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Guide to Batteries
Battery Basics: A Layman's Guide to Batteries

If you have done any research on how batteries work or what you should
look for when selecting a battery, you are probably buried in information,
some of which is conflicting. At BatteryStuff, we aim to clear that up a
bit.You have most likely heard the term K.I.S.S. (Keep It Simple, Stupid). I
am going to attempt to explain how lead acid batteries work and what they
need without burying you with a bunch of needless technical data. I have
found that battery data will vary somewhat from manufacturer to
manufacturer, so I will do my best to boil that data down. This means I may
generalize a bit, while staying true to purpose.

The commercial use of the lead acid battery is over 100 years old. The
same chemical principal that is being used to store energy is basically the
same as our Great Grandparents may have used.

If you can grasp the basics you will have fewer battery problems and will
gain greater battery performance, reliability, and longevity. I suggest you
read the entire tutorial, however I have indexed all the information for a
quick read and easy reference.

A battery is like a piggy bank. If you keep taking out and putting nothing
back you soon will have nothing. Present day chassis battery power
requirements are huge. Consider today’s vehicle and all the electrical
devices that must be supplied. All these electronics require a source of
reliable power, and poor battery condition can cause expensive electronic
component failure. Did you know that the average auto has 11 pounds of
wire in the electrical system? Look at RVs and boats with all the electrical
gadgets that require power. It was not long ago when trailers or motor
homes had only a single 12-volt house battery. Today it is standard to have
two or more house batteries powering inverters up to 4000 watts.

Average battery life has become shorter as energy requirements have

increased. Life span depends on usage; 6 months to 48 months, yet only
30% of all batteries actually reach the 48-month mark. You can extend
your battery life by hooking it up to a solar charger during the off months.
A Few Basics

The Lead Acid battery is made up of plates, lead, and lead oxide
(various other elements are used to change density, hardness, porosity,
etc.) with a 35% sulfuric acid and 65% water solution. This solution is
called electrolyte, which causes a chemical reaction that produce
electrons. When you test a battery with a hydrometer, you are measuring
the amount of sulfuric acid in the electrolyte. If your reading is low, that
means the chemistry that makes electrons is lacking. So where did the
sulfur go? It is resting on the battery plates and when you recharge the
battery, the sulfur returns to the electrolyte.
Safety
Battery types, Deep Cycle and Starting
Wet Cell, Gel-Cell and Absorbed Glass Mat (AGM)
CCA, CA, AH and RC; what's that all about?
Battery Maintenance
Battery Testing
Selecting and Buying a New Battery
Battery Life and Performance
Battery Charging
Battery Do's
Battery Don'ts

1. We must think safety when we are working around and with batteries.
Remove all jewelry. After all you don't want to melt your watchband while
you are wearing the watch. The hydrogen gas that batteries make when
charging is very explosive. We have seen several instances of batteries
blowing up and drenching everything in sulfuric acid. That is no fun, and
would have been a good time to use those safety goggles that are hanging
on the wall. Heck, just break out your disco outfit. Polyester is not affected
by Sulfuric Acid, but anything with cotton will be eaten up. If you do not
feel the need to make a fashion statement just wear junk clothes, after all
Polyester is still out of style. When doing electrical work on vehicles it is
best to disconnect the ground cable. Just remember you are messing with
corrosive acid, explosive gases and 100's amps of electrical current.
2. Basically there are two types of lead acid batteries (along with 3 sub
categories); The two main types are Starting (cranking), and Deep Cycle
(marine/golf cart). The starting battery (SLI starting lights ignition) is
designed to deliver quick bursts of energy (such as starting engines) and
therefore has a greater plate count. The plates are thinner and have
somewhat different material composition. The deep cycle battery has less
instant energy, but greater long-term energy delivery. Deep cycle batteries
have thicker plates and can survive a number of discharge cycles. Starting
batteries should not be used for deep cycle applications because the
thinner plates are more prone to warping and pitting when discharged. The
so-called Dual Purpose Battery is a compromise between the two types of
batteries, though it is better to be more specific if possible.

3. Wet Cell (flooded), Gel Cell, and Absorbed Glass Mat (AGM) are various
versions of the lead acid battery. The Wet cell comes in two styles;
Serviceable and Maintenance free. Both are filled with electrolyte and are
basically the same. I prefer one that I can add water to and check the
specific gravity of the electrolyte with a hydrometer. The Gel Cell and the
AGM batteries are specialty batteries that typically cost twice as much as a
premium wet cell. However they store very well and do not tend to sulfate
or degrade as easily as wet cell. There is little chance of a hydrogen gas
explosion or corrosion when using these batteries; these are the safest
lead acid batteries you can use. Gel Cell and some AGM batteries may
require a special charging rate. If you want the best,most versatile type,
consideration should be given to the AGM battery for applications such as
Marine, RV, Solar, Audio, Power Sports and Stand-By Power just to name a
few. If you don't use or operate your equipment daily, AGM batteries will
hold their charge better that other types. If you must depend on top-notch
battery performance, spend the extra money. Gel Cell batteries still are
being sold but AGM batteries are replacing them in most applications.
There is a some common confusion regarding AGM batteries because
different manufactures call them by different names; some of the more
common names are "sealed regulated valve", "dry cell", "non spillable",
and "Valve Regulated Lead Acid" batteries. In most cases AGM batteries
will give greater life span and greater cycle life than a wet cell battery.
SPECIAL NOTE about Gel Batteries: It is very common for individuals to use
the term GEL CELL when referring to sealed, maintenance free batteries,
much like one would use Kleenex when referring to facial tissue or "Xerox
machine" when referring to a copy machine. Be very careful when
specifying a gel cell battery charger, many times we are told by customer
they are requiring a charger for a Gel Cell battery and in fact the battery is
not a Gel Cell.
 AGM: The Absorbed Glass Matt construction allows the
electrolyte to be suspended in close proximity with the plates active
material. In theory, this enhances both the discharge and recharge
efficiency. Common manufacturer applications include high performance
engine starting, power sports, deep cycle, solar and storage battery. The
larger AGM batteries we sell are typically good deep cycle batteries and
they deliver their best life performance if recharged before allowed to drop
below the 50% discharge rate. The Scorpion motorcycle batteries we carry
are a nice upgrade from your stock flooded battery, and the Odyssey
branded batteries are fantastic for holding their static charge over long
periods of non use. When Deep Cycle AGM batteries are discharged to a
rate of no less than 60% the cycle life will be 300 plus cycles.

GEL: The Gel Cell is similar to the AGM style because the electrolyte is
suspended, but different because technically the AGM battery is still
considered to be a wet cell. The electrolyte in a Gel Cell has a silica
additive that causes it to set up or stiffen. The recharge voltage on this
type of cell is lower than the other styles of lead acid battery. This is
probably the most sensitive cell in terms of adverse reactions to
over-voltage charging. Gel Batteries are best used in VERY DEEP cycle
application and may last a bit longer in hot weather applications. If the
incorrect battery charger is used on a Gel Cell battery poor performance
and premature failure is certain.

4. CCA, CA, AH and RC. What are these all about? These are the standards
that most battery companies use to rate the output and capacity of a
battery.

Cold cranking amps (CCA) is a measurement of the number of amps a

battery can deliver at 0 ° F for 30 seconds and not drop below 7.2 volts. So
a high CCA battery rating is especially important in starting battery
applications, and in cold weather.This measurement is not particularly
important in Deep cycle batteries, though it is the most commonly 'known'
battery measurement.

CA is cranking amps measured at 32 degrees F. This rating is also called

marine cranking amps (MCA). Hot cranking amps (HCA) is seldom used
any longer but is measured at 80 ° F.

Reserve Capacity (RC) is a very important rating. This is the number of

minutes a fully charged battery at 80 ° F will discharge 25 amps until the
battery drops below 10.5 volts.
An amp hour (AH) is a rating usually found on deep cycle batteries. The
standard rating is an Amp rating taken for 20 Hours. What this means, say
for a 100 AH rated battery is this: Draw from the battery for 20 hours and
it will provide a total of 100 amp-hours. That translates to about 5 amps
an hour. 5 x 20 = 100. However, it's very important to know that the total
time of discharge and load applied is not a linear relationship. As your load
increases, your realized capacity decreases. This means if you discharged
that same 100 AH battery by a 100 amp load, it will not give you one hour
of runtime. On the contrary, the perceived capacity of the battery will be
that of 64 Amp Hours.

5.Battery Maintenance is an important issue. The battery should be

cleaned using a baking soda and water solution; a couple of table spoons
to a pint of water. Cable connections need to be cleaned and tightened as
battery problems are often caused by dirty and loose connections. A
serviceable battery needs to have the fluid level checked. Use only mineral
free water, Distilled is best as all impurities have been removed, and there
is nothing left that could contaminate your cells. Don't overfill battery cells
especially in warmer weather because the natural fluid expansion in hot
weather can push excess electrolytes from the battery. To prevent
corrosion of cables on top post batteries use a small bead of silicone
sealer at the base of the post and place a felt battery washer over it. Coat
the washer with high temperature grease or petroleum jelly (Vaseline),
then place cable on the post and tighten. Coat the exposed cable end with
the grease. Most folks don't know that just the gases from the battery
condensing on metal parts cause most corrosion.

6. Battery Testing can be done in more than one way. The most
accurate method is measurement of specific gravity and battery voltage. To
measure specific gravity buy a temperature compensating hydrometer, to
measure voltage use a digital D.C. Voltmeter. A quality load tester may be a
good purchase if you need to test sealed batteries.

For any of these methods, you must first fully charge the battery and then
remove the surface charge. If the battery has been sitting at least several
hours (I prefer at least 12 hours) you may begin testing. To remove surface
charge the battery must be discharged for several minutes. Using a
headlight (high beam) will do the trick. After turning off the light you are
ready to test the battery.
State of Charge Specific Gravity Voltage
12V 6V
100% 1.265 12.7 6.3
75% 1.225 12.4 6.2
50% 1.190 12.2 6.1
25% 1.155 12.0 6.0
Discharged 1.120 11.9 6.0

Load testing is yet another way of testing a battery. Load test removes
amps from a battery much like starting an engine would. A load tester can
be purchased at most auto parts stores. Some battery companies label
their battery with the amp load for testing. This number is usually 1/2 of
the CCA rating. For instance, a 500CCA battery would load test at 250
amps for 15 seconds. A load test can only be performed if the battery is
near or at full charge.

The results of your testing should be as follows:

Hydrometer readings should not vary more than .05 differences between
cells.

Digital Voltmeters should read as the voltage is shown in this document.

The sealed AGM and Gel-Cell battery voltage (full charged) will be slightly
higher in the 12.8 to 12.9 ranges. If you have voltage readings in the 10.5
volts range on a charged battery, that typically indicates a shorted cell.

If you have a maintenance free wet cell, the only ways to test are voltmeter
and load test. Any of the maintenance free type batteries that have a built
in hydrometer(black/green window) will tell you the condition of 1 cell of 6.
You may get a good reading from 1 cell but have a problem with other cells
in the battery.

When in doubt about battery testing, call the battery manufacturer. Many
batteries sold today have a toll free number to call for help.

7. Selecting a Battery - When buying a new battery I suggest you purchase

a battery with the greatest reserve capacity or amp hour rating possible. Of
course the physical size, cable hook up, and terminal type must be a
consideration. You may want to consider a Gel Cell or an Absorbed Glass
Mat (AGM) rather than a Wet Cell if the application is in a harsher
environment or the battery is not going to receive regular maintenance and
charging.

Be sure to purchase the correct type of battery for the job it must do.
Remember that engine starting batteries and deep cycle batteries are
different. Freshness of a new battery is very important. The longer a
battery sits and is not re-charged the more damaging sulfation build up
there may be on the plates. Most batteries have a date of manufacture
code on them. The month is indicated by a letter 'A' being January and a
number '4' being 2004. C4 would tell us the battery was manufactured in
March 2004. Remember the fresher the better. The letter "i" is not used
because it can be confused with #1.

Battery warranties are figured in the favor of battery manufactures. Let's

say you buy a 60-month warranty battery and it lives 41 months. The
warranty is pro-rated so when taking the months used against the full
retail price of the battery you end up paying about the same money as if
you purchased the battery at the sale price. This makes the manufacturer
happy. What makes me happy is to exceed the warranty. Let me assure you
it can be done.

8. Battery life and performance - Average battery life has become shorter
as energy requirements have increased. Two phrases I hear most often are
"my battery won't take a charge, and my battery won't hold a charge".
Only 30% of batteries sold today reach the 48-month mark. In fact 80% of
all battery failure is related to sulfation build-up. This build up occurs when
the sulfur molecules in the electrolyte (battery acid) become so deeply
discharged that they begin to coat the battery's lead plates. Before long
the plates become so coated that the battery dies. The causes of sulfation
are numerous. Let me list some for you.

Batteries sit too long between charges. As little as 24 hours in hot weather
and several days in cooler weather.
Battery is stored without some type of energy input.
"Deep cycling" an engine starting battery. Remember these batteries can't
stand deep discharge.
Undercharging of a battery to only 90% of capacity will allow sulfation of
the battery using the 10% of battery chemistry not reactivated by the
incompleted charging cycle.
Heat of 100 plus F., increases internal discharge. As temperatures increase
so does internal discharge. A new fully charged battery left sitting 24 hours
a day at 110 degrees F for 30 days would most likely not start an engine.
Low electrolyte level - battery plates exposed to air will immediately
sulfate.
Incorrect charging levels and settings. Most cheap battery chargers can do
more harm than good. See the section on battery charging.
Cold weather is also hard on the battery. The chemistry does not make the
same amount of energy as a warm battery. A deeply discharged battery
can freeze solid in sub zero weather.
Parasitic drain is a load put on a battery with the key off. More info on
parasitic drain will follow in this document.

There are ways to greatly increase battery life and performance. All the
products we sell are targeted to improve performance and battery life.

An example: Let's say you have "toys"; an ATV, classic car,

antique car, boat, Harley, etc. You most likely don't use these toys 365
days a year as you do your car. Many of these toys are seasonal so they are
stored. What happens to the batteries? Most batteries that supply energy
to power our toys only last 2 seasons. You must keep these batteries from
sulfating or buy new ones. We sell products to prevent and reverse
sulfation. The PulseTech products are patented electronic devices that
reverse and prevent sulfation. Also Battery Equaliser, a chemical battery
additive, has proven itself very effective in improving battery life and
performance. Other devices such as Solar Trickle Chargers are a great
option for battery maintenance.

Parasitic drain is a load put on a battery with the key off. Most vehicles
have clocks, engine management computers, alarm systems, etc. In the
case of a boat you may have an automatic bilge pump, radio, GPS, etc.
These devices may all be operating without the engine running. You may
have parasitic loads caused by a short in the electrical system. If you are
always having dead battery problems most likely the parasitic drain is
excessive. The constant low or dead battery caused by excessive parasitic
energy drain will dramatically shorten battery life. If this is a problem you
are having, check out the Priority Start and Marine Priority Start to prevent
dead batteries before they happen. This special computer switch will turn
off your engine start battery before all the starting energy is drained. This
technology will prevent you from deep cycling your starting battery.

9. Battery Charging - Remember you must put back the

energy you use immediately. If you don't the battery sulfates and that
affects performance and longevity. The alternator is a battery charger. It
works well if the battery is not deeply discharged. The alternator tends to
overcharge batteries that are very low and the overcharge can damage
batteries. In fact an engine starting battery on average has only about 10
deep cycles available when recharged by an alternator. Batteries like to be
charged in a certain way, especially when they have been deeply
discharged. This type of charging is called 3 step regulated charging.
Please note that only special SMART BATTERY CHARGERS using computer
technology can perform 3 step charging techniques. You don't find these
types of chargers in parts stores and Wal-Marts. The first step is bulk
charging where up to 80% of the battery energy capacity is replaced by
the charger at the maximum voltage and current amp rating of the charger.
When the battery voltage reaches 14.4 volts this begins the absorption
charge step. This is where the voltage is held at a constant 14.4 volts and
the current (amps) declines until the battery is 98% charged. Next comes
the Float Step. This is a regulated voltage of not more than 13.4 volts and
usually less than 1 amp of current. This in time will bring the battery to
100% charged or close to it. The float charge will not boil or heat batteries
but will maintain the batteries at 100% readiness and prevent cycling
during long term inactivity. Some Gel Cell and AGM batteries may require
special settings or chargers.

10. Battery Do's

Think Safety First.
Do read entire tutorial
Do regular inspection and maintenance especially in hot weather.
Do recharge batteries immediately after discharge.
Do buy the highest RC reserve capacity or AH amp hour battery that will fit
your configuration.

11. Battery Don'ts

Don't forget safety first.
Don't add new electrolyte (acid).
Don't use unregulated high output battery chargers to charge batteries.
Don't place your equipment and toys into storage without some type of
device to keep the battery charged.
Don't disconnect battery cables while the engine is running (your battery
acts as a filter).
Don't put off recharging batteries.
Don't add tap water as it may contain minerals that will contaminate the
electrolyte.
Don't discharge a battery any deeper than you possibly have to.
Don't let a battery get hot to the touch and boil violently when charging.
Don't mix size and types of batteries.

There are many points and details I have not written about because I
wanted to keep this as short and simple as possible. Further information
can be found at the links below. If you are aware of sites with good battery
maintenance information please let me know.

