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In thi third edition of our tech corner erie, I’ll explain a imple and ea wa to ue a volume pedal a an
expreion pedal. Thi cool little trick wa hared with u our good friend Chad. Thi article will e the lat
trmon Tech on expreion pedal pecificall, although there are man other intereting di project we can do in the
future with the XP input on trmon gear.
Corner #3 – If ou’ve got a volume pedal hanging around that doen’t get much ue or etter et one alread on our
oard, ou can ue it a an expreion pedal with one pecial cale. It’ called a TR (tip/ring/leeve) inert
Volume Pedal a cale and the purpoe of thi cale i normall to reak out a TR inert jack (commonl found in mixer) to
the eparate end and return ignal. Luckil we can take advantage of thi wiring to convert our volume pedal
into a tandard 1/4″ TR equipped expreion pedal.
an xpreion One example of thi tpe of inert cale i the Hoa TP-201 een elow.
Pedal
Octoer 10, 2011 Terr
Categorie
Artit Feature Artit Preet
log Contet
Once ou have a TR inert cale, impl plug the TR plug into our exp input, the “ring” plug into the
How To New
volume pedal input, and the “tip” plug into the volume pedal output. That’ all there i to it! Now ou can ue
Pedaloard Feature Pre Releae volume pedal like the popular rnie all VP Jr or the new Dunlop DVP-1 a expreion pedal for our
trmon gear and mot other gear featuring expreion pedal control. What i actuall going on here i that
Review Tech Corner we’re taking advantage of the deign of a paive volume pedal and re-wiring it a an expreion pedal with
thi cale. Note that our volume pedal need to e paive, not active and the impedance (value of the
Thi Week' Preet Uncategorized reitance) in the volume pedal’ potentiometer in’t critical. One thing that ma e a little it different aout
uing the volume pedal a an expreion i that if the volume pedal ue an audio taper potentiometer ou
White Paper won’t get a linear weep of expreion pedal value from toe to heel. In other word, much of the action will
happen at one extreme of the pedal.
A ou can ee, the expreion pedal chematic from Tech Corner #1
earch log
Happ hredding,
Terr
Tag: di, electrical engineering, expreion pedal, how-to, pedal, tech corner, timeline, TR cale, volume
pedal
Aout Terr
Related pot
trmon Tech Corner #1 – Anatom of an trmon Tech Corner #2 – uild our The ound of trmon: ound Deigner
expreion pedal own expreion pedal Pete Celi
Jul 12, 2010 eptemer 7, 2010 Novemer 12, 2015
78 Repone
Wow. o that mean that I could theoreticall ue a Morle PW, which ha the longet phical weep
of an pedal I have ever ued, a an expreion pedal. That would e pectacular, epeciall with the Lex.
RPLY
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Yeah ok, not to e ditracted, ut what kind of oot are thoe?
RPLY
Would thi work if I wa uing the expreion pedal to control a 5k pot on a pedal? I had the pedal
modded o that a certain kno i ale to e expreion controlale.
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iWhimical a: Octoer 14, 2011 at 12:05 am
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Definitel! Thi will work for l Capitan, rigadier, Orit, Lex and TimeLine.
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Hi Johua, no we don’t ell it ut it’ readil availale online. Thank for
reading
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Thank o much Terr! Man, a’ll’ cutomer ervice i great! And fat!
RPLY
Hello!,
I there a wa to have an expreion pedal and a toggle pedal at the ame time into the Timeline? Would
love to do thi expreion trick and to alo end tap tempo control into a eparate external pedal
ecaue I feel like i could reak the timeline tapping it o much.
Thank u!
RPLY
He there! No need to worr aout reaking the witch, that’ what it’ there
for! The expreion pedal input will onl do one thing at a time, o ou’d
need to chooe either external tap or expreion. Though ou could ue a
midi controller to control our tap if ou like. Hope thi help.
