the proposed Part
4. The basis for their selection is unknown because they have been used for 70 years.

See file SMTG 226 WTE Responses (9_17_2016) for the official committee correspondence.

At their February 2017 meeting, the WTE Committee provided the following responses to the
MDCs comments in regards to the answers above:

MDC Comment: Regarding rope testing question 2(a) and 2(c), add 4th test area to
protocol to verify original rope MBF. (Rationale: To explain the apparent reduction to
80% MBF after 5 years)
WTE Response: Our suggested rope testing protocol has suggested a change to include
an unused portion of the rope for reference.

MDC Comment: Clarify usage of 70 years in response to question 4.


WTE Response: One of the major manufacturers of these lifting devices has been using
this system since 1946. Other manufacturers since 1972, 1973, 1980, and late 1990s.

See file SMTG 227 WTE Responses (3_1_2017) for the official committee correspondence.

(May 3rd & 4th): The Task Group was asked to review and discuss the responses from the WTE
Committee.

This item was not discussed.

(May 15th): This item was not discussed.

August 2017 Discussion: The Task Group is asked to review the responses from the WTE
Committee.

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

8.5.1 Record 14-572 Revision to A17.6-2010

April 2014: Prior to the meeting the A17 WTE Committee submitted the request shown in SMTG
221. The SMTG was asked to review the addition to A17.6 and prepare a recommendation for the
A17 MDC meeting regarding the processing of this revision. The WTE would like to send this for
first consideration, they would retain ownership over the revision, but request guidance from this
TG and the MDC.

The SMTG does not agree with the action to send this item to first consideration ballot to the
A17 Standards Committee. The SMTG recommends the following action to the A17 MDC: The
A17 SMTG will take this item and will use it during the consideration of the use of Aircraft cables
as a new part 4 of the A17.6 Messrs. Konyar, Koshak (TGL), Rhiner and Horne are asked to take
this item.

It was also noted that there is much more information that needs to be gathered before theses
ropes can be incorporated into the standard.

September 2014: It was noted that his item should be combined with 8.5. No action necessary
from the SMTG at this time.

May 2016: No report.

September 2016: No report.

January 2017: No report. This will addressed at the March 2017 meeting in Morristown, NJ.

May 2017: Mr. Rhiner submitted the latest proposal for A17.6 - Part 4. The Task Group was asked
to review the proposal prior to the meeting. See SMTG 206 R2.

(May 3rd & 4th): The Task Group reviewed and updated the strawman for Part 4 of A17.6.

The following changes were made:


- Part 5 was created to list all references in the Standard. The dates on the references
were changed to latest edition.
- Sections 2, References, of Parts 1, 2, & 3 were updated to references the new Part 5.
- In Part 1, Section 1.6.4.1.1 and 1.6.4.1.2, references to final-galvanized or hot-dipped
galvanized ropes were deleted, including the deletion of Table 1.6.4.1-1. Rationale:
This information is being changed to reference the current industry practices today.

Tables and Section titles in Part 1 will require renumbering. A reference to A17.6, Part 4 needs to
be added to A17.1, Requirements 5.2.1.20, 5.3.1.12, 5.4.8, 5.7.14, and the introduction to 5.9
and 5.9.20.1. Martin Rhiner will work on these revisions.

(May 15th): See item 8.3.

August 2017 Discussion: See item 8.3.

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

8.6 Possible Changes to A17.1/A17.6

8.6.1 Record 15-86 A17.1 8.6.11.xx Examination After Shutdown Due to a Residual Strength
Detection Means".

DAK: It's not clear to me right now if we discussed this during one of our meetings and I could
not find anything in my notes.

September 2014: Mr. Kalgren volunteered to investigate this issue.

December 2014: Mr. Kalgren is asked to report.

8.6.11.11 Examination After Shutdown Due to Traction Loss. Where the traction-loss detection
means has been actuated [see 2.20.8.1 and 8.6.1.2.1(gf)], the elevator shall not be returned to
service until a physical examination of the drive sheave and suspension means has been
conducted. The elevator shall not be moved until all passengers are out of the elevator and the
elevator is posted out-of-service. In addition to the suspension-means evaluation criteria in
8.11.2.1.3(cc), any suspension-means or drive-sheave condition that would adversely affect the
traction capability of the system (see 2.24.2.3) shall be corrected before returning the elevator to
service.