Additional Battery Tutorial jgdarden.com

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What is the connection to the battery tocharge a 24volt system
Jimmy
January 22, 2012 a 8:06 am
Reply
If you have 2 batteries in series, the voltage increases. The most common
form of 24 volt systems involves two 12 volt batteries connected together,
a wire from the positive terminal of one battery to the negative on the
other. For more information about constructing battery banks, read this
helpful article.
http://www.batterystuff.com/kb/articles/battery-articles/battery-
bank-tutorial.html
If you have a 24 volt charger, you must treat your two 12 volt batteries as if
they were a single battery. The open terminals on both ends would be the
required positive and negative access points.
James
January 23, 2012 a 8:50 am
Reply
This is just what I need to give me confidence in dealing with a battery
issue. Much appreciated.
Desmond
January 18, 2012 a 2:04 pm
Reply
Just to let you know that your battery basics piece was well written and
useful. I appreciate your hard work and your passion for your subject.
Keith Clemens
January 23, 2012 a 7:38 am
Reply
Love it!! Once I read, K.I.S.S. I knew I would understand you! Thanks!
Wendy
October 27, 2013 a 10:35 am
Reply
Over the last 40 years I have puchased endless numbers of leisure
batteries for my caravans none have ever lasted more than 12 mounths
althouth I have charged them regularly.My latest one has just failed after 6
mounths and the manufacturers stamp 15 indicates January 2005 surerly
this must be one of the reasons they do not last the coarse.I have found
out more about batteries since reading Battery Stuff.Com although I am a
retired motor engineer,Well Done.
John Hackney
January 26, 2012 a 11:03 am
Reply
hi this is a common problem, many battery manufacturers make batteries
that they claim are leisure batteries. the advice i will give is that you should
buy a battery with the largest amps as possible that will fit in the space
that you have, in my opinion you should buy an AGM battery as this will
discharge and recover better after use, they are more expensive but should
last much longer. thanks eric roberts www.batteriesontheweb.co.uk
Eric Roberts
March 7, 2012 a 11:41 pm
Reply
AGM batteries do not last much longer than lead acid batteries, if they last
an longer at all.
Jamie
June 14, 2012 a 6:01 pm
Reply
AGM technology is essentially the same as a lead acid battery. The only
difference is the electrolyte is not free to spill, but absorbed. This
eliminates the need to maintain fluid levels, thus preventing a lot of
premature failure caused by reflectance. But maintenance free does not
mean the freedom from having to charge regularly. All lead acid batteries
self discharge, and the best way to see longest life is to keep fully charged
as often as possible. Maybe you‘ve had some bad experiences with AGM
batteries. That‘s unfortunate.
Tech
June 15, 2012 a 8:43 am
Reply
Agreed, if properly maintained, a wet battery will last just about as long as
an AGM battery. BUT, very few people actually do the proper maintenance.
Because AGM batteries are valve-regulated, have a slower self-discharge
rate, recharg faster, etc, etc, they are more resilient than wet batteries and
therefore, in real world use DO last much longer than wet batteries.
Sergio
August 27, 2012 a 12:32 pm
Reply
Is it possible to have 12 volts from a battery and low or weak cca ? Also tell
me if im thinking wrong , but I have theory , that a battery is allot like your
arm , you arm has the 12 volts and the muscles in your arm potentially are
your amps , you can with stand holding weight for a certain amount of time
until you become weak and need to relax for a few moments before you
can “crank” again , would you say that would be a good example if i were
to try and explain how a battery functions to people who don‘t speak
english ?
Larry
January 27, 2012 a 7:15 am
Reply
That is a good example, yes. Some arms have less muscle mass and others
have more. But all the same number of muscles in the arm. 12 volt
batteries all have 6 cells. Each cell is 2 volts. 2 × 6 = 12. But the cells have
plates inside of them. The more plates, the more current can run through,
thus more CCA. Large and small batteries all have 6 cells, but the size and
number of plates can vary greatly. I hope this helps.
James
January 27, 2012 a 9:23 am
Reply
if i could rate your article out of ten, i would give it ten.
very informative alas i did not solve my problem
what is the method of getting a rechargable battery to hold charge,
will short overcharging periods do the trick?
John
January 30, 2012 a 9:31 pm
Reply
If you‘re referring to a rechargeable lead acid battery, then there could be
many reasons why a battery does not “hold a charge”. There could be a
parasitic drain. There could be a short or open cell. There could be an
internal defect such as a weak weld. Or the battery could simply be deeply
discharged, and if you‘re using a smart charger, find that the charger
simply will not charge the dead battery. This is primarily due to the low
voltage safety disconnect found in most microprocessor controlled
chargers.
James
January 31, 2012 a 7:44 am
Reply
Very important article on rechargeable batteries.
We are planning to install Lead Gel batteries in our AS/RS equipments.
Shall we go for Lead Gel or AGM type of batteries ? Why ? Give us
advantages in terms of cost & safety while selecting the type of battery.
Pls help us to decide.
thanks
JAYANTI
February 2, 2012 a 3:31 am
Reply
Hello,
Gel and AGM batteries are both nice because of the maintenance free
nature and sealed case. The Gels are able to deep discharge better (well,
with less negative effects than the AGM). However, the Gel battery requires
a compatible charger/regulator. Normal wet cels and AGM batteries
effectively charge at 14.6 volts or higher. But the Gel battery should be no
more than 14.2 volts. It really does make a difference. They are more
fragile and can be damaged easier when charging.
For more information, please read GEL Vs. AGM.
http://www.batterystuff.com/kb/battery-articles/gel-vs-agm.html
James Ville
February 2, 2012 a 8:31 am
Reply
Hi, I have an older 4 ×4 truck with no electronics. However, I have an
inverter to power (mainly laptops, gadgets), two external lights but no
winch. My current alternator is rated at 75amps and my current battery at
80ams / CCA 780 / CR 120. I want to install a split batteyr system
(solenoid+monitor) along with another batter (same power or slightly
higher). Do I need to upgrade my alternator.. say to a 100 amps? Can a
75amp alternator comfortably charge both batteries..given than I‘m using
a “smart” split battery charging system? or am I asking for trouble….ie: a
dead alternator? Thanks
Bert
February 4, 2012 a 5:19 pm
Reply
You would be best off going with the larger alternator. 75 amps may be
enough, but upgrading to the 100 amp system would make sense.
Jeremy
February 6, 2012 a 2:40 pm
Reply
Two weeks ago I purchased a new car Buick Enclave that had been on the
lot for an extended period of time. Everything seemed to be fine until I took
a long trip (10hrs). The next morning I used the remote start to warm up
the car then turned it off and continued to load the car using the remote
hatch lift several times. About ten minutes later I got in the car and didn‘t
have enough battery to start it. I was able to get a boost to start the
engine and return home (10hrs). I took the car to the dealer the next
morning to have it checked out and was told the battery was good as it
checked out at 12.3 volts. Doesn‘t that show a discharged battery? Should
the charging system maintain the battery at 12.6 to 12.8 volts? The next
step is to have the electrical output checked. I would appreciate your input
as to what I should have them check next. Thanks
Bob G
February 9, 2012 a 2:20 pm
Reply
Hello Bob,
You are correct. The battery should be reading more than 12.3 volts. If the
battery cannot reach over 12.6 volts, then there is likely a sulfation
problem. the more sulfation on the plates, the less surface area. in turn,
that results to less power and pre-mature failure.
James Ville
February 9, 2012 a 2:50 pm
Reply
Optimum battery voltage is 12.6 volts at 70 farenheit. Specific gravity and
voltage will drop with temperature. 12.3 is a good voltage. What the
battery loads down to is more important.
Lester Cheeks
November 10, 2014 a 10:07 pm
Reply
hi I am extremely interested in the subject and would like to thank you for
clearing up a few things that i had previously not known.
Denise Keilholtz
February 14, 2012 a 4:31 pm
Reply
hey, i am trying to charge 2 deep cycles in parallel with a 6 amp charger
(12v) is this any diffrent than charging a single?
Kris F
February 16, 2012 a 1:10 am
Reply
When you charge 2 deep cycle batteries in parallel, you’ve essentially
doubled your capacity. The charger will recognize your battery bank as a
single battery. If your 6 amp charger took 4 hours to charge one battery, it
will now take 8 to charge both. The resistance has increased with the
increase in capacity, so it will take longer to charge. As for the
connections, you can hook your charger to the positive and negative
terminal from one battery or both. For a 2 battery system, it doesn’t make
a difference.
James
February 16, 2012 a 8:32 am
Reply
“The resistance has increased with the increase in capacity,” Not so,
resistances in parallel decrease. It takes longer to charge because you are
charging two batteries at the same time instead of one.
Paul
April 15, 2012 a 8:49 am
Reply
Resistance is based on the internal battery chemistry. It‘s not constant, but
it relates to the strength of the charge rate versus the state of charge in
the batteries. Two batteries in parallel will indeed lower the resistance. The
charge time may not be quicker, but it will be more efficient.
Tech
April 16, 2012 a 11:03 am
Reply
I have a few questions about sulfation removal.
1. How can a person determine how much sulfation has occurred inside a
battery?
2. Which de-sulfation device do you most highly recommend to remove
sulfation from battery plates?
3. How much time is required to fully de-desulfate a battery? If the
de-sulfation device isn‘t capable of fully de-sulfating a battery, can you let
me know how much de-sulfation such a device can provide.
Thx, Z
Z
February 17, 2012 a 4:37 am
Reply
1)There is no exact way to determine the amount of sulfation, but a
hydrometer is helpful. By telling the specific gravity, you can determine the
strength of the electrolyte. Typically, the more sulfation on the plates, the
weaker the strength of electrolyte. If you have sealed batteries, a
hydrometer will not work.
2)If you have a flooded battery, I recommend using Battery Equalizer in
conjunction with a pulsing charging, such as Battery MINDer or PulseTech.
Exact model will depend on the capacity of your battery.
3)You’ll see the most dramatic results after about 2 weeks of continuous
pulsing. The harder, crystallized sulfate which took a long time to build up
may take an additional 2 months before reaching a another restore point.
On average, a de-sulfated battery may be restored up to 80% of its original
factory capacity.
James
February 17, 2012 a 9:58 am
Reply
I am purchasing a 125 watt solar panel and want to purchase two 12 volt
RV batteries.I dry camp alot and want to be able to maximize my reserve
capacity using the solar charging to replenish the drain on the batteries.
My question is what size battery re the 20 hr amp rating would you
recommend using two twelves and AGM or Gel? I do not winter camp so
majority of use is April to Oct. Apprecite your expertise.
Thanks TP
Todd
February 22, 2012 a 6:21 pm
Reply
If want to size the batteries, you will need to know your load amount. If you
have this, please use our Sizing a 12 Volt Battery to a Load Calculator
found here:
http://www.batterystuff.com/kb/tools/calculator-sizing-a-battery-
to-a-load.html
If your solar controller has a gel profile, then having a gel battery is not a
problem. They can deep discharge better than AGM, but are more
expensive.
James Ville
February 23, 2012 a 12:01 pm
Reply
Great informative article. Just wondered if you or any of your readers have
experienced or heard of problems with BMW automobile batteries? This is
a well know and documented issue by many BMW owners and dealers? Due
to the inordinate number of battery life failures BMW no longer honors
their new car battery warranty. By downloading historical information from
the automobile‘s computer the dealer will look for any excuse for blaming
the problem on the car owner, e.g., leaving the door open, leaving the key
in the car, or not driving the car for several weeks. It seems to me that
BMW has a problem with parasitic drain on their cars from about the time
that the 2008 models came out. The car computer remains active when the
engine is off, still controlling functions that I cannot explain. BMW has not
compensated for this parasitic drain by installing a heaver duty (more Amp
Hours) battery. I can‘t believe their engineers are this ignorant. An easy
saluting would be to parallel two batteries but this would increase the cost
of the vehicle by several hundred dollars. That is probably why BMW has
taken no action to correct the problem. It is possible that other automobile
manufacturers have similar problems. My opinion is that if new batteries
cannot be designed to compensate for the heavy parasitic drain then the
manufactures need to install two parallel batteries or come up with
procedures to connect an external battery trickle changer when the car is
parked overnight.
John C
February 23, 2012 a 5:43 pm
Reply
That‘s a good suggestion. A Trickle Charger is the best step to take in
extending the life of the battery. It‘s less expensive than a new battery,
that‘s for sure.
James Ville
February 24, 2012 a 7:49 am
Reply
BMW cars and some Mercedes Benz have had issues with on board
computers,after disconnecting the engine heater wiring and computer
reset the problem was solved. Disconnect the battery,disconnect the heater
wiring at engine, reconnect battery, turn on ignition 20 seconds, turn off.
Then start engine, if no startyou have to reconnect the wiring on some
models warning fault light will stay on for some time. Our workshop solved
most problems.
Over sophisticated temp (seats, engine) and security sensors and free
radical computer connections can create the power use problem. If you
can find a reset button/or code it helps.
Keith Vanderee
June 25, 2014 a 1:29 am
Reply
Good advice, thanks!
Tech
June 25, 2014 a 9:00 am
Reply
I‘m shopping for a couple of off-grid batteries , I‘m curious when
purchasing a new battery, what is the typical warranty length, in case you
bought a dud that was sitting in the heat in storage for 12 months. Thanks,
great info BTW
Yancy
February 24, 2012 a 11:33 am
Reply
All of our batteries have their warranties listed on the product pages.
Typical warranties start at 1 year for most of our powersports batteries.
Shorai and Odyssey high performance batteries have 2 year warranties.
James Ville
February 24, 2012 a 11:56 am
Reply
I have an interesting battery question for AGM battery charging. I recently
purchased a 12 volt 7 amp battery for my roboduck, I used my older 1/2
amp charger adn about two hours later, I noticed the battery had a puddle
of clear water around it‘s base. It was acid! How on earth could a glass
matt battery generate that much fluid (about 1/4 cup). I did nto even think
there was that much fluid in the battery! What is going on?
Tom Z
February 29, 2012 a 9:55 am
Reply
AGM batteries are sealed. If there is a large pool of electrolyte, there must
be an opening in the case. If the liquid is not coming from the ventilation
holes on the top, there must be physical damage elsewhere, possible near
the base.
The electrolyte in the battery is absorbed, but it can be forced out if there
is enough pressure in the case or if it hasn‘t had time to fully absorb (for
instance, it if was a freshly activated battery).
James Ville
February 29, 2012 a 10:04 am
Reply
I have a Sportster scooter which is seven years old and has two 12V deep
cell GEL type batteries. It has been used very little. These batteries won‘t
take a charge. When I disconnect them to read the voltage I get 11 volts
on one and 13 volts on the other. Gel types (80AH) for this unit are super
expensive.
(1)Could I try to replace the 11 volt battery only, presuming its a dead
cell?
(2)Would you recommend that I replace these batteries with two AGM
batteries with a comparable AH rating? Can I use the same charger on
these batteries?
(3) Any other way out of this dilemma, such as using a maintenance-free
lead acid battery with a comparable AH?
Thanks very much, John
Thanks very much
John Paciorek
March 2, 2012 a 6:07 am
Reply
1) If you‘re reading 11 volts, there is no short or dead cell. It‘s much less
expensive purchasing a de-sulfator unit to restore the battery than to buy a
new one. If the batteries are still holding a charge, they can be restored.
2) If you do decide to upgrade to AGM, your Gel charger will work.
Commonly, AGM batteries charge best at a higher voltage, but those
chargers would damage the Gel.
3) When creating a battery bank, it‘s recommended to use batteries of the
same voltage, AH rating, and type. 80AH AGM batteries will work for your
system just fine, but good battery maintenance is still recommended,
regardless of the battery chemistry type.
James Ville
March 2, 2012 a 9:29 am
Reply
How is that one would determine that an 11 volt reading is not associated
with a shorted cell?
Ranger
June 19, 2012 a 11:20 am
Reply
11 volts cannot be a short cell, as each cell can read 2 volts or more.
Therefore, a battery with a short cell typically reads 10.5 volts or less. But
an open cell is different. This has to do with a weld piece disconnecting
under the load, and voltage usually drops significantly or sometimes
flatlines when this happens.
Tech
June 20, 2012 a 12:41 pm
Reply
Hi, I have four 6 volt house batteries for my RV. We do some warm weather
dry camping. How low should I let the voltage drop before recharging with
the generator? Thanks, Rick
Rick Echols
March 2, 2012 a 9:06 am
Reply
Lead Acid Batteries, doesn‘t matter the voltage, should never be left to
drop in voltage. That is only common practice with NiCD batteries.
Discharging your batteries severely before recharging them will cause
sulfation and early battery failure. The healthiest thing to do is keep them
fully charged as often as possible.
James Ville
March 2, 2012 a 9:11 am
Reply
So how can I expect to be able to use my house batteries for dry camping
without losing any voltage? I would think that I should be able to use my
lights inside and radio without runnung my generator. I don‘t want to have
to run my generator all the time.
Rick Echols
March 2, 2012 a 9:25 am
Reply
Losing voltage is normal. Good battery maintenance is as follows:
Re-charge battery at the soonest possible after using the battery. When
drawing from the battery, avoid discharging below 50% capacity. This is
the danger of having a battery sit in storage for months at a time. You will
see early battery failure. Charging regularly or keeping a trickle charger is
the best solution.
Surely batteries are meant to be used. But the myth of “battery memory”
does not apply to lead acid batteries. It is not healthy, and unnecessary, to
discharge all the way and recharge again.
James Ville
March 2, 2012 a 9:35 am
Reply
Thank you James, for all the great information!
Ive got an electric scooter (xtreme xb-600) and need to replace the
12v22ah SLA. Ive looked around and was told that the EVX12200 or
EVH12240 Deep Cycle Battery would be the way to go.
Your opinion would be muched valued and appreciated!
Eagleye
March 5, 2012 a 5:33 pm
Reply
Yes, those batteries will work as they are the same dimensions as any 12
volt 22 AH SLA Battery. The difference between the EVX12200 and the
EVH12240 is AH rating. The higher the AH, the more runtime you‘ll have.
James Ville
March 6, 2012 a 8:46 am
Reply
James, this is a great site! Maybe you can help me: I have 3 8D AGM marine
batteries on my boat with a xantrex charging system. The boatyard said
they would plug the boat in over the winter in the warehouse but did not.
Nor did they shut the breakers off. So, the batteries were depleted to zero
over the last 5 months. How can I tell what damage was done? How can I
calculate the liability the boatyard has?
Greg White
March 8, 2012 a 4:21 pm
Reply
While it‘s difficult to quantify the damage, I have some recommendations.
First, you should take a voltage reading from the batteries. If indeed you‘re
reading 0 volts (which is unlikely) then I would try to charge them with a
low voltage start charger ASAP. Most automatic chargers have a cut-off