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Could ou ue an expreion pedal to control the volume of a loop going? I have a midi controller that I
ue to trigger the looper
RPLY
Hello,
thi i ver intereting,
ut how to lower the 250K to 50K to uit the need of an AX FX for exemple (AX FX accept from 10K
to 100K, ut 250K i proal too much
RPLY
Hi lowering the reitance of the pot i a it difficult without completel ruining the taper, however i
would imagine the AxeFx will actuall accept the 250k definatel worth a tr. if it doent work the eaiet
thing would e to jut change the pot. alo there i no impedance in a reiitive circuit a it i uggeted
aove. Impedance i a re-active meaurement and require a cap or inductor of ome ort in the circiut.
RPLY
Hi:
I’m ure other ma have tried thi….ut if not IT WORK GRAT FOR M.
I have multiple trmon pedal a well a pedal that work with an rnie all VP Jr a an expreion
controller.
Which mean I can ue one Volume pedal to control 2 effect intead of a controller for each effect….it’
a little too late to worr aout aving pace on m oard , ut thi help a little.
RPLY
I am ver pleaed to know thi a I prefer the rnie all VP Jr to all the other pedal out there. One
quetion: doe the Hoa TP-201 come in horter length?
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[…] intereante viene al invetigar un poco ver en el log de trmon eta entrada ore tranformar un
pedal de volumen en uno de expreión. n el equema e aprecia que el pedal […]
RPLY
Hi Terr!
xpreion rnie all VP JR 25k work with the timeline?
Thank!
RPLY
Ha anod chipped a FC1010? - Page 3 a: Feruar 14, 2013 at 2:44 pm
I jut tried it with o FV-60 and m Hammond XK-1. I got almot the full range (aout 30-127 which i
plent for the Hammond) in the pedal Monitor page on the Hammond (nice feature). o I am going to
ruh up on m aic electronic chematic reading and modif the pedal to ue TR connector on a
ingle cale. And the nice thing aout it i that it’ a tereo pedal- it ha a dual pot o I can make it a
doule CV pedal- jut ecaue I can! Thi will work well enough for rehearal.
RPLY
Hi everone, I´ve een thinking aout how to ue m old Zoom FP01 expreion pedal with m two
trmon pedal.
o, I´ve ought a tereo 1/4 inch “Y” plitter adapter to two 1/4 tereo jack, thi:
http://www.amazon.com/Monoprice-6-35mm-tereo-plitter-
Adaptor/dp/0069M5U6C/ref=pd_im__e_1
Then, I connected the tereo plug into the expreion pedal input, and ue two tereo (or tr cale) to
connect m pedal into the two tereo jack of the adapter.
I´m not ure if I ma damage m Flint and l Capitan on the long run, ut the´re working fine now,
can omeone tell me if i´m doing omething ver tupid or kind of clever?
Cheer!
RPLY
@Jerem, there’ no reaon wh that would damage our pedal. Glad to hear that work for ou!
RPLY
Cheer!
RPLY
oth unit will tr to put a contant reference voltage on the ground ide of the pot. If the’re not the
ame voltage (and there i no tandard), one unit will e draining current from the other.
It ma appear to work, ut ou ma e overheating component, cauing them to fail efore their
expected lifetime. M gue i if ou have thi prolem, one of the unit might not how the full range of
MIDI value.
ven without thi prolem, ou’d proal e introducing a ground loop, which might leak a audile
noie into the audio chain.
The other trick of uing a tereo pedal would e far etter.
Given that Rick from trmon aure u thi i OK with thoe pedal, then the’re apparentl iolated to
avoid ground loop, and the’d e uing the ame reference voltage o current drain wouldn’t e a
prolem. ut I wouldn’t do thi with aritrar gear, or two unit from different manufacturer (even if one
of them i a trmon).
RPLY
@Learjeff jut wanted to jump in here and make a few point. Thank for the input the wa!
You aid: oth unit will tr to put a contant reference voltage on the ground ide of the pot.
We actuall put out a reference voltage on the ring ut there i a 1k Ohm erie reitance.
You aid: It ma appear to work, ut ou ma e overheating component, cauing them to fail efore
their expected lifetime. M gue i if ou have thi prolem, one of the unit might not how the full
range of MIDI value.