NOTE: See lockout/tagout procedures in Elevator Industry Field Employees Safety Handbook for
procedure for removing the elevator from service.
Rationale: Editorial correction to referenced requirement in Section 8.6.

8.6.11.14 Examination After Shutdown Due to Broken-Suspension-Member Detection Means.


After any application actuation of the broken-suspension-member detection means [see 2.20.8.2
and 8.6.1.2.1(f)], whether due to testing or during normal service, the driving-machine sheave,
all other sheaves, where furnished, and retainers and suspension members shall be examined
throughout their complete length to ensure that all suspension members are properly seated in
their respective sheaves, and that no damage has occurred to sheaves, suspension members, or
retainers. The elevator shall not be returned to service until this physical examination has been
conducted and any repairs made, if necessary. Where a single suspension member has been
damaged or broken, the entire suspension means shall be replaced in accordance with 8.6.3.2.

Rationale: Editorial clarification to change the word application to actuation and added
references to Sections 2.20 and 8.6.
8.6.11.XX Examination After Shutdown Due to Suspension-Member Residual Strength
Detection Means. After any actuation of the residual strength detection means [see 2.20.8.3 and
8.6.1.2.1(f)], whether due to testing or during normal service, the elevator shall not be returned
to service until an examination of both the detection means and the suspension members has
been conducted and any repairs made, if necessary.

Rationale: To identify required actions to be taken when actuation of a suspension member


residual strength detection means occurs.
It was noted that Denny and Miles will work to revise this item and circulate via email to the
SMTG for further comments. This item will also be added to the A17 MDC Agenda.

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

May 2016: This item was sent for First Consideration Ballot 15-1212. Mr. Kalgren was asked to
address the ballot results. Mr. Kalgren will report at the Mechanical Design Committee meeting.

September 2016: Ballot 15-1212 closed with 5 disapproved votes, resulting in Record 15-86
being disapproved. The Task Group (Kalgren, Lamb) is asked to address the ballot results.

Miles Lamb reported that there is no report at this time.

January 2017: The Task Group advised that they will generate responses to Ballot 15-1212
comments and revise the proposal for the March 2017 meeting in Morristown, NJ.

May 2017: (May 3rd & 4th): This item was not addressed.

(May 15th): Mr. Kalgren and Mr. Lamb are asked to update the Task Group on their progress in
generating proposed ballot comments and a revised proposal.

August 2017 Discussion: The Task Group is asked to report.

8.6.2 Review of A17.6 Aramid Fiber Ropes

The SMTG will be responsible for continuously reviewing A17.6 for revisions and updates and
monitor the Standard so that publication deadlines may be met.

August 2017 Discussion: Record 17-319 contains the proposal to renew A17.6 with some minor
correction. Recirculation Ballot 17-450RC1 closed with 0 disapproved A17 Standards Committee
votes and 2/3 consensus, resulting in Record 17-319 being approved. The record received no new
comments.

The Task Group is asked to review Section 2, Aramid Fiber Ropes. This section received many
comments requesting the Mechanical Design Committee remove it from the Standard. The SMTG
is asked to review this section decide if they recommend the Committee remove it from or keep
it in the Standard for the next publication.

9 NEW BUSINESS ITEMS

None.

10 FUTURE MEETINGS

A17 MDC SMTG: Monday, October 2, 2017 in Toronto, Canada


A17 MDC: Tuesday, October 3, 2017 in Toronto, Canada

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A17 MDC Suspension Means Task Group AGENDA August 2 & 3, 2017

11 COMMITTEE FILES

The historical files for the SMTG may be found on the ASME C&S Connect website on the
Mechanical Design Committee page (folder titled SMTG).

Updated Files:
Record 17-1347
Record 17-1348

New Files:

12 ADJOURNMENT

This meeting is scheduled to adjourn at 12:00 pm on Thursday, August 3, 2017.

Submitted by,

Nicole Gomez
S & C Engineer
Tel: (212) 591-8720
Fax: (212) 591-8501
E-mail: gomezn@asme.org

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