voltage of 6.5 volts before they will start. This prevents you from bringing
back severely discharged batteries. Interacter makes a charger that starts
charging with a reading as low a 1-2 volts.
Second, sulfation has most definitely occurred, so I would also advise
putting a de-sulfator unit on the batteries as well, such as the OBD12V. If
these do not bring the battery back to working condition, then I would
suggest the batteries have passed the point of no return.
James Ville
March 9, 2012 a 9:30 am
Reply
hi all i bought a AGM battery for my kawasaki vn 1500, great more ca,s no
probs with it until i went overseas to work and made the mistake of leaving
the ignition switch turned to park!, THIS in turn left the rear lamp
illuminated, returned back home 6 weeks later ZILCH,visited my local bike
guru in redcar he put slow charges, then fast charges into it over a period
of two days, its gone from an initial reading of 0.3 v to a steady 12.9, hope
this helps the guy with the boat.
Knobby Ions
May 8, 2012 a 8:53 am
Reply
Hey, that‘s great that your batteries came back! 12.9 is very good voltage.
Thanks for sharing!
Tech
May 8, 2012 a 9:59 am
Reply
Wonderful article. Just had a question though.
How does one test SMF batteries on-site for e.g. Server UPS batteries. ?
The test-gig should be portable though.
Phyleus
March 12, 2012 a 3:30 am
Reply
What do you need to test for? Voltage readings with a volt meter is always
helpful. This gives you a good idea of the state of charge of the batteries. A
Load tester is good for measuring CCA and durability under a load. Even
our comprehensive digital battery conductance analyzer is portable. All of
our testing units are located in the Battery Accessories category on our
website. See for yourself. :)
James Ville
March 12, 2012 a 11:58 am
Reply
hello Jamie, I am currently working on a research about Solar- hybrid
off-grid instalations,
I have my battery amp hour for 20hrs discharge but i need the battery to
store enuf cahrge for 3 days, so ut is trippled, do i still use the C20 rating
or do i use the C72hrs rating for it? i am confused. and the needed Current
is about 6000Amp-hour
Jummy
March 13, 2012 a 2:49 am
Reply
If you parallel your batteries, the capacity (AH) will increase. The rating will
still be at 20 hrs, but the number will triple.
If you have your batteries and draw amount, please use our battery
calculators to help you figure out how long they will last, or if you need
another battery based on your load.
http://www.batterystuff.com/kb/tools/
James Ville
March 13, 2012 a 9:14 am
Reply
Next time simple is enough…..
Deron
March 12, 2012 a 10:16 am
Reply
Very good overview of lead-acid batteries. How do I submit a question?
What type of sealed lead-acid battery would a handicap scooter likely have:
AGM or Gel? I need to know in order to select the right charging mode for a
Schauer automatic charger.
Mel Schallot
March 12, 2012 a 10:46 am
Reply
Mobility Scooters use both AGM and Gel batteries. I cannot verify what you
have. However, if you‘re unsure, I recommend using the Gel setting. This is
a lower voltage that is safe for gel, but the AGM will accept it also. It‘s the
other way around that is not recommended.
James Ville
March 13, 2012 a 11:56 am
Reply
Fantastic information. Thanks so much for your service to those of us
struggling to understand through all the hype. My question is for a marine
application. I have a bank of 4 Trojan lead acid batteries for my house bank
and another lead acid starter battery. My starter battery died and I‘d like to
replace it with a maintanence-free option but have heard not to mix battery
types. I‘m not ready to replace the Trojans, so should I just buy another
lead-acid starter to tide me over until my Trojans die? Thanks for any
suggestions you can give.
Toni Roddey
March 13, 2012 a 2:19 pm
Reply
If your starter battery is not connected to the house bank, then it‘s fine to
upgrade it to a sealed type. You can even use the same charger if you go
with an AGM. Within a battery bank it‘s recommended to use the same
battery type. Because your boat draws from the house bank and the
starting batteries separately, then you‘re okay.
James Ville
March 13, 2012 a 3:28 pm
Reply
have a 6 volt dry cell batt. in a old bike. is there a way of protecting the
batt. from being over charged? thank you for your time..
Gary
March 17, 2012 a 6:33 am
Reply
The best method to preventing battery from being overcharged is to use a
micro-proccessor controlled “smart” automatic battery charger. If the bike
itself is over-charging, then there is a problem with the bike‘s charging
system, the stator.
James Ville
March 19, 2012 a 11:06 am
Reply
Thank you for the excellent article and taking the time to answer
everyone‘s questions. I want to install a dual battery system in a small car
that has an 80 amp alternator. The 2nd battery will be dedicated to one
appliance that has a low current draw. A small deep cycle AGM like those
used in mobility scooters will do the trick (about 35 Ah). I don‘t want to
upgrade the alternator but I also don‘t want to overly stress the one I‘ve
got by having it regularly recharge a battery that is often going to be
drained close to max (50 percent). Is there a way that I can limit the
current to the second battery so that it charges at 10 to 15 amps? That
would be equivalent to driving with lights on and so I know it would not
have a big negative effect on the alternator as long as I am not using the
lights.
Bill Smith
March 18, 2012 a 12:40 am
Reply
If you want to charge your vehicle‘s starting battery as well as a separate
auxiliary battery, I recommend using the Battery Isolator Switch
(Bi303303). Having a 35 AH spare battery should not be too much for your
80 amp alternator. It‘s an automatic device, there is no “preset” amperage
setting. The charge allocated to the batteries really depends on the status
of each one. With the rise in resistance in one battery, charge will be
directed to the other until they are both stable and full.
James Ville
March 20, 2012 a 11:46 am
Reply
Hi,
I only use my car on weekends. My question is: Can I use a Smart Charger
whenever the car is stopped? This will not overcharge the battery?
My car has an AGM battery.
Thanks in advance for your help.
Cain
March 18, 2012 a 11:55 am
Reply
If you use an AC charger, parking the car and turning off the engine is fine.
If you are refereing to a solar charger, it‘s also designed to charge the
battery, not only when the car is stopped, but the engine is off as well.
Plugging a smart charger on the car during the weekdays is very healthy
for the battery. No overcharging if you make sure the charger is fully
automatic. Our chargers are. :)
James Ville
March 19, 2012 a 11:30 am
Reply
The article above suggests you know what you‘re talking about. I don‘t
know jack, but have read a little online and am trying to use a deep-cycle
battery to power a projector for a public art project. Any chance you‘re
available to help me trouble-shoot? I borrowed a neighbor‘s charger and
charged a brand new battery up for about 15 hours. I then hooked up a
1000watt inverter and plugged the projector in. It worked great, for about
25 minutes, but then just died with a Low Voltage error message. Does this
mean the battery wasn‘t charged all the way or am I doing something else
wrong? According to the projector specs, the max wattage it uses is 288.
Would really appreciate any input you‘ve got. I‘m out of my league here.
Shawn
March 19, 2012 a 12:04 pm
Reply
Based on the information you provided, you‘re drawing around 23 amps
from a 12 volt battery. That‘s a lot of juice since it‘s a constant draw, not a
quick burst. Without any information about the battey itself, or the charger,
I cannot determine what the problem was.
If the battery did not have the capacity to handle the load, you may need
something with more AH (Amp Hours). It might be helpful if you run your
numbers through our calculators.
http://www.batterystuff.com/kb/tools/
Or give our tech guys a call at 541-474-4421
James Ville
March 19, 2012 a 12:58 pm
Reply
Awesome article – thanks. I have a question.
I have a YP17-12 (12V17AH) Maintenance Free Lead Acid battery in my
Bushranger Power Tank (for jump starting). It‘s was showing over 12 volts
after about 10 hours at 1 amp. I tried to load test (it failed) and it‘s now
just under 12 volts. It has a plastic strip which when I popped it off with a
screwdriver there were little caps on each filling hole. Can I add distilled
water to it even if it had gel. I up-ended it with caps off over a container
and not a single drop of liquid came out making me think it is not a wet
acid type. Your thoughts would be greatly appreciated.
Andrew D-H
March 20, 2012 a 5:22 am
Reply
If the battery is indeed maintenance free, it is not designed to be opened
and water added. Low voltage is not a result of low fluid levels, in this case.
A fully charged battery should read 13.2-12.8 volts. If you read 12.0 or
12.2 volts, that‘s severely discharged. If you load test at this poin, you‘ll
only further discharge the battery. I recommend putting the battery on a
charger immediately and load testing once it‘s fully charged.
If the battery is draining rapidly in 10 hours at 1 amp, I recommend you
use our online tools to calculate if that‘s a good size battery for that
amount of draw, or if the draw time should be shortened for the sake of the
battery.
http://www.batterystuff.com/kb/tools/
James Ville
March 20, 2012 a 10:54 am
Reply
Thank you for that info. Well meaning folks online were driving me nuts
telling me that a deep cycle battery that is often discharged to 50 percent
will greatly shorten the life of a small alternator. But I couldn‘t find any info
like that at a reputable web site and I‘m glad to hear it isn‘t really true. I
had been looking at a VSR (voltage sensitive relay) for the part of the
wiring you mentioned. These (I guess they are all the same) charge the
starting battery first and then switch the charging current to the auxiliary
battery. Does the isolator you mentioned work that way? If not, which
method do you think is best. I know the companies that make the VSR
devices are always touting the fact that there is no voltage drop with their
devices which I gather there is with a device that uses a solenoid.
Bill Smith
March 23, 2012 a 11:27 am
Reply
James,
I have a boat with 2 cyl diesel engine and currently 2 series 27 wet
batteries set as two banks. I would like to add another 2 batteries because
the engine does not start easily when cold. The question is whether it is
advisable to mix AGM‘s as one bank with wet cells as the other. I would like
to change to AGM‘s, but hate to lose the investment already made in the
two wet batteries. For starting, I do have a standard A/B or BOTH as a
switching option for the banks.
Rich
March 28, 2012 a 7:23 am
Reply
When constructing battery banks, it‘s highly recommened to use batteries
of the same type (Flooded, AGM, Gel), voltage, AH rating, and even age.
Although you can technically build your banks by adding AGM batteries,
having these differences will cause an inbalance of discharge and
recharging.
James Ville
March 28, 2012 a 8:01 am
Reply
A very useful site, and highly informative – well done!
I have two flooded lead acid for my domestic bank, and have added a small
AGM for the engine start. The mains charger can be configured for one
type or the other – in my situation would it be better to set the charger to
AGM type?
bob
Bobby
March 31, 2012 a 6:46 am
Reply
From our experience, Flooded and AGM batteries can be charged at the
same charge voltages. It should be safe either way.
Tech
April 2, 2012 a 8:16 am
Reply
Excellent information. Thanks.
Just bought a DieHard Platinum Marine Group 31 for my boat. The reviews
on this battery are excellent and I plan to use it for both starting the boat
and running the trolling motor. You mentioned needing a special charger
for AGM batteries. I have a Stanley BC4009 40 amp 3 stage charger. Is this
charger OK to use with the AGM battery? Do I have to disconnect the
battery from the power cables to charge it? Thanks for your help!
Chad
April 7, 2012 a 1:16 pm
Reply
AGM Batteries can be charged with most standard chargers. It‘s the Gel
batteries that require a special charge profile. If you charge your battery,
you don‘t have to disconnect the power cables as long as the battery isn‘t
being used while you charge it, unless your charger is also a power supply.
If you draw on the battery while the charger is turned on, the charger will
attempt to supply the demand.
Tech
April 9, 2012 a 9:23 am
Reply
Well then, if a modern automobile with all it‘s current drawing electronics is
to be charged using a smart charger, are you suggesting that the cables be
disconnected while charging the battery? What difference would it make if
cables were left on during the charging process? Thanx
John
August 17, 2012 a 2:03 pm
Reply
Having the battery connected to the vehicle will cause a slight discharge as
a result of the electronics. But normally it‘s not much. A charger will stil
charge just fine but if the draw amount of the car is excessive, it can cause
the charger to become less efficient.
Tech
August 17, 2012 a 2:20 pm
Reply
Lots of good stuff here—-and well written so that weekend mechanics like
me can understand it. I have a 36v Western Golf Car with 2 year old
batteries. The charger came with the car and I recharge after every use.
None-the-less, two cells have failed on each of two of the batteries. Your
article recommended that I should not ‘mix and match’ batteries, but I
would like to replace the two failing batteries with new ones to get another
year or so out of the remaining 4 old batteries. They cost about $125 each
so my fix would invest $250 now to stave off a $750 pay out for another
year. Bottom line: If I follow your advice, I replace all batteries at the same
time and chuck 4 fairly good batteries (with no resale value). Is there a
middle ground—-such as using some of your products to bring the two
batteries back to service??
Tom
April 9, 2012 a 4:38 am
Reply
The choice is yours. The reason we recommend using batteries of the same
age is because you will see overall better performance and lifespan of the
whole bank if you do this. But if you feel it‘s not practical, you buying 2 new
batteries will make your bank work and it might be just fine for you. It‘s not
optimal, but it makes more sense. If your old batteries have shot cells,
there is no product that can reverse that.
Tech
April 9, 2012 a 9:35 am
Reply
I have a 12 volt portable battery (Sears Diehard Portable Power 1150) that
I use for car camping trips and the occasional jumpstart. I wasn‘t keeping
it charged all the time and the battery finally wouldn‘t take a charge
anymore. So I was convinced to replaced it with a deep cycle agm battery.
After reading your article, it seems apparent that I should not have used a
deep cycle because it‘s not appropriate for jumpstarts. However, I have
also found that after the first time I used the battery for a weekend of
camping, I had drained it down to 10% and now it will not charge. Is it
possible that the unit is not compatible with deep cycle batteries, or is it
more likely that I overdrained it and the unit isn‘t registering a battery to
charge? I was told that I can connect this unit to my car battery (or any
other charged 12 volt battery) and that should trick the unit into charging
the battery. What do you think?
Budge
April 10, 2012 a 12:27 pm
Reply
Deep Cycle batteries have CCA ratings as well. However, for the same
physical size battery, if you compare it to a starting battery, the CCA will be
much less. But a deep cycle battery is fairly common in jumpstarts because
they are also used as 12 volt power sources and some even have built in
inverters for AC power. The batteries in the units are large enough where
the CCA can jump start a car. In doing so, 25% of the battery‘s capacity
can be drained just like that. If batteries read severely low voltage, most
automatic chargers have trouble charging. Connecting another battery in
parallel with the drained battery is a good method of bypassing the “low
voltage disconnect” filter of the charger.
Tech
April 10, 2012 a 2:06 pm
Reply
Virgin lead vs. recycled lead?
Is there a life span difference between batteries constructed with virgin
lead compared to one made with recycled batteries, assuming that all
other conditions are equal? If there is a difference, is it a noticeable one?
Frank
April 16, 2012 a 9:30 am
Reply
Yes. Batteries made from virgin-lead perform better and will last longer.
High performance batteries, such as Odyssey, also have 2 year warranties.
Tech
April 16, 2012 a 11:19 am
Reply
Hello,
I asked a question a few weeks ago and have been looking for a reply. My
question is about running LED lights on a 12v vs a 24 volt system. I have
17 lights that are 27 watts each and want to get the maximum runtime. I
have seen your calculators but do not have all the imput parameters. The
batteries I am thinking about are deep cycle with 210 reserve capacity.
Thanks.
Bill
April 16, 2012 a 1:15 pm
Reply
My question is this: what voltage are those lights rated for? If it doesn‘t
say on the lights, you should find out by calling the maker. It‘s important to
keep the voltage the same. Running a 12 volt rated LED light bulb will blow
up if you use 24 volts (2 batteries in series). Maximum runtime is ensured
not my increasing the volatge amount, but the capacity (Amp Hours).
Tech
April 16, 2012 a 2:34 pm
Reply
I have a question. I purchased a Minn Kota Endura 50 trolling motor 2nd
hand. It‘s for an aluminum fishing boat I have access to once a year for a
week. I‘m a casual fisherman who takes the boat out maybe for an hour a
day. I bought a deep cycle AGM 12 Volt 12 amp hour with a charger for
agm and gel batteries. I had trouble finding what kind of draw the trolling
motor places on the battery at the Minn Kota site. Did I buy an undersized
battery for my causal usage?
Dave
April 20, 2012 a 3:29 pm
Reply
Speaking from experience with other customers with trolling motors, I
can‘t imagine the motor pulling anything less than 15 amps/hour from the
battery. A 12 AH battery would not be able to supply more than 1/2 hour
of power to the motor, if even that much. A larger capacity deep cycle
battery would be highly recommened.
Tech
April 20, 2012 a 4:10 pm
Reply
I was afraid of that. Any suggestions as to what would fill my needs but
would not be overbuying for what I do? I see some of the deep cycles run
$400 or more. I don\‘t think I need that much power. Thanks for your
reply. Obviously I\‘m new to making these calculations and a little leery of
just walking into a store and having them sell me something.
Dave
April 21, 2012 a 4:42 am
Reply
If the motor drew at a rate of 15 amps an hour, I recommend using a group
size 24 marine battery. This 12 volt, ~75 Amp Hour battery should give you
2 hours of uninterrupted runtime, and only discharge the battery to the
safe 50% capacity remaining. We sell these batteries for $200-250.
Tech
April 23, 2012 a 8:46 am
Reply
i might have missed this in the article but, why is it not recommended to
mix battery sizes, and not to mix battery types?
cheers
Trev
April 23, 2012 a 9:51 pm
Reply
Batteries of different types and sizes will charge and discharge unevenly.
When batteries are configured in parallel or series (or both) they behave as
a single unit. If there is an imbalance it could mean a shortening of overall
battery life, as well as potential harm in recharging.
Tech
April 24, 2012 a 11:49 am
Reply
Great info, my battery died today, so, the AAA guy said that my old battery
was below 12.5 volts and that it wouldn‘t have or hold the amps?? what
does this mean
Jack Gilbert
May 5, 2012 a 8:09 pm
Reply
12.5 volts is partially discharged, 70% capacity remaining. When a battery
is put under a load and there are no “amps” going through, it‘s usually a
result of an open cell. The intense heat of a load can cause a separation in
a cell connector, and this will cause current to decline or cease entirely. But
when the load if taken off, the metal cools enough to touch and give a false
voltage reading. It‘s very misleading and a result of poor construction at
the factory level.
Tech
May 7, 2012 a 12:36 pm
Reply
Off the beaten track but several years ago my Dad bought me a 16V
Craftsman drill. I used it a couple times and put it in the garage. Recently I
was cleaning up and found that drill but the battery was dead and refused
to take a charge no matter what. A new battery (when they can be found)
is $55 plus. Do you know of any way to get this battery working again?
Thanks.
Jim
May 8, 2012 a 11:48 am
Reply
We sell a variety of power tool replacement batteries. You can view our
selection at http://www.batterystuff.com/batteries/power-tool-batteries/