Thi i poile ut unlikel given the 1k impedance. It’ there for all thing that people might do to aue
the output. It doen’t protect from all poile cenario ut hould handle mot.
You aid: ven without thi prolem, ou’d proal e introducing a ground loop, which might leak a
audile noie into the audio chain. The other trick of uing a tereo pedal would e far etter.
RPLY
Thank for the tip! I a TR cale the ame a a regular tereo to two mono Y-cale or i there a
difference? I’m uing uch a cale, which work no matter which of the mono jack I put into in/out. ut
I can’t turn off the expreion pedal, it’ on even if it’ et to “off” in the parameter. Could that e
ecaue of the cale?
RPLY
@teffen, a TR cale tand for Tip, Ring, leeve. The are 1/4″ cale that have two lack and around
the jack a hown in the pic aove. A non Y cale would have that kind of jack on oth end. It’ tough
to a what the iue could e without knowing what kind of expreion pedal ou are uing. mail
upport@trmon.net directl and we can dive in a little deeper and tr to help ou out!
RPLY
I know that thi i an older thread, ut I found that a 250K Jr work great with the Timeline ut the
25K doe not. Anone know wh?
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I jut purchaed a igk and I can’t eem to get thi technique to work. I have the 250K Jr and when
I plug the TR cale in(a hown aove), the rever till come through no matter where the pedal i et
at.
I have teted the pedal and cale eparatel and the oth work. Could I e miing omething?
RPLY
@Michael – Did ou make ure to aign the parameter ou would like to
control with the expreion pedal? Tr following the tep in the following
link if ou have not done o alread:
http://www.trmon.net/upport/faq/how-to-control-dela-time-with-an-
expreion-pedal/
RPLY
Derek William a: March 9, 2014 at 7:41 pm
Hi,
Do ou know if I can ue an rnie all VP JR a an expreion pedal via the midi port? If I were to make a
cutom cale?
Thank!
Derek
RPLY
@Derek – The MIDI port will onl accept MIDI meage which the VP Jr.
doe not have the ailit to do. You would need to ue a dedicated MIDI
controller into the MIDI port or ue the VP Jr a an expreion pedal into
the XP jack onl following the uggetion from thi article.
RPLY
I have een thinking aout the technique of uing the tereo cale with a volume pedal and wa
wondering if the ame et up could e ued, ut intead of a volume pedal, could I ue a channel on a
mixer, which in theor would allow the fader to control parameter jut a the foot pedal would do? I
have an old 4 track recorder that I do not ue, if I could ue it for thi, it would allow eaier control via
the fader intead of acceing variou dipla creen in m eleven rack and / or m Zoom HD16
recorder. I am ding to tr thi, ut don’t want to rik damage to the Avid or Zoom. Thank for an help
ou can give.
RPLY
@cott – I reall don’t think that thi etup would work the ame, if at all,
with our Zoom recorder a that device i much more involved than a
Volume pedal with a treadle pot.
RPLY
What i the pot value that im uppoed to u from the mini-expreion kno? 100k or 250k? Im
running through a igk.
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@Moe Alan – We don’t have the exact pec on hi expreion kno, ut
thoe look like T1M mini-expreion pedal et to 100k-250k tereo. You
hould e fine with 100k.
RPLY
Thank for the info Terr! Jut turned m o Volume FV-100 into an expreion pedal.
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I am intereted to know if thi would work with the rnie all 6165. I ak ecaue it i rated at 500k and
ha dual in’ and out’. I wa thinking it might function a oth a volume pedal and a expreion pedal. If I
deelect the preet with the expreion pedal will I revert to trictl volume? Thank!
RPLY
@Tanner – We have not een ale to tr thi etup with that particular
Volume pedal. If the pedal ha DUAL IN’ and OUT’, and ou et our
connection up for oth expreion pedal and Volume pedal uage, m gue
i that it will control the VOLUM at all time even if ou are onl tring to
ue it for expreion pedal control. You can tr thi out to verif, ut I think
uing it for jut expreion control or jut a volume pedal would e eaier to
manage.