Rebuilding a power tool battery pack will run around $30-35 and up. We
will be offering battery rebuilding in the near future.
Tech
May 8, 2012 a 12:02 pm
Reply
My husband just added acid instead of distilled water to my motorcycle
battery after it had been sitting all winter. Is it ruined?
S.
May 9, 2012 a 4:09 pm
Reply
Possibly. The sulfuric acid never leaves the battery, it‘s only the water that
evaporates and needs replenishment. If more acid was put in, the pH levels
are probably out of balance. The battery may still work, you should test it
before going on the road with it.
Tech
May 9, 2012 a 4:17 pm
Reply
I have been charging my dead battery for 4 months using pulsetech smart
charger. This dead battery has been leaving there for 1 year.
I got back my voltage of 13.7v and the smart charger is pulsing without
mass charging for 1 week.
However the battery still unable to start my car. The battery can supply
headlight, horn and etc.
Should i give up this battery or any other way to try it out?
I notice 1 of the electrolyte\‘s in a cell is not drying up even after a long
charge. the other cells always keep drying up and require to top up with
battery water. Is the cell dead and cannot be revive anymore?
thanks.
Yloon
May 14, 2012 a 10:35 pm
Reply
Please refer to our article about Battery Troubleshooting. As far as battery
water goes, as long as it‘s distilled water, that‘s fine.
Tech
May 16, 2012 a 10:53 am
Reply
When we use two batteries 12V each in a 24V system connected in parallel.
There will be a possibility of unbalancing if both the batteries have different
manufacturing date or batch. The charger only knows to charge 24V even
if one battery is at 14 and other one is at 10. So it is thumb rule always
connect same batch batteries in series and never replace one battery in a
series. Replace the whole bank to avoid unbalancing. Unbalancing can
damage one battery earlier than expected life.
Kamran Jabbar
May 16, 2012 a 4:23 am
Reply
Well said. Thank you for contributing.
Tech
May 16, 2012 a 2:44 pm
Reply
The best ever. Your tutorials were written for dummies like myself.
Bob
May 17, 2012 a 6:46 pm
Reply
Thank you for the feedback. :)
Tech
May 18, 2012 a 9:22 am
Reply
i have a 12 volt trolling motor and i just purchased an optima bluetop
battery. These batteries are marketed as being dual purpose (deep cycle
and cranking). is it possible to connect two 12 volt batteries to power my
trolling motor (i want to be on the water as long as possible) and if so
could i than use one of those 12 volt optima blue top dual purpose
batteries as my cranking battery for my engine? if any of this sounds dumb
im sorry im very new to boating and im trying to figure all this out .
Justin
May 20, 2012 a 3:37 pm
Reply
Deep Cycle batteries have a CCA rating as well. If you have a starting
battery and a deep cycle battery of the same physical size, the starting
battery will have far more CCA. It has to do the the thickness and number
of the plates per cell. But if you have a large marine battery, there‘s a good
chance there will be enough CCA to turn over your engine. It‘s not unheard
of. There‘s no harm in trying it out. It will either work or it won‘t.
Tech
May 22, 2012 a 10:27 am
Reply
I have a cpep that uses 2.2 amp I need to run it of a deep cell and a
inverter for 8 hour for camping what what size inverter and deep cell
battery would I need?
Vince
May 21, 2012 a 11:20 am
Reply
Please use our online calculators to find the answer. They are located at
http://www.batterystuff.com/kb/tools/ and they are very easy to use.
Tech
May 22, 2012 a 9:46 am
Reply
is it possible to charge a 12 V battery with less than 12v?
Mat
May 21, 2012 a 1:00 pm
Reply
Yes, but not fully. Proper charging requires inputting a higher voltage in
order to bring up the battery voltage. For example, if your 12 volt battery is
reading less than 6 volts, you can use a 6 volt charger to bring it up to 6.6
volts. At this point you may use an 8 volt charger. But a 12 volt battery
reading less than 10 volts is still EXTREMEMLY discharged, and should be
brought back ASAP to avoid sulfation and decreased battery life. Please
use a 12 volt charger, or make sure the charging system in your application
is strong enough, usually 14.6 volts is normal.
Tech
May 22, 2012 a 9:58 am
Reply
I have a 12V marine deep cycle battery which is marked 875 marine
cranking amps, 675 cold cranking amps, and 125 amp hours. I have been
using the battery on my boat for about two years since I purchased it. It
was charged every couple of months by either running the engine (a 9.9
HP outboard with an alternator which puts out less than 10 amps at full
throttle) or by using a regular car battery charger with a pulsating charge
of 10 amps(duty cycle= 10 sec. on, 140 sec. off). It only serves the bilge
pump when the boat is not in use, and the pump only runs a few times a
day for a few seconds. After not checking it for about two months, I found
that my battery was not working (boat bilge was flooded) so I brought the
battery out of the boat to my house. Prior to charging, it read about 6 volts
on the meter, and it was low on water. Each cell had about 1/4 in. of the
cell showing, and I added about 4 oz. of distilled water to each cell. I
charged it for about 50 hours with the 10 amp charger, and after reading
your article, I changed to a 1 amp charger. I now have access to a
hydrometer, and I will stop the 1 amp charge tomorrow morning, and let
the battery set for a while before checking with volt meter and hydrometer.
The 10 amp charger still reads about 9 amps on its meter when charging,
and immediately after I disconnected it, the voltmeter showed 12.46 volts.
All cells were bubbling, and the battery was warm, about 100 F. What have
I done wrong so far? Could I have damaged the battery? Do you think it
will recover from the deep discharge?
Timothy Lee
May 26, 2012 a 7:27 am
Reply
12.46 volts is good progress. You probably won‘t be able to see a full
charge because of sulfation build up. It‘s like trying to wash your hands
while wearing gloves. I don‘t believe the battery is beyond repair, but I
strongly recommend a desulfator or charger with desulfation pulse mode
(not voltage pulse, like some chargers do). Try a Battery MINDer or Pulse
Tech unit.
Tech
May 29, 2012 a 8:18 am
Reply
I have four 110AH leisure batteries for my small hybrid solar system. The
batteries are all 2yrs old and are not holding their charge like they once
did. I read somewhere that I could empty and wash them out then replace
with a mixture of sulphuric acid(96%) with distilled water to the correct
gravity, put them on a trickle charge for 36hrs and then they will be better
than new… Is this true? And if so, how can I be sure my mixture is correct?
I do have a basic hydrometer. Many thanks!
Carlos
May 28, 2012 a 12:16 pm
Reply
We strongly advise against emptying out the electrolyte. Bad batteries are
not a result of the electrolyte being “bad”, but usually there is a build up of
sulfation on the plates in the cells. When exposed to oxygen, the sulfation
will rapidly increase. Putting new acid sounds nice, but here‘s the problem.
Sulfation is like trying to wash your hands while wearing gloves. You still
won‘t see a full charge. On top of that, if you remove the sulfation from the
plates using a pulse charger/unit, then it will become electrolyte and throw
off your pH levels again when mixed with the new stuff.
It‘s safer to simply use a de-sulfation unit like Battery MINDer or Pulse
Tech for an extended period of time. That‘s what we do.
Tech
May 29, 2012 a 8:56 am
Reply
I have recently purchased four new US Battery 12V Deep Cycle golf cart
batteries for my 2006 Club Car, which has a 48V motor. I don\\\‘t drive the
cart more than 1-2 miles on a given day but always recharge the batteries
every day of use. The Club Car charger is left plugged into the cart at all
times the cart is not in use. I am getting an awful smell after the meter on
the charger drops to about 4 amps…on its way to zero on the charging
cycle. I can hear the electrolyte bubbling inside the batteries and they do
not get hot whatsoever. Once the meter reads zero amps and the charging
cycle has ended, the smell stops. Is this normal? Factory personnel tell me
they will always smell when recharging…..but I have never experienced
this with former Trojan (Club Car) batteries. The local dealer says the smell
should stop shortly…otherwise there may be a problem with one of the
new batteries. My voltmeter shows 12.7v in each of the four batteries after
charging.
Gary Mack
June 3, 2012 a 9:14 pm
Reply
Some bubbling and smell of sulfur is normal for large flooded batteries.
12.7 volts is good voltage. As long as you monitor the water levels, it
sounds like everything else is fine. If the electrolyte boils over, or
completely evaporates, that‘s a problem.
Tech
June 5, 2012 a 11:30 am
Reply
I have two deep cycle dp24 12 volt batteries. One is rated 685 CA 32degrees
and the other is 505 ca 32 degrees, the first is rated at 140 minutes and
the other is 120 minutes. Can these be connected in parallel without
problems? Can they also be charged in parallel using one charger?
Art
June 5, 2012 a 5:08 am
Reply
Yes, they can be paralleled together, but it‘s not advised. It will technically
work. But charging and discharging will be un-even. There‘s no way around
that. If you desperately need it, I say go ahead. But in the long term there
may be some issues and maybe shortened battery life as a result.
Tech
June 5, 2012 a 11:32 am
Reply
Sounds like a similar problem we have had with one of our vehicles. It is an
F350 Truck with a box that has a communications package. The truck has
two batteries under the hood with green eyes. There is a third and much
larger battery in the box that powers the inverters for the comms. Twice
over the past 3.5 years the charging system has overheated the large
battery until it failed. Last time the battery boiled over and we had a mess
to clean up. The charging system is powered by a shore line that plugs into
125v wall receptacle. There has been some modifications to the systems
and there is not sufficient info with the vehicle from the manufacturer that
explains the 12 vots systems, but from what I understand the shore power
charges all three batteries. I assume I need to check if all three are
charged by the same charger. What happens to MFLA batteries if they are
mixed like this?
Jim
March 27, 2013 a 4:32 am
Reply
Great article, Learned much, but, and there is always a but, started looking
at batteries and found the amp hour rating listed in different ways –
examples:
20 amp hour rate:55
35 Amp Hour
32 Min @ 10 Amp
So I am again confused about the true meaning of the amp hour.
I think this is what I need to look for as I am looking for batteries for a
trolling motor.
Fred Harris
June 9, 2012 a 7:13 am
Reply
Amp ratings are tricky. They really depend on two things: Draw amount,
(Amps) and time. The first rating, 55 AH at 20 hours means that during a
20 hour load time, it takes 55 amps to discharge the battery completely. I
do not know what time frame the second rating is for, possible taken at 10
hours?. The third rating tells you if you draw a steady amount of 10 amps,
the battery should last you 32 minutes. The first rating, 55 AH, is
equivalent of 2.75 amps an hour. But if you bump it up to a rate of 10 amps
per hour, your duration is drastically cut to 32 minutes.
Check out our battery load run time calculator to figure out what length of
time a battery would give you under a load of your choice. Plus, there‘s
also an article about Pukert‘s Law, which explains all about Battery
Capacity. You should find that very informational.
Tech
June 12, 2012 a 12:10 pm
Reply
I live in a 3rd world country. Distilled water is not available here. Can I
safely use the water out of my Katydyn Filter to add back water to my
starter battery? The water going in is either rain water or river water; it is
not treated chemically. If it is not acceptable for the battery, what are my
options for adding water to the battery? Thanks in advance!
Tim
June 10, 2012 a 1:06 pm
Reply
Distilled water is best because there are no impurities. Using other water
will technically work, but the battery will not perform or last we long as it
would otherwise. Having foreign contaminants and minerals will throw off
the delicate chemistry of the electrolyte, and throw of the pH levels, too.
Filtered water will work better than rain water. But anything more than pure
H20 will negatively affect the battery.
Tech
June 12, 2012 a 12:18 pm
Reply
Distilled water is just captured steam. If you boil water and capture/cool
the stream back into water, that‘s distilled water. You can pretty easily
make your own with household supplies or even camping supplies. There
are several methods out there. Google “How to distill water.”
Sam
July 11, 2012 a 5:14 pm
Reply
That‘s a very good idea. Thank you for sharing.
Tech
July 12, 2012 a 8:47 am
Reply
My question is,do you keep a 12volt battery(used for a golf
trolley)constantly on charge,or remove from charge when fully
charged?.thanks.
Graham Bennett
June 12, 2012 a 3:14 am
Reply
It really depends on the charger you use. If it is a manual constant current
charger, then I would remove the batteries after they‘re fully charged. If
the unit is a smart charger, like the 3-stage microprocessor controlled
chargers we sell, then it‘s safe to leave on the battery forever. Keeping the
battery in the “float mode” will ensure full charge at all times, which is the
healthiest thing you can do for a battery.
Tech
June 12, 2012 a 1:31 pm
Reply
Dear Sir,What is the best/correct proceedure when charging a 12v
battery,used for a golf trolley.When fully charged,is best to keep it on
charge,or remove it from the power supply?. Thanks.
Graham Bennett
June 14, 2012 a 1:28 am
Reply
The best thing you can do for batteries is keep them in a fully charged
state whenever possible. If your charging system will not overcharge, but
will adjust and trickle down to a float charge, then it‘s safe to leave on
indefinitely. If not, please remove after it‘s done charging.
Tech
June 14, 2012 a 8:54 am
Reply
in a 24 volt system, batteries connected in series, if one battery happens to
fail, should both batteries be changed regardless of whether or not the 2nd
battery tests out fine? also, in the same system, if one would be required to
boost the 24volt system from a another source being a 12 volt source…
does one connect battery positive from boosting source to battery positive
of battery require boosting, negative to negative of only one battery?
This seems like it could cause a problem as battery 1 is connected to
battery 2 in series which means, battery + of one is connected to battery –
of the second, wouldn‘t boosting cause problems?? how does one go
about doing this safely to himself and the machine being boosted.
Josh
June 15, 2012 a 10:36 am
Reply
If one battery fails, it‘s recommended to replace both because battery
banks composed of batteries of different ages will charge and discharge
unevenly. With the 12 volt boost, it looks like one battery is being
discharged more than another. This is a problem. The second battery, even
though connected in series with the first, is untouched by the boost
because the connections are only attached to the first battery. But having a
24 volt system, both batteries act as one single unit. Uneven charge levels
will cause early battery failure and poor performance. I would use the
boost option as sparingly as possible.
Tech
June 15, 2012 a 2:57 pm
Reply
I have a question about battery charging from a solar panel. The solar
charge controller uses a mosfet to act as a switch. If the voltage on the
battery increases to a certain level, then the mosfet opens and disconnects
the solar panel. What happens if my solar panel puts out 24 volts instead
of 15-16 volts? Will the higher voltage but lower current of the panel cause
any charging problems?
Steve Tannenbaum
June 22, 2012 a 4:18 pm
Reply
12 volt solar panels can reach as high as 21-24 volts if the sunlight is
direct. The controller should have specs regarding the maximum voltage
input it can handle. Even though the controller is, like you said, a switch, it
also lowers the charge voltage, too. Most of our controllers lower the
voltage to a safe 14.4-14.8 volts. Therefore, 24 volts incoming from the
panel is no problem for the battery.
Tech
June 25, 2012 a 8:39 am
Reply
I BOUGHT A LIKE NEW HOVEROUND FOR 3.00 ON A GARAGE SALE. IT
WASNOT USED MUCH AND THE BATTERIES WILL NOT CHARGE WITH ON
BOARD CHARGER. I DID GET ONE TO CHARGE WILL ANOTHER LEAD ACID
CHARGER ON 2 AMPS OVER NIGHT THE OTHER BATTERY SHOWS ONLY 7-8
VOLTS AND IS STILL CHARGING NOW 2 DAYS.
CAN I DO ANYTHING TO BRING BACK THIS BATTERY? OR DO I NEED TO BY
A NEW ON. I ADDED A LITTLE WATER TO THIS BATTERY EVEN THOUGH I
KNEW IT DOESNT TAKE WATER WILL THIS HURT IT IT DOESNT CHARGE
COMPLETELY ANYWAY.
can i use lead acid batterys in this hoveround to get it going to test it?
LET ME KNOW IF YOU CAN HELP
THANKS
MARV
Marv
June 26, 2012 a 7:20 am
Reply
7-8 volts is extremely discharged. The batteries are probably beyond repair
due to sulfation. If they cannot reach 12 volts, they‘re no use for them. I
recommend replacing them. As far as which batteries to use, I suggest
deep cycle batteries, not car batteries. They can be flooded…but for
mobility scooters its best to use sealed batteries like AGM or Gel.
Tech
June 26, 2012 a 10:55 am
Reply
If you have a bunch of 12V deep cycle batteries paralleled (or groups of
series 6‘s then paralleled to make 12V) – is it best to isolate each group so
that at night the batteries are not fighting each other. I mean isolation as in
commercial heavy duty battery isolators. Is this much more necessary if
the bank is not typically receiving a daily charge top up (i.e. solar)?
Kyle
June 30, 2012 a 12:29 am
Reply
If the batteries in the bank are charging and discharging together, and they
are of the same type, size, and age, then there is no need to disconnect
them. They act together as a single batery unit. But if the batteries are
unevenly charged and/or different capacity, they will try to equalize and
balance. This is can harm a small battery if connected to a large battery,
which is not recommended. Different age and type of the batteries can also
cause inbalance.
Tech
July 2, 2012 a 10:24 am
Reply
Shouldn‘t this battery be dead? Why is it working?
I just bought a 12v 7.2ah Valve regulated Lead acid battery for $5.00 I
tested the volts and it‘s at 12.75 a sticker reads “Top Charge Date
4/26/2007
I ran a motor from it for 2 minutes and it held up. I charged it and it took a
charge. Should I run a cordless drill motor from it for as long as I can to
see how long it last? Or should I leave well enough a lone?
Thanks Trevor
Trevor
July 8, 2012 a 2:12 pm
Reply
12.75 is good voltage. If the battery was kept maintained fully charged,
there‘s no reason not to use it as long as there‘s nothing physically wrong
with the battery. Draining it down with lights, drills, motors is good, you
should measure the voltage under the load to see if it holds up and doesn‘t
crash. When you‘re done testing it, it‘s good to recharge it ASAP and keep
it charged when you‘re not using it.
Tech
July 9, 2012 a 10:19 am
Reply
Hi
Can I charge a wet lead acid battery SLI in paralel whit a AGM deep cycle
whit only one alternator?
A relay disconnect de paralel when the motor is off.
Thanks
Francisco
July 10, 2012 a 11:37 am
Reply
For a situation like yours, I recommend using a battery isolator switch,
which can be used on up to 120 amp alternators to conveniently allow for
adding a spare battery in your car, boat, or RV. The unit is a fully automatic
switch that allows the engine alternator to charge 2 batteries, while
keeping them electrically isolated from each other. This will prevent current
flow from one battery to another, thus allowing each battery to be an
independent power source.
You can see it here: http://www.batterystuff.com/battery-products
/switches/Bi303303.html
Tech
July 10, 2012 a 12:17 pm
Reply
I just bought a JL 50 scooter and the battery it came with is a12. Battery
which came with the liquid which instructed me to put liquid into the cells
and then cap it with the plastic cap plate that came with it and then charge
fully before using. I filled it with the liquid two days ago but have not been
able to go buy the charger which I Plan on buying at wall art tomorrow.
Last night and one time today the battery cell cap has popped open on
only one cell (the last one) loud enough for me to here it ( it is in the same
room with me). I am worried something is wrong, should I be concerned?
Is this normal ? Is it because I squeezed the bottles when adding the
liquid?
Marissa
July 13, 2012 a 6:49 pm
Reply
Congratulations on the new scooter!
Squeezing the battery would not be a problem. It usually takes hours for
the acid to become fully absorbed. The only cause I can think of for the
caps popping off is overheating. Is the battery in the garage? Did you
install the vent tube that comes off the side?
Something is causing the battery to build pressure, and it‘s not venting fast
enough. If the liquid levels decrease, please add distilled water. But other
than that, everything else should be fine. Venting is normal, but caps
popping off is not. You definitely don‘t want that happening while on the
road.
Tech
July 16, 2012 a 10:00 am
Reply
May I charge a 6v auto battery using a 12v (rated) solar panel?
Bill
July 14, 2012 a 9:40 am
Reply
No. This will be like trying to run a gasoline car on diesel. You can either
use a 6 volt panel for the car battery, or series the battery with another of
identical specs to create 12 volts.
Tech
July 16, 2012 a 10:09 am
Reply
A really helpful, first rate site. Thanks! My question relates to appropriate
charging of an AGM (or alternatively, a Gel) battery on a vintage, generator
equipped car. The generator and standard regulator setup are inadequate
to operating the car with headlights AND, say, windshield wipers or heater
blower. The set-point of the regulator has to be raised to 16 volts to avoid
battery drain whilst driving, and so after starting, and within about 5
minutes, as the voltage reaches 16, I switch on the headlights to load the
generator down to about 14.5 volts. After several hours drive, or when
other loads are added, this voltage will fall below 14 volts. Is this
procedure good enough to maximize the life of an AGM or Gel battery? An
alternator conversion is being considered. Comparing say a Delco 10Si
with a Mitsubishi that might be used for tractor or marine purposes, what
should I be careful about? I am thinking of the different battery
applications, tractor, marine, etc, versus the Delco regulator of 14.4 volts.
Thanks.
Roger
July 22, 2012 a 9:07 am
Reply
16 volts is too high and will damage a gel battery. 14.6 -14.8 volts for an
AGM is just right. If you need to charge a gel battery, a regulator will be
needed to keep the voltage from exceeding 14.2. An alternator would be a
good idea. Regularly pumping 16 volts in a battery will cause the internal
resistance in the battery to spike and heat up. It‘s not recommended for
the long run.
Tech
July 23, 2012 a 4:07 pm
Reply
Thank you for your great information. It always helps to read it rather than
using guess work!
I do have a question for you that I hope you can help with please.
I have had our motorhome for nearly 2 years and it came with a couple of
solar panels – one of which is rather large. However we have had a couple
of problems with cooked batteries! Basically, we discovered our battery
was being cooked by one of our solar panels as the regulator was not
working. We got that sorted and replaced the very smelly leisure battery.
But just recently the same thing happened again and we discovered that
our very large solar panel didn‘t have a regulator on it at all. We realised
very quickly and disconnected the battery which was beginning to sulphar
up and smell. We have since added a regulator and although the battery
was able to be cleaned up we are finding that it now will take a decent
charge but is only holding that charge for about 45 minutes. So we have 2
great solar panels and no holding charge. Do you think that this is due to
the damaged battery or could it be something else? It is a sealed battery
and so we cannot tell what state it is in internally. Thank you.
Steve
July 25, 2012 a 2:18 pm
Reply
If the issue was sulfation, then the solution would be to try to restore the
battery with an on-board pulse de-sulfator. But if the batteries have been
over-charged, and they drain very quickly, then there really is nothing else
you can do. Overcharging can dramatically age a battery rapidly.
Can you provide some voltage readings? Say, one at rest. While on the
charger. And finally, a reading 45 minutes after off the charger. With these
numbers, I can more accurately diagnose the battery.
Tech
July 26, 2012 a 8:35 am
Reply
THANK YOU FOR SHARING YOUR KNOWLEDGE! WOW! I have been working
with batteries for years, yet never really understood their differences, much
less how to match them with various applications. Here I have been buying
based on the highest amp/hr AND CCA, when I should be looking harder at
one or the other. And now there‘s an AGM???
Okay, ….a question:
The GPS/Fish Finder on our boat uses around one-third of an amp. My
typical day of ocean fishing is between 8 and 10 hours. I do not like it on
the starting battery and am looking for options.
The first question is AGM or a small gel cell? I am looking to understand
the balance between them, in particularly, the lesser chance/lower cost of
replacing it in the event I trash it, …which I am convinced is destiny – or
the higher cost of a gel that I will not trash. (While I think I am very easy
on batteries, evidence shows they do not seem to like me.) So, is it just
math, or are there other considerations I should be looking at?
If using an AGM, the YT4L-BS will give me 9 hours of GPS. Correct? Or
should I be looking at double that size, like the YT6.5L 12v AGM? I just
cannot see spending $140 for something a 41 battery will do just as well
for.
Prior to reading your pages, I had heard of AGMs, but the information was
skewed. I was told they are just like gel cells, which I now know is only a
half-truth. I can clearly see the differences over wet and gel, but I am most
attracted to the low replacement cost if I, indeed, trash it.
Which one do you recommend?
Again, thank you for the site, …and I welcome your sagacity.
Cpt Crunch
July 30, 2012 a 12:42 am
Reply
AGM batteries can be recharged with any battery charger. Gels are more
fragile, and they need a charger with a safe voltage profile for charging.
Gel batteries can be discharged further without the damage it would cause
an AGM. We recommend no more than 50% for AGM. The Gel can go as
much as 80% discharged.
For your GPS/Fish Finder, I recommend a deep cycle battery. The YT4L and
YT6.5L are motorcycle starting batteries. I recommend a sealed lead acid
deep cycle battery. Having one at least 8 AH in capacity should give you 10
hour of safe runtime given the 300 mAh draw. This is what I recommend:
http://www.batterystuff.com/batteries/upc-telecom/sla-1280.html
Tech
July 30, 2012 a 3:17 pm
Reply
I have an old (‘85) Honda ATV. After some reading (obviously not enough)I
purchased a gel cell battery that was advertized as appropriate for my ATV.
It did not take long for the battery to reach a point where it would light
lights but not turn over the electric starter. After more reading, it would
seem that the alternater would need some “adjusting” to keep this battery
charged. I can find many references to external chargers, however I have,
so far, been unable to find any information on what needs to be done to
upgrade the charging system of the ATV for gel. Any help here?
Bill
August 3, 2012 a 2:01 pm
Reply
We do not sell anything that would regulate an alternator to a safe voltage
for Gel batteries (no more than 14.2 volts). I imagine it would be costly.
It‘s easier to simply purchase an AGM battery for the ATV and not have to
worry about charging differences.
Tech
August 3, 2012 a 4:07 pm
Reply
Hi, First of all I want to say that your tutorials have been very useful for me
and I have learned very much.
I have an off grid house that I power with four 12V 245AH 8D AGM
batteries wired in Parallel which are connected to a xantrex 3000W sine
wave inverter/charger. I have a xantrex link pro battery monitor that has a
programable alarm relay that I have set to start the generator when the
batteries get down to 55% state of charge and to turn off again at 85%.
occasionally I turn the generator on manually to bring the batteries up to
100% charge to synchronize the monitor. I just set the system up a few
weeks ago and it is working very well so far. I am not there very often but
whenever I check on it, the batteries are within range and the generator
runs for 4 or 5 hours a week. The only thing running while I am gone is the
refrigerator and a half dozen 7w led lights that I have come on after dark. I
don‘t have any other source to charge the batteries yet (solar or wind).
I have a couple of questions:
Do you think this system will work well in terms of longevity? Is there
something I should be doing differently, such as setting up the monitor to
keep the batteries at a different state of charge (more or less discharge)?
The reason I don‘t bring them to 100% every time is that the generator
needs to run for quite a long time to get the extra 10-15% into the
batteries and it seems like a waste of fuel.
Second, if I had an always on wireless internet connection, do you know of
a way that I could monitor the battery condition from far away via the
internet? So that I would know if there was a problem with the generator
not coming on. I don‘t know if there is a battery monitor available set up to
do that. Any ideas you might have would be geatly appreciated.
Thank you.
Bob
August 11, 2012 a 7:17 pm
Reply
hi,
i have a solar system & i am using a device that measures the voltage of
the batteries and send it through a serial port to the computer, that can
show me the health at anytime of the day.
i have 8 batteries connected in parallel, and the problem that i am trying to
think of a solution is that the measuring device is treating the 8 batteries
as one, and gives me a single reading. But in order for my monitoring
project to work, i want to be able to measure each battery alone, even
when they are connected in parallel together…
I know this sounds impossible, but I still need to think of all possibilities.
Anyone with any clues would be very helpful.
Thanks.
Bob
August 14, 2012 a 8:16 pm
Reply
Any technical questions can be emailed directly to Tech@batterystuff.com
for the fastest response.
To answer, at least the best I can, I would personally hook up the tester
that you are using to an 8 point switch, where each of the 8 modes were
connected to one of the batteries directly. You could then switch the
connection on the monitor to each battery individually, even though they
are all hooked up together. The only real downside to this would be that if
your device is one of the more accurate types, then it will be thrown off by
resetting it on each battery and will cease to be as accurate. On the other
hand, if it is not a super accurate one, then I wouldn‘t bother setting it up
this way anyways. So while its not completely impossible, its a bit of a
catch 22. The accurate one will cease to be so, and the not as accurate one
falls in the ‘why bother’ catergory. Hope that helps! :)
Jeremy Fear
August 15, 2012 a 11:16 am
Reply
Hi
I have (8) x 6V x 125AH deep cycle batteries producing 24V in a
series/parallel config
charged by a 250W x 24V solar panel,powering a 24V fridge/freezer 24/7
drawing 2A when running.
Am i correct in assuming my total stored AH capacity should be sufficient
to run the fridge
with minimal sunlight for a few weeks.
Cheers
Max
Max Williams
August 16, 2012 a 2:52 am
Reply
As long as you rpanels recieve at least 5.5 hours of direct sunlight on the
panel then you should be good. If you have any further technical
questions, please email them to Tech@batterystuff.com
Jeremy Fear
August 16, 2012 a 9:43 am
Reply
hello i have 8 deep cycle battery 12v 200Ah connected series/parallel to
supply a ups system and it charged by acostant charger 52.5 V 35A its
working abot 18 month every day about 6hr on the UPS and now begin
loose its capacity when i check the voltage for each battery while the
charger working some of them give 13,4v and other 12.66 and 12.9 so it
the sulfated or need for reacharging with a smart charger .
thanks
Qusay
August 19, 2012 a 6:52 pm
Reply
I don‘t know what the load is, but for a 48 volt system the charger seems a
little too low if it‘s charging at 52.5 V. It should be 56 V or so under the
bulk charge mode. For float, 52.5 is okay. I‘m not sure what your question
is about.
If the batteries are individually reading different voltages, that‘s not good
for the system. Are the batteries the same age? 13.4 v is a little high but
good full charge, while 12.9 v sounds just about right. 12.66 v could use
more charge. If it‘s not able to reach any higher voltage, sulfation is a good
cause of that. An onboard de-sulfator like the Power Pulse or ODB from
Battery MINDer would be recommended to fix that battery. No need to
disconnect it from the others or change your system.
Tech
August 20, 2012 a 11:47 am
Reply
thanks alot for your assistant
1- my battery have the same age
2- i cant increase the charger voltage because its max volt is 52.5 also till
now i dont try another charger or charge each battery individually
3- these readings for each battery but while they connected to the charger
and for example when im add all the reading ( 13.4+12.66+12.9+13.54)
its equal to 52.5 which is the charger voltage and when im disconnect the
charger and after 1 hr battery reading is ( 12.7 , 12.5 , 12.7 , 12.6 ) i think
battery No 1 and 4 prevent the voltage to rais in battery 2 and 3 so they
cannot charge fully , also at the first 8 month all the battery have the same
reading when charging .
do recommend individually charging for each battery to force it reach to
13.6 v and accept current , like using 48 v charger with 4 bank or its no
problem to use 48 v charger with one bank also if i want to desulfate it it is
better to use obd-12 for each on or use obd 48 for each 4 batteries
also what is the recomended methode to charge and maintain this system
to get maximum life for the batteries .
thanks & best regard
Qusay
August 20, 2012 a 2:35 pm
Reply
A 4 bank 48 volt charger would charge the batteries individually, which
may solve the problem. 52.5 volts is good if the batteries are fully charged.
But since they are not all charged, I recommend the charge rate should be
higher for the two to charge up. If you use the OBD-12, you‘ll need one for
each battery. Otherwise, you can use a single OBD-48 for all four batteries
in series.
Tech
August 21, 2012 a 7:50 am
Reply
thanks to helping me to solve the problem and thanks for the site which
give this amount of data for users , really great site and great staff
thanks again with my best regards
Qusay
August 21, 2012 a 11:01 am
Reply
Hi, just got a new kirkland battery and it has the 6 cells under the cap. Not
all of the cells have liquid in them to the top. is this normal for some cells
to have more liquid than others, should they all be filled to the top? I could
not see any fill lines as to where the level should be. thanks
Jeff
August 27, 2012 a 5:01 pm
Reply
Yes, the cells should be balanced, even as far as liquid levels. Please only
use distilled water. They do not need to be filled to the rim, but definitely
the plates should never be exposed. If this happens, the plates react with
the oxygen in the air and form sulfation rapidly. I hope this answers your
question.
Tech
August 28, 2012 a 10:24 am
Reply
I have new replacement 4 × 12v 18 ah deep cycle agm batteries wired in
series for an e-bike, the 48 v charger charges the bank at around 54-55 v,
Now,the original batteries performed the last 2 years as expected for 300-
400 cycles with good range , but these new replacement batteries are
failing within weeks, less than 30% range than originals. When testing the
charging voltage going to each individual battery in series , it varies from
14.1 V- 15.9 V from one battery to the next. and under a timed load test on
each charged battery, they range from 2 min to 55 min before dropping
below 11.5 /cell. Are the batteries poorly constructed or is it a charger
issue? Thanks for any insight you can provide.
Will Helbich
August 31, 2012 a 3:38 pm
Reply
How much was the load amount for the test? 15.9 volts is on the high side
as far as charging goes.
Tech
September 4, 2012 a 3:10 pm
Reply
This is a philosophical comment. Lead-acid batteries suffer from self
discharge. Batteries actually spend overwhelmingly most of the time not on
charge but doing absolutely nothing at all. This is what causes sulfation. So
what do the experts recommend battery users do? Treat the sulfation. A
hundred year old cure! How about treating the battery with something that
stops the self discharge?
John Fetter
September 6, 2012 a 12:52 am
Reply
Keeping a battery on a trickle charger will prevent self discharge. Beyond
that, asking a battery not to self discharge is like asking a person not to
age. It‘s a chemical issue, and healthy batteries will self discharge at a
lower rate than older batterie or cheap batteries made from lesser quality
materials.
Tech
September 6, 2012 a 8:48 am
Reply
When using a deep cycle battery in a Solar system, using DC 12 volt lights.
Is there a way to automatically shut off the lights before it discharges the
battery too far?
Bob
September 7, 2012 a 11:38 pm
Reply
Yes, you would need a battery disconnect or a power switch. Priority Start
and Battery Guard are two brands that will do this automatically. We sell
these in our battery accessories category.
Tech
September 10, 2012 a 8:42 am
Reply
I have an electric 2-wheel scooter that my wife uses. It has 3-batteries
linked together. How do I hook-up the cables on my battery charger to
charge this bank of 3-batteries?
Charles Wehland
September 8, 2012 a 1:34 pm
Reply
It depends entirely if the batteries are suppose to be in series or parallel.
The answer to this question depends if the scooter runs off 12 volts, or 36
volts. But the surest place to connect your charger to are the same
terminals that the scooter‘s motor is connected to in order to run.
Tech
September 10, 2012 a 8:57 am
Reply
Hi James, thank you for the information and excellent explanations! How
can I figure out what type of battery in my car (2007 BMW X3)? The
battery is a sealed maintenance free battery. It’s the original battery. The
part number is S: 61 21 8 385 398, and the label says it’s 90 AH and 720
CCA, but no manufacture name on it though. I called couple of BMW
dealers, but they didn’t know. Hopefully you can help me out. Thanks in
advance!
Bo
September 11, 2012 a 1:53 pm
Reply
Sounds like an AGM or a VRLA battery. Both are different types of lead acid
batteries, the sealed ones as apposed to the conventional flooded type. It‘s
not going to be a gel, I can almost guarantee that. Gel batteries are
completely sealed. If there any ventilation or even vent slits on the top of
the case, then it‘s not a gel. That‘s good too, because gel batteries don‘t
make good starting batteries. They‘re fragile.
Tech
September 11, 2012 a 2:20 pm
Reply
Thank you very much for your answer. I have a battery charger, and I need
to choose one of Standard, AGM, and GEL battery type. Which type should
I select?
Bo
September 12, 2012 a 6:42 am
Reply
Gel is the safest, because it uses the lowest charging voltage of the three.
If you are not sure, the gel setting is always a safe option. Otherwise, if you
think it‘s an AGM (check to make sure there are ventilation slots to confirm
it‘s not a gel) then use the AGM setting.
Tech
September 12, 2012 a 7:45 am
Reply
this rlly helped me in my auto electrical class
Austin
September 17, 2012 a 11:41 am
Reply
it helped me alot but google‘s better
Mark
September 17, 2012 a 11:44 am
Reply
What did you find that more helpful? Lease share it with us.
Tech
September 17, 2012 a 12:18 pm
Reply
Hi all,
Current setup:
1) Two UPSs. Both are independent systems.
2) Both are identical; Manufacturer: Delta; Model:J-Series 7 KVA. Each
capacity: 5000 Watt, 230 Volt AC.
3) Each has 20 numbers of 12 Volt 26 AH batteries connected in series for
a 240 Volt DC, 26 AH battery bank.
Objective:
a)Design a battery bank in such a way that even if one battery fails, the
bank would still be operational and keep the UPS running until the failed
battery is replaced.
b)Try reconfiguring existing battery bank so that cost is minimized.
Proposed setup:
1)Instead of two identical but separate battery banks as configured now,
reconfigure the 40 batteries in one battery bank.
2)Batteries will be connected in series and also in parallel as listed in the
diagram.
3)Two batteries will be connected in parallel to form one 12 Volt 52 AH
parallel battery bank pair. Twenty such pairs will be linked in series to form
one 240 Volt DC 52 AH bank.
4)Connect both UPSs to this one battery bank.
5)The 230 Volt AC “Output” of the UPSs would remain independent as they
are now.
Attached Diagram:
Both the current setup as well as the proposed setup are illustrated.
(No change in the independent “Outputs” of the two UPSs. The 230 Volt
AC “Output” of the two UPSs would remain the same (as independent