RPLY
I want to ue m FC1010 midi controller expreion pedal. I have tried to do thi, ut without ucce.
HLP PLA
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Doe a TR cale with the plit cale need to e ued pecificall? Or can thi trick e done with a
ingle male to male TR patch cale?
RPLY
@rian – You would need to e ale to plug into oth the INPUT and
OUTPUT of the VOLUM pedal in order for thi to work which i wh thi
plit TR cale i ideal. You can ue a ingle male-to-male TR patch cale a
long a ou alo have the proper adapter to plit the connection for the
INPUT and OUTPUT of the Volume pedal.
RPLY
Hello
I jut ought The rnie all VPJR 6180 to ee how it work. ut then i aw the comment of @Learjeff
aout the et option i a tereo pedal to avoid noie.
Jut to e ure, It i actuall afe? the lat thing that I want i to damage an $449 Moiu, igk
I am having ome noie alread with the configuration. Pream> Prime Ditortion> Volume X
Dulop>Moiu>TimeLine>igk>Deco (allwa On)
hould I ue a tereo Volume Pedal? .
RPLY
@Julio – We do not have a tereo volume pedal to tell the difference, ut
ou can certainl give it a tr. Uing a mono or tereo volume pedal a an
expreion pedal will not harm the trmon pedal.
RPLY
@Hugo, I wonder if ou can help me. I am tring to ue an expreion pedal a a volume pedal (madne
I know, ut are with me). M ultimate goal i to have an expreion pedal running through a Miion
ngineering xpreionator, o that I can have one expreion pedal for 3 other pedal. I wonder if thi
method would work in revere? o plug the TR into an expreion pedal and then the tip into the input
of the volume pedal and the ring into the output of a volume pedal? There i a volume pedal without the
‘foot lever’ noe pedal I wa thinking of uing. If thi trick doe work in revere, I would ue the
expreion pedal into the expreionator and one of the out put eing ued the noe pedal. I have a
real prolem with real etate o having a proper volume pedal and an expreion pedal i not an option.
(I hope I’ve explained melf well?)
RPLY
@Ollie – Thank for checking out the log! I wa not too clear on what ou
are tring to control with thi etup. It ound like ou want to control a
volume pedal with an expreion pedal. Thi would onl work if the volume
pedal ha an expreion input a our audio ignal would till need to pa
through the volume pedal. Pleae email me at upport@trmon.net if ou
have further quetion.
RPLY
@Hugo – Thank for our help. Indeed I am tring to control a volume pedal with an expreion pedal.
You’re aolutel right, the ignal chain end to go through the volume pedal- I can’t elieve I mied
that…. Doh. Thank again for our help.
RPLY
org a: Decemer 27, 2015 at 9:16 am
Hi,
Jut came acro thi great pot and wonder if anod tried thi with ucce uing a Goodrich 120
volume pedal??
Thank in advance for coming ack to me on thi.
org
RPLY
@org – It ma work jut the ame, however, we have never opened one of
thoe up to know for ure. You can tr contacting them to ee if thi i
poile with their volume pedal.
RPLY
o I’ve read thi whole thread looking for a olid anwer on creating a duel expreion pedal. Do ou
think I could ue a tereo volume pedal with two input and two output to imultaneoul work a two
expreion pedal. If a tereo volume pedal i meant to control the left and the right channel with out
mixing them could I aume that I could run two tr-> 2t plitter one on the left and one in the right
going into the two eparate expreion input on two different pedal with out an cro over? I have
four effect on m oard that I want expreion pedal for and I have room for no more than two
expreion pedal. I looked into tr a oxe a expreion plitter ut the claim the can onl run one
pedal at a time and that deelected pedal will automaticall default to toe down function.
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Hi, can i ue volume pedal and expreion pedal at the ame time, with thi cale?
RPLY
@Alexander – Thi cale can onl allow ou to ue a Volume pedal a an
expreion pedal through the INPUT and OUTPUT jack. The Volume pedal
will no longer work a a Volume pedal in thi configuration.