outputs) in the proposed setup as they are now in the existing setup.)
Advantages:
1)When any one battery fails, the entire bank would still be operational.
(Hence, the UPSs will not fail.)
2)So long as “both” batteries connected in any parallel pair do not fail, the
bank would still be operational.
Question:
1)Would the battery charging circuits in each UPS somehow interfere with
each other?
2)Are there other issues and/or disadvantages in the proposed system that
are overlooked?
When electrical power is On, would the battery charging systems in each
UPS interfere with each other when charging the single battery bank? In
other words, currently just as one UPS charges its own battery bank, would
the two UPSs charge the single common battery bank without issues?
We would be very thankful to you if you can please give us your valuable
feedback on our proposed battery bank set up.
Selvan Albert.
Selvan Albert
September 19, 2012 a 7:26 am
Reply
I want to increase the voltage of 2 batteries from 24V to 180V. Is it
possible?
Ameya Pawar
September 26, 2012 a 4:55 am
Reply
There are some step up converters to increase voltages, but we do not sell
them. Additionally, I think it may be hard to find one that will step up to
180 volts.
Tech
September 26, 2012 a 9:26 am
Reply
Thank you for your opinion….I would like to use an electric golf cart for
in-town transportation in a small town in the San Juan Mountains of
Colorado, year around. I am a teacher and typically only drive it back and
forth once or twice a day, about one mile each way. 1st question: It can be
very cold here on winter mornings, (-20 degrees and more),but then
warm-up to 30 degrees on the same day, is there a battery that can handle
the temperature range, and still have a reasonable life length? 2nd
question: I have a solar panel that I could place on the roof, get a charge
controller, and have the batteries always trickle charging, how will that
effect the battery life? I have a 36 volt charger that came with the cart. The
cart is perhaps 20 years old. The batteries it came with were all exhausted,
I took them to a recycler. I was thinking of spending the 150.00 each (
including core fee) for 6 batteries, and stop driving my gas vehicle. I‘d
appreciate some advice.
Adam Johnson
September 27, 2012 a 7:00 am
Reply
For the greatest range of operating temperature, the gel batteries would
work the best. For a solar panel, you would either need a single 36 volt
panel, or 3 12 volt panels in series. That‘s a good idea if you want to see
the longest lifespan from the batteries. The charge controller, make sure
it‘s safe for gel batteries, which require a slightly lower voltage charge than
most other batteries need. We sell Trojan T-105 6 volt batteries for $139
each. No core needed.
Tech
September 27, 2012 a 8:17 am
Reply
Great article. I learned more than I‘ve ever known about batteries, but I
still don‘t know much.
I am wondering, I recently purchased a year round ice fishing house /
camper. I‘m looking at batteries now and am leaning towards an AGM. Is
that what you would recommend? Again, this battery will be used year
round. Freezing cold when it sits for 4-5 days at a time without being used,
then it will be used on the weekends when I go fishing. Then during the
summer it will be used in the heat.
I‘ve also seen a couple mentions of solar chargers. I do have a generator
that i plan to use to recharge the battery when necessary, but am
wondering if it would make sense to leave a solar charger hooked up to the
battery constantly. The location of the battery in the house would make it
very simple to hook a solar charger up and have it mounted either directly
in the window, or just outside attached to the side of the camper/fish
house. Then even when in use, the battery would be charging, right?
Thanks in advance for any response.
Matt
October 9, 2012 a 4:31 pm
Reply
For extreme temperatures, the Gel batteries are the best. They also have
the slowest discharge rate. Having a solar panel is a great idea, and
perfectly safe even if a generator is on or you are using the batteries, if you
are also using a solar controller (which regulate safe charge voltage levels,
and prevents back feed into the panel). But yes, if a solar panel is receiving
sunlight, the battery will also be charging as well.
Tech
October 11, 2012 a 9:28 am
Reply
Great Article !
For what it‘s worth. I use NorthStar pure lead AGM batteries. They have the
widest operating temperature range (-40 deg F to + 149 deg F) and have a
two year shelf life. Never saw a gel battery with that type of operating
temperatures. I have one in in my truck. Never a minutes worth of problem.
Tim
January 15, 2013 a 12:10 pm
Reply
Pure lead vs recycled lead does make a difference in performance.
NorthStar batteries sounds like good batteries.
Tech
January 15, 2013 a 1:19 pm
Reply
Thank you for your great work! I have learned a lot.
I have a Die Hard 1150: 20ah AGM power pack. As per your explanations, I
leave it plugged in because it has an integrated smart charger that is
supposed to provide a safe float charge to maintain the battery‘s health. I
have two questions relative to this:
1. Is it normal that the battery is slightly warm to the touch when it is
plugged, has reached 100% and is receiving a maintenance charge?
2. Are dangerous gases given off while the battery is plugged in and
receiving a trickle charge? My battery is plugged in in the basement
workshop in a fairly large house.
Thanks for any information you can provide and take care.
Peter
Peter
October 14, 2012 a 3:22 pm
Reply
If the battery is warm, it‘s because there is more resistance in the battery
internally than normal. There is probably a good amount of sulfate crystals
on the plates in the cells, which would cause the charger to work harder to
maintain the float mode. Sulfation robs the battery of power, but can be
reserved with de-sulfation units and chargers.
Gassing should not be an issue if the battery is healthy. Only significant
over-charging should cause an AGM to vent excessively.
Tech
October 15, 2012 a 1:14 pm
Reply
I have a Toyota Coaster bus which is fitted out as a motor-home. The
vehicle was manufactured with a 24 volt electrical system, which uses two
batteries in series, of 12 volts each. I have outlined a description of the
auxiliary electrical system below, but my basic question is, how can I know
how depleted my auxiliary batteries are at the end of a day in which the
refrigerator has been working for a long time?
I think the basic rule is that the batteries should not be discharged below
50% of their capacity, but what reliable method can I use to determine
when they have reached this point? There are two auxiliary 12 volt
batteries in series, each 120 amp-hour, to provide power for the “house
system” – namely refrigerator, lights, water-pump, and various 12 volt
power outlets. The refrigerator is the major user of battery power, because
it is a compressor fridge which uses the equivalent of 12 volts 8amps
(i.e.96 watts) while it is running, and it runs for approximately 8 to 12
hours in each 24 hour period depending on how hot the weather is. The
auxiliary batteries are charged by two solar panels of 80 watts each, and
receive additional charging from the vehicle alternator when the engine is
running. There is a battery isolator which automatically disconnects the
auxiliary batteries from the vehicle electrical system when the engine is not
running. The voltage regulator for the solar panel charging system
provides a constant display for the auxiliary system, including the auxiliary
battery voltage. I have been in the habit of checking the voltage last thing
at night, and first thing in the morning, to find how much power the fridge
has taken from the batteries. If the night time voltage is below 24.8volts,
then the morning reading is below 24.0 volts. The problem is that if we
have not done much driving on a particular day, and the solar panels have
not done much charging because of cloudy weather, the night-time voltage
may only be 24.2 volts, and the morning voltage not much above 23 volts.
If the battery is at 24.2 volts when the fridge is not running, then when the
fridge starts running the voltage reading drops down to about 23.5 volts.
And so my question remains, what is the lowest acceptable voltage for my
auxiliary battery system, so that the batteries are not damaged by being
discharged too much. Thank you for reading through a long and detailed
letter, but I wanted to provide sufficient background information.
Wilfred Kube
October 22, 2012 a 4:35 pm
Reply
Resting voltage of 24.4 volts is 50%. When you reach this point, stop using
the batteries until you can recharge them again.
Tech
October 23, 2012 a 10:50 am
Reply
Thank you very much for your helpful site,and for your prompt reply to my
query.
Wilfred Kube
October 24, 2012 a 2:13 pm
Reply
I do have the same system as Wilfred, although I use a Tripp Lite to invert
current from 12V to 110V (2,400 Watts)
I have always used 3 cheap regular truck size batteries, charged by the
alternator and, with the almost every WE driving, had no problem running
everything for 3 years without having to charge the batteries with an
external charger
Recently, to lower the weight, I bought 2 trojan deep cycle batteries 225
that almost totalled the same Amp as the 3 previous ones
To my surprise, these batteries have gone dead last week after 6 months of
use, although well maintained as far as water and regular charging through
the alternator
The Tripp Lite works fine and we always avoid to use the battery lower than
the yellow and red lights which indicate a battery load of 50 %
We did have a 2 minutes run on red light 2 weeks ago (as much as 80%
discharge) and to prevent any further problem I recharged the batteries
with an external charger together for 20 hours (for the first time in the last
10 years); the charger indicated 14V at the end of the charging process.
Unfortunately, on a trip last week I lost power faster then ever and ended
up having to only use the refrigerator while driving, forgetting about the
water pump or the coffee maker; I tried to recharge the batteries since
then but the charger wont go over 10 volts and goes down to 8 and 7 after
10 hours
My question: since these trojan batteries are very expensive where I live
(Peru) should I invest in a charger, what kind, and should I charge the
batteries everyday from my house? The car is in the street and I cant go
check every 2 hours what the voltage is, so is there a charging process that
is safe, guaranteed on the long term for these batteries?
Once again this is the full description of my configuration:
bus sprinter with alternator of 100 Amp
starter battery of 120 Amp
2 trojan deep cycle 225 130 amp each output 12V
one tripp lite inverter 12-120V 2,400 Watts
Thank you so much for your answer which should interest many people like
me who just want to understand how to run a simple 3 or 4 devices in their
camper
Yves Van Damme
February 9, 2013 a 1:22 pm
Reply
It sounds to me like your current charger is probably fine but the batteries
may be defective or had their life significantly reduced when they were
overly discharged those 2 weeks ago.
Tech
February 11, 2013 a 11:13 am
Reply
Thank you for your article, I have a question. I bought a 2 month old
(STICKER ON IT) battery from junkyard, outside cell was punctured in a
crash, looked inside all electrolyte was gone from the one cell. I repaired
the plastic casing,it could now hold liquid safely. Could i add electrolite
from an old battery or would that have too many sulfites , it would be
better to get a motorcycles worth at autozone? I am going to turn in my
old battery anyway as it is a core charge… What do you think?
David Cuneo
October 26, 2012 a 12:36 am
Reply
The moment oxygen hits activated plates in a cell, sulfation will form
rapidly. My opinion is that it's not worth the effort or the risk. I recommend
buying a new battery. Even if you were able to restore this one a bit, I
doubt it will last very long and it would not be safe as the internal
resistance when charging will be greater than a healthy battery, which you
will risk the battery overheating as a result.
Tech
October 26, 2012 a 8:33 am
Reply
”… An amp hour (AH) is a rating usually found on deep cycle batteries. The
standard rating is an Amp rating taken for 20 Hours. What this means, say
for a 100 AH rated battery is this: Draw from the battery for 20 hours and
it will provide a total of 100 amps …”
Should say …
”… and it will provide a total of 100 amp-hours …”
Greg
October 28, 2012 a 6:22 pm
Reply
Thank you for the suggestion. We will make the change.
Tech
October 29, 2012 a 9:21 am
Reply
My AGM 100amps battery for UPS is acting strange it gains full charge
with 30-50 mins while it also discharges with 30-40 mins, my UPS is
charging the battery on 10-12 amps. Any Help
Fawad
November 19, 2012 a 12:09 am
Reply
What is the amount of draw (load) on the battery when its in use?
Tech
November 19, 2012 a 2:42 pm
Reply
I don know exactly but its has a Samsung 42” Plasma Tv and and small
Satellite receiver, that‘s all. And with the same load it gave me a Backup
time of almost 2 to three hours.
Fawad
November 20, 2012 a 3:25 am
Reply
If I understand you correctly, your battery isn‘t lasting as long as it used
to, and it charges quickly, too? Short charge/discharge periods? Sounds
like the battery has sulfate crystal buildup on the plates. Sulfation causes
batteries to age quickly. Refer to our other technical articles about how to
remove sulfation.
Tech
November 20, 2012 a 4:29 pm
Reply
i bought a 12Volt battery 22months back with inverter for my desktop
computer only. It reads GT-2100 C20 210AH. It‘s a lead acid battery. The
dealer told me that i can use it for 10 and half hours for to power my
computer only. from internet i came to know that one should not fully
discharge a battery. i till date only once i used it up to 9 1/2 hours. never
seen ‘battery low’ blinking any time till date. I always carefully kept the
water level full by regularly checking the level indicators. On an average i
use the battery up to 7 to 9 hrs these days because of big power cuts here
and see it charged fully immediately when power comes. One problem is
that if i use the battery for 9 hours then there has to be continuous power
supply for at least up to 8 hours(+minutes) to get fully recharged. but here
they are supplying power only on alternate hours. i.e, one hour power
supply – one hour power cut – one hour power supply. and that too during
the night only. during day time only for four hours power in given- morning
8to10 and evening 4to6. rest all day power cut. only in the past 3 months
power supply became like this. i have been forced to use my battery very
carefully and judiciously. My questions is will it affect my battery life by
leaving it to be charged in alternate hours?.(i don‘t use it during night
while being charged). i am really worried. we have abundant sunshine here.
so i am willing to explore the possibilities to charge it using a solar panel. i
want to know the maximum wattage or voltage should i supply to charge it
in the minimum amount of time possible. tell me this much wattage up to
this much hour. here we have 10~ hours of bright sunshine. please help.
Murugan
November 19, 2012 a 11:09 pm
Reply
It‘s okay if the battery is receiving charge during irregular intervals. It‘s not
the best situation, but it‘s not going to destroy the battery immediately.
The truth is, the battery is going to build sulfation when its in a discharged
state. Re-charging it will reverse this. That‘s good practice, but I
understand if your situation prevents you from doing that in the best way
possible.
If you‘re looking for solar charging, the largest panel I recommend you can
use to safely recharge the battery in the quickest time is a 900 Watt solar
panel. This will charge at a rate of 73 amps per hour (35% of battery
capacity). Less is fine, but no more for safe re-charging.
Tech
November 20, 2012 a 11:58 am
Reply
thank you very much indeed. Have a nice day back there.
Murugan
November 20, 2012 a 9:02 pm
Reply
(continued…)
I am using a 17 inch CRT monitor which consumes 80W power. Here in
India we use 220V Ac for our appliances.
Murugan
November 20, 2012 a 1:51 am
Reply
Is it possible a Low maintanance Lead Acid can charge and discharge
Simultanously ?
Nand
December 4, 2012 a 1:36 am
Reply
No. If you are charging a battery and then you use it at the same time, the
charger will attempt to supply the load. Depending what the load amount
is, and if the charger can supply it, the battery may be charged at a lower
rate or not at all and start discharging instead.
Tech
December 4, 2012 a 8:08 am
Reply
I purchased a used boat in 2009, it has 2 identical West Marine starter
batteries 650 CCA with a Perko 3 way switch, 1, 2 both or off). I‘ve never
charged these batteries other than while running my boat, which is
probably less than 50 hours per year. The engine is a 175HP Suzuki, with a
44 amp alternator. I feel like I‘m running on borrowed time and want to
replace these batteries with AGMs. Should I go with 2 starter type batteries
or 1 starter and 1 house? While boat is running is the alt charging both
battery at the same time or does it follow the path of the Perko switch?
Thanks, great site.
Andy
December 16, 2012 a 2:09 pm
Reply
Since the batteries will be connected together via switch, I recommend
using two of the same battery types and sizes. Therefore, if the batteries
are used to start the engine I recommend two starting batteries. I
recommend a deep cycle battery if you need 12v power while the engine is
off.
Tech
December 17, 2012 a 10:19 am
Reply
I use 4 – 12 volt dcm0035 interstate batteries hooked up to 48 volt
configuration to power my pedicab. I have 2 sets-8 batteries total. They
have had 11 months of being drained to approx 12 volts on the meter 3+
times a week. I use 2 noco gen 4 chargers. Mostly in the 10 amp
mode….but sometimes doubled up on one battery set. Weather conditions
from 35 – 110 F. How can I determine how much life is left? Besides the
obvious based on how long they run before being drained. It seems they
are at about 50% of new. Also…does my charger do a real 100% charge
Mike
December 17, 2012 a 7:34 pm
Reply
There is no magical formula to predict the length of life remaining in a
battery. Yes, the Gen 4 charger should bring the batteries to full charge
before entering the gentle float mode on/off cycle. 12.0v on the meter is
more than 50% discharge, which is more than we recommend for optimal
performance.
Tech
December 18, 2012 a 9:02 am
Reply
i have 4 batteries ps 1272 fs 12 volt 7.2 amp batteries were stolen how can
i wire theser my bike?
Ed
December 26, 2012 a 2:22 pm
Reply
Is your bike a 12v, 24v, or 48v electric motor?
Tech
December 28, 2012 a 8:32 am
Reply
i have 3 sb 12100-s 12 volt 10 amp batteries for my bike which were
stolen how do i wire the new ones?
Ed
December 26, 2012 a 2:29 pm
Reply
Is your bike have a 12v or 36v electric motor?
Tech
December 28, 2012 a 8:36 am
Reply
Hi,
Very informative article, thank you. I have a problem with my camper van,
24 volt system for the truck, 25 amp alternator, fridge in the house on the
truck that draws current from the 2 × 12 volt in series truck batteries.
When ignition is off, the fridge stop drawing current. However, the truck
batteries constantly run flat during driving, all well while I drive (diesel
truck), but next morning the truck batteries are almost flat. The camper
van house has it‘s own 12 volt battery, charged from solar, it performs OK.
Currently the 12 volt fridge element draws amps from the second 12 volt
truck battery, this implies that the fridge uses the power from the battery,
not directly from the alternator. Is it possible that the power outflow from
the battery is more than the charge inflow into the battery?. How many
Amps can a battery continuously take while charging?. I now think I must
tap the 24 volt directly from the alternator, then put it through a rectifier to
get 12 volt, and then onwards to the fridge. This will leave the truck
batteries free to charge at will without being drained by the fridge. If the
truck batteries can only charge at say 6 amps, while the fridge draws 10
amps, the current set up will always discharge and leave me with flat
batteries. Am I correct in my reasoning?. Please advise asap, Many thanks,
Louw
Louw Penni Ng
January 5, 2013 a 1:18 pm
Reply
There is no limit to what a battery can or cannot accept. A battery cannot
say ‘no’ to charge. However, there is a safe range, up to 25% of the battery
capacity, should be the max amperage charge rate. For a 50 AH battery,
that would be a max of 12.5 amps per hour. Alternators usually don‘t have
problems with overcharging, because of the electronic control unit.
It sounds to me like you have a 24 volt battery system, but a 12 volt
alternator. It seems like the fridge only takes 12 volts to run. What part of
your system actually draws from 24 volts?
Tech
January 7, 2013 a 9:02 am
Reply
RE; Can anyone please help? Scooter battery problem, will not take a
charge.
It appears that there may not be anything wrong with my batteries. I was
told that the batteries must be charged every month or two or sulfation
would set in. But the batteries not excepting a charge after 4 months was
concerning. With no answers I decided to drain the batteries of two
scooters by running the motors with the throttle on full and turning the
lights on. However after 5 hours of constant running the scooters meters
were still showing full and the volts where at 48.7 and my volt meter was
showing 48.6 volts. After 5 hour only dropped 2 volts while protection
shutoff is 42 volt. The next day I charged the batteries and yes they took a
good charge, 7 hours and still taking a charge when I left for the day (I
have them on a 12 hour timer). These Chaowei deep cycle gel batteries
must be very good with little self discharge to not except a charge for 4
months.
Garry Mcdonald
January 6, 2013 a 2:43 pm
Reply
I‘m glad your batteries are fine now. But for the future, it‘s not necessary
to discharge these batteries down. They are not like NiCD batteries, there
is no ‘memory effect’ or need to cycle charges. Batteries that are fully
charged for a 48v system should give you 51.2 volts or more.
Tech
January 7, 2013 a 9:08 am
Reply
Very Informative! (I assume 1 to be the highest rating). I have an ‘85 Ford
class C motorhome with 2-12v batteries. Not sure if they‘re connected in
series or parallel. It has a single alternator and a separate voltage
regulator. With the engine running, one battery reads 12.4v, the other
reads 16v. I assume this means the alternator is trying to charge this
battery more? I first thought the regulator was bad & replaced it. At that
time, one battery was reading 16.4v & the other 16.2. I discovered I had
bought the wrong regulator, so I bought a second one. It read 16v and
17v. I put the original regulator back in, leading to my assumption that one
battery won‘t hold a charge and the alternator/regulator is trying “harder”
to charge it. The batteries were in it when I bought it, but they‘re different
brands & I have no way of telling when either was purchased. Would my
assumption be correct, and should I replace the battery with the higher
voltage reading (or both)? What started this was when I bought the rv,
before driving home I turned on the headlights and one went out
immediately. I turned them off & the seller turned them back on & the
second headlight went out. I left it for him to fix. He replaced both
headlights. The first time I used them the new ones went out together. I
switched to high beam & after about 10 seconds they both went out. I
knew something was wrong & suspected the regulator first.
Mike Smith
January 12, 2013 a 4:48 pm
Reply
They do make 16 volt batteries and alternators. They are commonly found
in race cars. 16 volts is too high for a 12 volt system. You could be
overcharging your batteries.
Tech
January 14, 2013 a 10:36 am
Reply
I found the article SUPER helpful, because the guys at the auto parts store
we talked with did a few confusing things. One guy called a battery looking
like a 6-pack of soda cans a gel battery, where as the guy he called in for
more info called it AGM, which it probably actually is. However, the guy who
actually did know it was an AGM battery told us specifically that it wouldn‘t
have any problems if it was completely discharged…which sounded quite
attractive. We‘re still planning on purchasing the AGM batteries, but if I
hadn‘t found the web page and wised up on the great info and tips you
folks provided, we might have blithely followed his information and totally
killed our battery (sucksville!). Thanks for a great website!!!!!!!!
Adda Lamon
January 16, 2013 a 8:41 am
Reply
Sir I will be very thankful if you guide me to build a charger of a 4 volt Li
ion battery(which I have dismantled from my old laptop battery)……Thank
You.
Silas
January 17, 2013 a 8:42 am
Reply
We are unable to provide you the information you need. We are a reseller.
We do not build or manufacture any chargers.
Tech
January 17, 2013 a 9:14 am
Reply
THANK YOU!!!! The information on this page was GREAT!!! It is now my
“Go-To” reference for batteries!!!!
Ms. Safety
January 18, 2013 a 12:05 pm
Reply
Thanks for the compliment! :)
Tech
January 18, 2013 a 12:06 pm
Reply
Sir, I want to know a matter. When a 12V, 7.2AH rating battery is fully
charged, is there any current flow to the battery where the charger is still
plug in? and what is the actual voltage when the battery is fully charged?
Please ans. to me.
Thanks in advance.
Mizanur Rahaman
January 25, 2013 a 11:17 am
Reply
Whether or not current is going into the battery after being fully charges is
entirely dependant on the model charger you use and therefore I cannot
answer your question. Micro processor controlled chargers will ‘float’ a
battery after full charge. This is usually ~13.4 volts with little to no current.
However, if you want to know what resting voltage (off charger) on the
battery itself is considered full charge, please refer to this article for the
answer.
Tech
January 25, 2013 a 1:06 pm
Reply
Hi,
my husbands 650cc motorcycle wasn‘t turning over so we figured it was
the 12v battery. In order the check that it wasn‘t anything else we hooked
up my new smaller scooter 12v battery to his bike and got it running. Now
the scooter battery won‘t even turn the lights on the scooter even though
the voltage meter says its fully charged. Could we have damaged the
battery by using it in a different machine? The bikes take different size
batteries with different amps but both 12 volts.
thanks.
Nicki
February 2, 2013 a 7:17 pm
Reply
There should be no issue using a smaller 12 volt starting battery for the
motorcycle. I‘m surprised if the bike was able to start with a smaller
battery. If the battery is truly fully charged, can you provide a resting
voltage reading (bike off)?
Tech
February 4, 2013 a 1:18 pm
Reply
Sir, Thanks for the article. I Have a yacht with 4 Trojan T105‘s(6v – 2 in
series- paralleled X 2) as one bank and a truck and tractor battery as the
other bank. These are constantly charged by both solar panel and wind
generator ( through a regulator) and also charged when the motor is
running by alternator.
My question;- Can I replace these wet cells with AGM batteries without
changing any charging facilities? and if this is OK, do I replace them all
with dual purpose AGM‘s or do I have 2 different banks, 1 starting , 1 deep
cycle. I have a manual(idiot) switch, for selecting each battery bank or
both. My motor is a Ford Lees 85 HP deisel. Thanks in advance.
Reg Rayner
February 12, 2013 a 8:59 pm
Reply
Most AGM batteries require no special charging accommodations. I
recommend using deep cycle and starting batteries for their respective
purpose. That way, you‘re getting the best performance based on the
demand.
Tech
February 13, 2013 a 8:49 am
Reply
I have a Yamaha golf cart I purchased 4 yrs ago. Last winter I parked the
cart in my heated garage and did not recharge the batteries during the 3
1/2 month period. By spring the batteries were so discharged thatmy cart
charger would not work. I used a car battery charger to charge the 4 12V
batteries separately. I limped through last summer having to charge to cart
every 18 holes. I haave recently read about de sulfating the batteris. I was
thinking about trying this before I spring for new batteries. Can you
recommend a product to do this and if I can use the cart charger when
doing this or would I have to charge the batteries individually. Thanks for
the great article.
Jerry Anderson
February 17, 2013 a 9:50 am
Reply
I recommend using the liquid additive called BATTERY EQUALIZER and also
the PP48L ON-BOARD DESULFATOR by Pulse Tech.
Tech
February 18, 2013 a 8:58 am
Reply
Do you recommend a 2 battery solution for a boat? 1 for starting and 1 for
deep cycle? Or would a dual purpose battery be sufficient? The engine is a
90 hp outboard.
Donny
March 4, 2013 a 1:44 pm
Reply
We recommend using a dual battery setup versus the dual purpose
batteries. You get better performance for your needs this way (starting the
engine and running your electrical system).
Tech
March 5, 2013 a 9:14 am
Reply
Great Article. If I have a 80 Amp Hour battery and use a winch that is
drawing 435 Amps under load with a 90 Amp alternator on the vehicle,
how many minutes can I winch before I fully drain the battery or cause the
vehicle to turn off? What formula are you using?
Tim
March 16, 2013 a 6:54 am
Reply
Question, i have access to some lead acid batteries with much more life left
in them…..more than i need at any one time. I want to put some in
extremely long storage (5to10) yrs) Can i remove the electrolyte, flush
then store? I read somewhere after flush to refill with ph neutral water and
storing worked well. Another that after flushing used inert gas argon and
sealed battery vents. Not concerned with losing a little capacity as these
are very robust batterys. what would you recommend. I would charge these
fully then remove electrlolyte and store it properly until redeployment.
Sean
March 17, 2013 a 12:16 am
Reply
I have a 12v 100 amp hour wet cell battery at work. It was taken out in the
fall and put on a smart charger. Now I was going to reinstall it back into
our equipment. I noticed that the end with the negative post is swollen.
With a load test it passes at 9.5v‘s. no other physical damage is found on
the case. Could the one cell have pressured up and not vented?
John
March 19, 2013 a 9:50 am
Reply
It could have had some gassing at some point without actually damaging
the cell, as may be indicated by the continued performance.
Jeremy Fear
March 19, 2013 a 3:45 pm
Reply
Is it possible for a AGM battery to test 100% on a load test and still be
bad? My battery shows 12.8v unconnected. In the motorcycle it shows
12.6v and with the key on it drops to 12.1 and won‘t start the bike.
David
April 12, 2013 a 4:36 pm
Reply
Yes, it i s possible for it to have an internal ‘open’ in the cell. This happens
when a weld point begins to come loose in the battery and it is unable to
pass any significant current along the now thin connecting point.
Jeremy Fear
April 15, 2013 a 8:01 am
Reply
I need a battery for a lighting setup for artfair booth (outdoors).
I want to use 6 LED lights (14-watt Par30 bulb 3500K).
also use of a fan for cooling the booth.
which type of battery do you recommend.
Donna
April 30, 2013 a 5:55 am
Reply
I would recommend an AGM battery for this type of useage.
Jeremy Fear
May 6, 2013 a 7:48 am
Reply
I am battery deficient. I am charging a battery on trickle charge, I know
that much, but how do I know what the red and black bits on the charger
mean? And how long til it charges? My hubby used to do all this but alas he
is no longer here.
Thanks for input
Sandie
May 9, 2013 a 4:35 pm
Reply
I appologize, but I‘m not quite sure what you are reffering to by the ‘red
and black bits’. If you want to send me a photograph of the charger in
question, my email is tech@batterystuff.com, then I will be more than
happy to assist you from there.
Jeremy Fear
May 20, 2013 a 8:01 am
Reply
Hi.
I have 2 12 Volt batteries and want to use them both/ But i still want to use
them for 12 volts. I just want extra backup.
Please reply me anyone ASAP.
Pulkit
June 25, 2013 a 10:39 pm
Reply
Here is an article that explains the answer to your question. Should you
have any further questions please feel free to email our tech guys at
tech@batterystuff.com.
www.batterystuff.com/kb/aricles/battery-articles/battery-
bank-tutorial.html
Robin Brokaw
June 26, 2013 a 9:04 am
Reply
Brilliant article. Has really explained the internal working of various makes
of batteries, better than anything I have come across here in the U.K.
John
September 1, 2013 a 3:04 pm
Reply
What a well written article. Thank you!
My interest in the topic comes from wanting to maintain our trailer’s 12v
AGM battery over the winter. We brought it home and put it in the
basement workshop, but I discovered tonight that it was down to 10 volts.
I’d like to put it in the cold room where there’s an unused plug but was
worried about the “well ventilated area” instructions. The article says AGM
batteries are the safest type, so would it be safe to charge it in the cold
room? (10 × 4 × 7 feet, with top and bottom 4” pipe vents)
Larry
December 2, 2013 a 5:31 pm
Reply
Thanks for a very informative article. I own an older Honda Goldwing with
lots of electrical gizmos. I have replaced the battery twice in last year. My
dealer replaced the last under warranty about three months ago. The new
battery worked fine when I was driving the bike frequently. But after letting
the bike set for about two weeks I now have another dead battery. I
hooked up my trickle charger, it only has a light that tells me it is charging,
I left in on for about a week it did not recharge. I then hooked up my
battery charger, it tells me it the battery is fully charged at 6 volts. Does
this mean I have three bad cells? This is the second time this has
happened, the first new battery lasted about six months this one about
three. Do you think I got bad batteries. One I think maybe, but two in a row.
Harold
January 19, 2014 a 6:03 am
Reply
What are the electrodes and the electrolyte of an AGM battery????
Feterom Adolfo
March 10, 2014 a 3:19 am
Reply
During periodic check when I observe that water level is low, I add distilled
water to cells of lead acid battery. After a short time the fluid starts oozing
out from the caps. It continues for about 12 -15 hours. What is the cause
of this problem and how it can be rectified?
Athar
March 17, 2014 a 5:15 am
Reply
Best written, most through article I have read regarding batteries, thank
you!
I have a BMW with AGM battery that was just replaced. I purchased a CTEK
multi us 4.3 smart charger to lengthen the life of this new battery. I
attempted to charge 3 days after installation, but became concerned as the
charger was hot to the touch after 2 hours and still in the bulk charging
state. Should I be concerned by the heat? There was no indication of
anything awry other than the charger itself being hot.
Interestingly, the old battery never remained in the bulk charging state this
long and I never experienced the charger ever being warm.
Anders D
March 18, 2014 a 9:02 am
Reply
I would not be concerned if it is hot after 2 hours, but if it has not entered
into maintenance mode after 12 hours, I would check the battery to ensure
it is good.
Jeremy
May 12, 2014 a 11:56 am
Reply
Can you use a AGM battery by laying it on it’s side or must it be in the
upright position? If so, does it make any difference what side it lies on
(battery posts toward the top vs toward the bottom)
Dave M
April 5, 2014 a 7:34 pm
Reply
Dave, you can use an AGM in any position, except directly upside down.
Jeremy
May 12, 2014 a 12:21 pm
Reply
Sir Good day! i need with my newly bought gel battery, i dont know if i have
to add sulfuric acid… i used it with my u.p.s. and it cant five any power to
my computer when i unplug the power cable of the u.p.s.when i read the
power rating 12.5V i dont know the ampere since i dont have amp meter.
but in the battery it says 7Ah/10H. i thought it is better than my old VRLA
with 12V 4.5Ah rating
Marie
April 5, 2014 a 8:50 pm
Reply
Sounds like you should talk to the manufacturer. If its gell, then you
wouldn’t add any acid, and most cases if its AGM it would come prefilled.
The 7AH will last longer than the older 4.5AH one.
Jeremy
May 12, 2014 a 12:22 pm
Reply
With a BS in Chemical Technology and eperience with batteries, I
congratulate you for this article where expertise and general public
understanding are mixed in a state of the art level. Talking for shalow cycle
batteries where Ah has no sense because CCA matters people has to be
aware that this battery has to be fully charged, and if discharges only 20%
i.e below 12.6 V affects the life of the car battery. The status of battery has
to be checked every weak, while you check the cold inflation pressure of
the tire. To have a optimal inflated tire, means an optimal tire foot print i.e
an optimal tire grip. So at this time check the battery voltage in your car
parked overnight, start engine check again and you’l get 13.5 to 14.5 i.e.
this is the status of alternator and voltage regulator in your car. If not
using a vehicle use a battery tender that start charging at 12.6 V and stops
at 14.2 – 14.5 V. Not hapy with comercial battery tenders, I made my own
using a NE555 timer as precission comparator an more component. I can
adjust ON at 12.6 – 12.7V and of at 14.2 to 14.5 volts according to the
status (age ) of the battery. Increasing the battery voltage above 13.2 V,
starts equilizing process. The weak cealls continue to charge and the
strong start boiling. I do this proces at 250mA untill battery saturated, and
after turns OFf to let battery to relax. I never buy a maintenance free
battery, because I must check the electrolyte, level, top with H2O, and if
necessary check the density.
Sam
April 29, 2014 a 5:58 am
Reply
I have n ABM 12volts, 120AH battery and a Wet Cell 12volts ,120AH
battery can I connect both of them to my solar system in parallel
Frank Tucker
May 2, 2014 a 11:36 pm
Reply
We only recommend connecting batteries of same type, size, and age
together in a system.
Jeremy
May 12, 2014 a 11:58 am
Reply
But why are there no tech replies in 2014?
Jim Bigger
May 12, 2014 a 2:49 am
Reply
Jim,
Technical questions can be submitted using the “contact us” tab at the top
of the website. The comments for articles are not always reviewed by
Techs, so the best way to get an expedient answer to a question, is to
contact the correct department directly. Thanks
Jeremy
May 12, 2014 a 12:00 pm
Reply
We have a few 10 tonne dump trailers that are towed behind a few chev
2500 3/4 ton trucks (1 alternator)1 battery. Also towed by 2 ford 1 tons
which have dual batteries in them.
We are using deep cell wet batteries 175AH (D27’s) one battery in each
trailer. The batteries in the trailers only get a 1/2-1 hour charge from the 7
way trailer plug when they are ran to site and dumped. I don’t have the
amp draw of the “Dyna-Pack) electric/hydraulic motor/pump unit yet. It
takes 15-30 seconds to fully dump the trailer. The batteries don't seem to
last too long to these guys. The charge from the tow vehicle may be to low
as the voltage drop in the 12 or 14 ga. wire used in the typical trailer
tow package. I was thinking about wiring in #4 ga. from the font to the
rear trailer with a battery isolator so the trailer battery could receive a
better charge rate., specially if being dumped every hour or two and only
getting 1/2 or little more charge in between. Is it worth it $150 +
isolator. I can install and get reasonable pricing on wire & terminals etc.
Also what is the best battery to use as the trucks have different batteries in
each of them?? Good site for info I must add.
Randy
May 21, 2014 a 9:58 am
Reply
Randy, using an isolator will get better results. Thanks
Tech
May 21, 2014 a 12:37 pm
Reply
I had solar system, Know I want to add new set of batteries with old one
for charging purpose, both pared as 24V sets. 24V old set and 24v new
set. is this work or any problem, i will face during charging for solar panels.
or should i charge separtly and use dual purpose. Once charge new and
than Old.
In house for electric city,Should i combine both sets, or I use old to
discharge than switch to new for use.
Zareef
June 14, 2014 a 11:37 am
Reply
I would recommend charging separately. Mixing old and new batteries is
asking for trouble.
Tech
June 16, 2014 a 11:04 am
Reply
I have installed a few advanced GPS devices on a fleet of vehicles. The
manufactures paperwork says they should be wired into an output capable
of at least 13 volts. I have not had any problems with the devices on
vehicles with a normal 12 volt car battery and wonder if there would be any
possible problems if I wanted to install them on a recreational vehicle like a
Polaris ATV/Quad or a Side X Side with a 12 volt battery?
Tracy
June 26, 2014 a 12:50 pm
Reply
It should work fine, but always check with the manufacturer for a hard
answer.
Tech
June 27, 2014 a 8:48 am
Reply
I have a few questions on battery reconditioning, based on reading of
various How To and DIY sites, and hope that you are able to help: 1 – The
powder that everyone seems to suggest is Epsom salts, is that correct? 2 –
Is there a specific type of these Epsom salts that is appropriate? 3- What
are the mixing specs for the solution? Thanks a lot!