RPLY
Ha anone tried thi with the MXR M300 Rever? Tring to figure it out ut can’t eem to get it to work
with m vp jr.
RPLY
@Daniel J – We have not teted with one of thoe MXR pedal, ut I elieve
that the do ue TR connection. If ou are having troule controlling the
M300 after following the intruction for that pedal, check to ee if ou can
control another pedal that ha TR expreion capailit to ee if the VP jr.
work with an other device when et thi wa.
RPLY
He Daniel J,
An luck with the m300? I have jut emarked on the journe alo.
Hugo,
Do ou have an more advie on thi one?
Thank
RPLY
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Daniel,
Uing the aic etup lited aove worked for me (10k pot with 1k reitor
inline with the output) You might have to look at the internal of our pedal. I
will e gutting mine and intalling thi etup.
Good luck.
RPLY
RPLY
@am – A the luek doe not have an xpreion jack to connect a
pedal to, there i no wa to do thi on the luek pedal.
RPLY
Hello, I’ve een reading the comment aove, and I jut wanted to voice a mall concern of mine.
I am tring to ue a o FV500L (which come with tereo volume control and one expreion control)
to control the expreion of multiple pedal at once. Uing the method decried in thi log pot, I
attached m uual TR cale into one pedal via the FV500L’ expreion port, and then another pedal
uing a cale imilar to the one in the link elow via one of the FV500L’ input/output port (note: i ued
a 1/8″ to 1/4″ adapter to plug it into the pedal).
http://www.amazon.com/Y-Cale-plitter-Computer-Multimedia-
peaker/dp/00ZKM34/ref=r_1_2?=aht&ie=UTF8&qid=1480811299&r=1-
2&keword=+cale+2+T+to+TR
Although I did notice that oth pedal did have a ignal change, I tarted reearching more to ee if thi
et-up wa potentiall damaging to the pedal, and found ome uer aing that it could e harmful
when uing pedal from different companie (i.e. with different electronic configuration). What are our
thought on thi?
Thank
RPLY
@Daniel – We have not come acro an prolem when uing an volume
pedal a an expreion pedal with the adapter ou linked, however, we have
never tried with a pedal uing that method AND it own dedicated
expreion output. If ou have an dout, jut don’t ue it that wa.
RPLY
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Hi everone,
I am jut new to thi volume and expreion pedal tuff.
Could anod help me out whether Morle M2 VC could e ued a oth Volume or xpreion pedal?
If o, what would e the trick to ue it in oth purpoe, Do I need tereo cale or omething or it jut
imple, plug n pla.
Thank ou for anwerwering me.
RPLY
@DP – Not ure if it will work the wa ou like, ut ou can certainl follow
the tep in thi log to ue IN1 and OUT1 for the expreion control, then,
ue IN2 and OUT2 for our ignal to ee if it work a oth expreion and
volume at once.
RPLY
DP a: Feruar 15, 2018 at 10:10 pm
RPLY
Hello!
Tell me, are there an analog of the HOA TP-201 cale? In Ruia, thi cale i not pecificall old(((
What other rand can ou advie? Not all TR cale upport the end / return!
Pleae help me!
THX
RPLY
@gor – That i one option ut not familiar with another rand that offer
thi in that length, epeciall in our countr. I recommend performing a
earch for “1/4 TR Male to Two 1/4 T Male” online to ee if ou can find
thi availale from a local dealer or uine in Ruia.
RPLY
An o called “inert” cale will work, and there are plent availale in Ruia.
Jut ak for an 6.3mm TR to dual 6.3mm T inert cale, and ou’ll e
good.
RPLY
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@cott – Thi will work on an pedal with a TR expreion pedal jack (which
the Pitchfork doe have).
RPLY
I’d like to accomplih omething lightl different. I have an RJM Matermind PC, a Miion ngineering
P1-RJM and 3 trmon Pedal (Moiu, TimeLine, igk). I there an wa at all I can ue m
expreion pedal in conjunction with at leat one of thee trmon Pedal and make it act a a volume
control? (I have no room for anthing ele on m pedaloard)
RPLY
RPLY
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