We would require more information about your situation. Please contact

one of our techs at tech@batterystuff.com.
ArieS
July 8, 2014 a 2:50 pm
Reply
I have a boat with a normal marine 12v lead acid battery I would also like
to add a second battery to provide for lets say a 12v access port for
accessories. Unfortunately I have limited space for a second full sized
battery. Could I use a smaller lets say ATV type twelve volt battery
connected through a dual battery charger relay isolator so that both would
charge when the motor is running but both would not drain when the
motor is not running.
We would require more information about your situation. Please contact
one of our techs at tech@batterystuff.com.
GarthJ
July 15, 2014 a 9:58 am
Reply
I have two 12v 100AH battery it is connected with IPS recently I see the
battery is very HOT & IPS Full Charge indicator not showing full charge. I
check Battery Water Level ok. Then I disconnect all battery from IPS 2 days
take time to cool the battery & after battery fully cold I connect it to IPS
but again the battery is very HOT. What is just happening Can you tell me
please.
My battery Name Lucas AP 100 12V 100AH 21 Plate made by Rahimafrooz
Bangladesh. Please give me the repply. Thanks
Saiful Haque Khan
Bangladesh
saiful6848@gmail.com
+8801716579824
We would require more information about your situation. Please contact
one of our techs at tech@batterystuff.com
Md. Saiful Haque Khan
July 18, 2014 a 1:06 pm
Reply
We have a John Deer Gator (riding toy)for our Granddaughter. The
connection for the battery has corroded down inside. Is there a safe way to
clean it out? It is a very tight area.
Laura Hargis
July 23, 2014 a 12:35 pm
Reply
Baking soda and water, but not in the battery!, just for the terminals and
connections.
Admin
August 15, 2014 a 2:14 pm
Reply
Thank you for some great info. We have a travel trailer that we have parked
at a camp area on the back the farm. It hasn’t moved since we bought it 5
years ago. We charge the battery with a Honda 3000 generator. After many
years of frustration using a flood cell deep cycle battery we just installed a
AGM battery. (I believe we brought the charge down on the batteries too
far, too often). Anyway we just bought the AGM battery because we
understand it will charge much quicker than a flood cell. My question is
using this type generator on a trailer, will that work for a AGM or should we
do anything different for charging?
Thanks again.
T-Man
August 16, 2014 a 11:39 am
Reply
If AGM batteries aren’t damaged by a car’s alternator charger why do they
need a special charger?
Maurice
August 23, 2014 a 6:45 pm
Reply
They really only need a specific charger if they are being maintained long
term with a constant charger. The exception is specialty AGMs such as
Odyssey batteries or aircraft batteries.
Tech
August 25, 2014 a 2:36 pm
Reply
Hi, I bought a sailboat with 2 batteries and a selector which reads
off/1/both/2
My question is about what you say about batteries being the same size,
rating and type. Of the 2 that came with the boat, #1 is a reg. acid starting
battery and #2 is a deep cycle used as a house battery. Is that bad? should
I avoid the “both” position of the selector?
Joel
September 4, 2014 a 10:31 am
Reply
Good Question! The selector switch is designed to get the boat out of a bad
situation, say for instance you were unable to start the boat. This enables
you to bank the other battery together in such situation to get the boat
going again. You do want to avoid tying them toghether unless your are in
a problematic situation.
Tech
September 12, 2014 a 12:37 pm
Reply
Great article, easy to understand and informative. I have a few questions
about my RV battery cables. I was about to replace the 2 12v marine
batteries on my RV with 2 6v deep cycles, when I realized the cable
situation seems strange and possibly scary.
- The ends of the cables, for about a foot before the terminal connectors,
are all taped up and homemade. Should I be concerned about that? – How
do I know if they’re an appropriate size for the battery size? – There is a
thin black ground wire coming from the taped up part of the + cable, which
is bolted to the trailer frame. Why would the + cable be grounded? Isn’t
that what the – cable is for?!
The 2 cables that were used to connect the 12v batteries in parallel are
also of this taped-up homemade variety. I was going to use one of them to
connect the 6v in series, but now am unsure whether I should use ANY of
these cables at all. Wiring in new cables seems really daunting because I
can’t see an obvious way to access where they run up into the bottom of
the trailer. But I don’t want to be unsafe, so…
Thanks in advance :)
Kyla
September 5, 2014 a 3:17 pm
Reply
I would talk to your local RV Service Center if you feel the homemade
cables are questionable. If you plan on rewiring the the connections to
replace the existing cables we recommend staying with the same gauge
wire that originally came with your RV. Obviously the last foot or so you
said is homemade, so you would want to look further up to see what size
the original cable is. If your changing charger, converter, or inverter (or an
all in one) then we recommend you look to that manufacturer for
recommendation.
TECH
September 25, 2014 a 9:48 am
Reply
A BMW 128i w/AGM BATTERY—-CAN IT BE REPLACED W A QUALITY WET
CELL BATTERY?
THANKS—
WILLIE
September 16, 2014 a 2:22 pm
Reply
If your existing battery is a WET cell then you can use an AGM. However if
your original battery was a GEL then you would have to contact BMW to
verify that your charging system will charge and AGM as they charge at a
higher rate.
TECH
September 25, 2014 a 11:11 am
Reply
Wow…thankyou for existing. We are beginning to get a solar set up
organised for free camping and I have a plethora of questions that
hopefully you can answer for me. We intend to run a 12v52 litre fridge and
strips of led lights. What do I need to know about these applicances when
planning the battery set up. We are looking at a 12v 260 AH AGM battery
using a 140W solar panel to charge. Would one battery be enough or
should we look at two – the fridge needs to run most of the time but the led
lights would be just at night. If we did get two what is the difference
between wiring in series and in parallel ….is one way better than the
other?? And I need reminding … In paralel is it positive to posiive and neg
to neg.. Thank you so much for your time and expertise……cheers Suz
from Oz
Suz
September 20, 2014 a 4:12 am
Reply
Suz I would suggest reading our article: Solar Systems the Right Way. This
will help you gather the proper information to determine if your panel and
battery setup would be sufficient. As far a series vs parallel I suggest
looking at our article: Battery Bank Tutorial – Series and Parallel. This
article will show you possibilities of creating different type of battery
banks, and maybe the possibility of going to two 6 volts batteries for less
than two 12 volts batteries would be for the same Amp/Hr capacity.
TECH
September 26, 2014 a 12:44 pm
Reply
Fantastic article though I admit even the laymans terms seems to go over
my head. I live in the UK and have a QUICKIE Jive Midwheel drive
wheelchair made by Sunrise Medical which uses 2 × 12volt 70 amp
sonneschein GEL Batteries I Have a 8amp Gel battery charger but in the 27
months I have owned the chair I’ve had to have 4 sets of replacement
batteries as they fail after 6 months apparently ( according to the
manufacturer) because of a faulty Cell. I have followed the manufacturers
guidelines with charging the battery, which states as soon as you’ve
finished using the chair put it on charge. . Though I often wait about 5
hours to put the chair on charge. I do this and then leave it. So the chair
gets between 13 & 18 hours charge even if I have done only 5 miles, which
is my about my average daily use. Should I put the chair on charge straight
away the leave it alone even If I need it? I have my manual wheelchair to
get about in inside my house. Any help to prolong the battery life is greatly
appreciated. I have repeatedly asked both Sunrise medical & sonneschein
for help over the past 2 years with n how to alleviate this problem but have
had no reply.
Mike Coshan
November 19, 2014 a 2:16 am
Reply
I would definitely not leave the batteries sitting in a discharged state, plus
it is never recommended to discharge a battery more than 50% so if your 5
mile run does this then that could be affecting the batteries life. If you are
not running them below 50% then I would look to the charger, and be sure
it is at least a 3 stage charger, anything less is not recommended for those
size batteries. Feel free to contact our Tech Department for assistance.
Tech
November 19, 2014 a 2:56 pm
Reply
Hi, I have been getting a headache with all the conflicting advice on my
current and planned dual battery setup. I have a 105 Landcruiser with 4.2
diesel and standard 110 amp alternator. I have a dual battery system with
a Delkor 27HR-70 Calcium and a brand new Optima Blue Top D27M AGM
(replaced the other Delkor which died) as the secondary battery for
running utilities (fridge etc). They are parallel connected through a RedArc
100 amp isolator. I also have a RedArc 120W portable solar setup to assist
with powering for extended camping etc.
Firstly, is this current setup likely to damage Optima through lack of
charging output. And if so would an in car BC/DC charger resolve the
issue.
Secondly, as I am not sure of the age / condition of the Delkor I am
thinking of replacing it with a new Optima Yellow Top D27F. Would this
make my current setup sufficient? Or is the standard 110 amp alternator
still not up to fully charging the AGM’s?
Would really appreciate some feedback and guidance
Cheers

We would require more information about your situation. Please contact

one of our techs at tech@batterystuff.com.
Darren
October 3, 2014 a 7:56 pm
Reply
Thank you so much for writing this. I am certainly going to give to my
husband to read and for reference. I just purchased a yamaha 36v golf cart
that needs new batteries. There are 6 each, 6 volts batteries, which would
you suggest?
thank you !
Stella
October 14, 2014 a 8:09 am
Reply
We carry some of the best Golf Cart batteries available. Any of the batteries
listed in our Golf Cart Section would be recommended.
Tech
November 18, 2014 a 10:39 am
Reply
The rating reflects how many amps you can pull from that battery over a
specific period of time. In general the ratings goes down the quicker you
pull a load out of a battery, so a 200AH 10 Hr rated battery will have a
higher capacity than a 200AH 20 Hr rated battery.
Tech
November 18, 2014 a 11:30 am
Reply
please, am a little confused. whats the difference between a 200ah 20hr
rated battery and a 200ah 10hr rated battery. am trying to buy a deep
cycle battery and i see 10hr on one and 20hr on the other. which one is
better?
Earthrealm
October 16, 2014 a 2:46 am
Reply
Great article. However, it seems that no matter how many articles I read on
batteries, I can’t seem to grasp a full understanding of how it all works.
And I say that because 6 years ago I purchased a highly modified EZ-GO
golf cart that I use to get around the woods of southwestern Pa. year
round. Our temps run in the high 80’s in the summer to the mid teens in
the winter, and at times lower. I have a 48-volt system using 8 six volt
T-105’s and a smart charger for the cart, and for my headlights and winch
a separate vehicle 12-volt battery. Now, I’ve read that I should not
discharge my flooded T-105’s below 50%, but in all honesty, that is at
times impossible to do. The woods are not that short in places, and at
times…well mud is mud and you can’t predict it. However, I always check
my water levels…they seem to remain a constant…and I always clean my
terminals monthly, even if they don’t seem to need it. Your suggestions of
using grease is great and I will do that on my next cleaning session. Now, I
have installed a new Warn winch and I winch my cart on and off my truck. I
currently have one 12-V auto battery in the cart, but I am concerned that I
may be “out there” and the 12-V simply run out of charge. So, what I have
been thinking of is replacing the one 12-V with two 12-volts and wiring
them to still have a 12-volt output, but have a longer output “time” if you
understand what I’m saying. I have enough room under the cart seat for
the average width of a car battery, and about 24” in length. What type of
batteries would you suggest would work the best in my situation?
DaveT
October 18, 2014 a 10:18 am
Reply
Dave I would recommend our Calculator | Sizing a 12 Volt Battery to a
Load to really determine your need. If you have further questions I would
suggest contacting our Tech Department.
Tech
November 18, 2014 a 11:53 am
Reply
Im a designer/installer and have read literally hundreds of guides and
tutorials over the years and none are a patch on this – hats off, you’re
brilliant – and crazy helpful to have provided answers to every question
posted here individually, for free, despite you having already answered
99% of them in your other excellent articles!
People, don’t be lazy, sure this guy has a life so read ALL the FREE guides
provided for you here before asking. Big respects
Dean
November 20, 2014 a 11:09 am
Reply
I am in the process of upgrading my solar electricity in my house and need
information regarding what electrical appliances 8 AGM batteries will be
able to power. I already have a solar panel array in place that is powering a
solar water pump very effectively. I suppose I need to tell you the amount
of watts the panel produces but do not have that info. at this time. Is it
likely that I can replace my propane frig. with an electric refrigerator, run
power tools without the generator on, etc.?
Thank you!
Sandra
Kanzi
November 8, 2014 a 9:00 am
Reply
As solar is basically a math problem I would suggest reading our article
Solar Systems The Right Way as a start, or Contact Our TECH Department
for further assistance. Please be aware that we are not home solar experts,
and it might be best to contact a local home solar expert.
Tech
November 19, 2014 a 11:58 am
Reply
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